MrBRulzOK
Wade Wilson
Mr No-Pants Heathen
Something Witty Here.
Posts: 26,719
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Post by MrBRulzOK on Oct 15, 2009 15:29:27 GMT -5
Yeah? I thought Shawn was selling it pretty hard... in the match, with his back, and verbally by talking about how he'd gotten his ass kicked all over the place last night. And Trips, from what I hear, was barely in the match, except to save Shawn at the last minute. Did I misinterpret all that stuff? I don't know, that seemed like selling to me. Nah, you're probably right on that account. Now that you mention it, I do recall Michaels selling somewhat, aside from entrance wise. But still... one team had to have one of their members taken out on the stretcher, while the other two guys are just out there the next night. Just seems a little strange if you ask me.
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Post by Mayonnaise on Oct 15, 2009 15:37:26 GMT -5
Yeah? I thought Shawn was selling it pretty hard... in the match, with his back, and verbally by talking about how he'd gotten his ass kicked all over the place last night. And Trips, from what I hear, was barely in the match, except to save Shawn at the last minute. Did I misinterpret all that stuff? I don't know, that seemed like selling to me. Yeah, some what. They talked about how bad they got their asses kicked but, didn't show it. You can talk all you want but, unless it looks like you got your ass handed to you, unless you show it, it is empty talk and, that is what it seemed like to me. But, I think they got Legacy over. I think Legacy is the only act to get over on RAW since the draft. Miz has been yo-yo'ed and still looks weak, IMO, MVP was given a shot at Orton and fell in a black hole when Shane O'Mac arrived, Mark Henry was over huge when he got there and was turned into Markswoggle and is in the black hole with MVP, Swagger hasn't done jack but, look stupid by letting Orton win and not doing jack since, Kofi has there but, not used well at all and, Bourne is he still with WWE? Of all those, only, Legacy has gotten over, IMO, and they are the only ones to work with DX.
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Post by don on Oct 15, 2009 15:59:24 GMT -5
This heat happens with so much frequency and in such grave tones, its starting to sound like a medical condition. *In a medical office, HBK and HHH wait nervously. The doctor enters.* Dr: Gentlemen, I'm afraid the news isn't good. Based on our tests, it appears that both of you have developed... backstage heat. *both gasp* HHH: That can't be, we... we put over Legacy at Breaking Point, allowed them to have a good showing at Hell in a Cell... HBK: We haven't even been in the WWE title scene in months. Dr: I'm afraid that's not had much of an effect. While it hasn't become nuclear from what we can understand on your domination of Raw in the past year has caused the heat to expand and become more solidified. HBK: Oh god. What can we do? Dr: Well, based on my professional opinion, the best possible treatment at the moment is for both of you to lose in singles matches clean... on a PPV. HHH: Out of the question. Both of us need to start gearing up for Wrestlemania soon. Dr: Mr Helmsley, this is a serious issue which needs to be addressed. If not treated now, within six months both of you can expect cryptic, resentful comments on Twitter by the Raw roster, and at least one bitter shoot interview and/or TNA appearance by a released talent by next spring. Is that what you want? *both Triple H and Shawn sigh* Dr.: Look, both consider yourselves lucky. I have one patient who's been dealing with considerable heat problems for the last few years. *Cut to CM Punk in an MRI* Punk: So you think this will be my last time in here? Nurse: We can only hope so, Mr. Punk. We can only hope so. That was awesome. ;D
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Post by wrestlecrapcrap on Oct 15, 2009 16:12:05 GMT -5
It's simply undeniable that Cody and Ted have been pushed. They were Orton's lackeys and nothing more until the handicap victory over HHH, when they sort of went away from helping Orton for a few months and concentrated on their own feud. They got a decisive victory over DX, which was not presented as a fluke but rather it was raising the question as to whether they would end DX for good. Ted has now pinned the WWE champion, while Cody is representing Team Raw at Bragging Rights. The object of that feud has been to make Cody and Ted legit. The object is the Cena/Miz feud was to feed Miz to Cena who had nothing to do that month while giving Miz a try out to see if he could get the heat for it to mean anything if Cena beat him. He did, and now he's getting his push. HHH/MVP was simply to keep HHH looking strong. It was not intended to 'make' MVP in the sense that Cena made Swagger look good. Maybe MVP was over in his own right but I guess they decided that it was between Kofi and MVP for the spot and they went Kofi's way. I'd think certainly that MVP was next in line if Kofi ever has time off for whatever reason. Yes, they did get a victory over DX, a submission victory at that. But at the following PPV, not only did they lose, but both Ted and Cody got laid out following the match, the latter so badly that he had to be taken out on a stretcher. Meanwhile the next night, Shawn and Triple H aren't even SELLING the aftermath of the cell match. And speaking of that Legacy/Triple H handicap match, which should have meant something, it was instead treated basically as no big deal with Triple H cutting a promo immediately afterward that kind of damped the effects of their win. Was there any real need for him to cut a promo directly after that match? Why not wait until later on and have him do a similar promo backstage? Cena/Miz granted they did remedy somewhat following the PPV. But again, looking back to the buildup... Miz had done next to nothing to get an advantage over Cena. Why were we to care about a match that you knew Miz had no choice in winning? They even had a perfect opportunity to do something by having him eliminate Cena in a battle royale from behind. Cena would've not been any less over and Miz would have at least gotten somewhat of a victory over him. Instead, he was treated like a joke and easily dumped to the outside and only moments later Triple H dumped Cena out anyway. So really... what would've been the difference between Miz eliminating Cena and then getting dumped himself by Trips? As for MVP/Triple H, yeah Triple H should have won the match, but there was no need for him to win with basically one move and pretty much bury poor MVP. Again, back to the Cena/Miz match on that same night. Miz was made to look pretty competent against him in the match, especially compared to the first encounter. Why couldn't have Triple H had a similar bout with MVP, though perhaps to a lesser extent. Legacy have got over as a result of working with DX. It still can't be denied and you haven't provided any argument against it, just your personal preference of what you think should have happened. It doesn't hide the fact that Legacy are more legit than they were before working with them. The crowd knows it, and they have just main evented a PPV. People got far too defensive of the promo HHH cut after the loss. He was doing DX comedy, and at the same time admitted he wasn't good enough to handle them by himself. There's nothing wrong with that, again it's just people's personal preference that they would have done something different, but in reality it didn't harm the eventual feud with Legacy one bit. The Miz/Cena feud was supposed to be a learning curve for Miz. The first night, he gets his ass kicked. The next night, he learns a bit more, and actually has the upper hand on Cena. Then he realises that he needs to get more serious and becomes a singles champion. Where's the problem here? The MVP/HHH match had MVP pretty much get all the offence on HHH. It was a standard match. If they had booked it another way, namely HHH getting MORE offence in on HHH (which you seem to be suggesting by bemoaning the fact that he won with one move) then people would moan that instead of MVP getting in offence, that he got his ass handed to him for the majority of the match and then lost anyway. As it was he hit a desperation move. It was a TV match, they didn't have a lot of time but done what they could. And anyhoo, the match wasn't about establishing MVP, it was about getting HHH into the title match. When people are supposed to be established, it will happen. The time comes, but you can't push everyone all the time and you can't 'make' someone every night or suddenly so it means nothing. There has to be an arc. MVP's time will come, and if it doesn't, it's because someone else is doing better than he is at engaging the crowd.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Oct 15, 2009 17:50:40 GMT -5
Yeah, there's a word for this. Rhymes with Shark Date. Clark Hate?
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Post by Confused Mark Wahlberg on Oct 15, 2009 17:55:23 GMT -5
This really isn't 'heat'...at least not with management. I DEMAND A REFUND! REFUND... DENIED!
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Mozenrath
FANatic
Foppery and Whim
Speedy Speed Boy
Posts: 121,125
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Post by Mozenrath on Oct 15, 2009 17:58:30 GMT -5
This is fantastic for Torch's credibility.
What's next, Punk has heat for not sharing his 12 pack of Pepsi with Undertaker? Zack Ryder has heat for not deciding whether or not to wear pant legs?
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Post by Metalheadbanger Man on Oct 15, 2009 18:04:53 GMT -5
In other news Paul Burchill has heat for 'being from the same country as William Regal'...
Primo has heat for 'being from the same family as Carlito'...
...and finally Tyler Reks has heat because 'Vince doesn't know what surfing is'.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Oct 15, 2009 19:52:28 GMT -5
I personally would say this falls more to the writers than it does to DX - they did at least make Legacy way more credible in a very short period of time than they have ever been, while it's the writers who have stubbornly done Cena / Orton for five PPVs in a row rather than elevate guys like Mark Henry or Kofi who are at the very least over enough to warrant a filler title match.
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MrBRulzOK
Wade Wilson
Mr No-Pants Heathen
Something Witty Here.
Posts: 26,719
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Post by MrBRulzOK on Oct 15, 2009 20:24:53 GMT -5
Yes, they did get a victory over DX, a submission victory at that. But at the following PPV, not only did they lose, but both Ted and Cody got laid out following the match, the latter so badly that he had to be taken out on a stretcher. Meanwhile the next night, Shawn and Triple H aren't even SELLING the aftermath of the cell match. And speaking of that Legacy/Triple H handicap match, which should have meant something, it was instead treated basically as no big deal with Triple H cutting a promo immediately afterward that kind of damped the effects of their win. Was there any real need for him to cut a promo directly after that match? Why not wait until later on and have him do a similar promo backstage? Cena/Miz granted they did remedy somewhat following the PPV. But again, looking back to the buildup... Miz had done next to nothing to get an advantage over Cena. Why were we to care about a match that you knew Miz had no choice in winning? They even had a perfect opportunity to do something by having him eliminate Cena in a battle royale from behind. Cena would've not been any less over and Miz would have at least gotten somewhat of a victory over him. Instead, he was treated like a joke and easily dumped to the outside and only moments later Triple H dumped Cena out anyway. So really... what would've been the difference between Miz eliminating Cena and then getting dumped himself by Trips? As for MVP/Triple H, yeah Triple H should have won the match, but there was no need for him to win with basically one move and pretty much bury poor MVP. Again, back to the Cena/Miz match on that same night. Miz was made to look pretty competent against him in the match, especially compared to the first encounter. Why couldn't have Triple H had a similar bout with MVP, though perhaps to a lesser extent. Legacy have got over as a result of working with DX. It still can't be denied and you haven't provided any argument against it, just your personal preference of what you think should have happened. It doesn't hide the fact that Legacy are more legit than they were before working with them. The crowd knows it, and they have just main evented a PPV. People got far too defensive of the promo HHH cut after the loss. He was doing DX comedy, and at the same time admitted he wasn't good enough to handle them by himself. There's nothing wrong with that, again it's just people's personal preference that they would have done something different, but in reality it didn't harm the eventual feud with Legacy one bit. The Miz/Cena feud was supposed to be a learning curve for Miz. The first night, he gets his ass kicked. The next night, he learns a bit more, and actually has the upper hand on Cena. Then he realises that he needs to get more serious and becomes a singles champion. Where's the problem here? The MVP/HHH match had MVP pretty much get all the offence on HHH. It was a standard match. If they had booked it another way, namely HHH getting MORE offence in on HHH (which you seem to be suggesting by bemoaning the fact that he won with one move) then people would moan that instead of MVP getting in offence, that he got his ass handed to him for the majority of the match and then lost anyway. As it was he hit a desperation move. It was a TV match, they didn't have a lot of time but done what they could. And anyhoo, the match wasn't about establishing MVP, it was about getting HHH into the title match. When people are supposed to be established, it will happen. The time comes, but you can't push everyone all the time and you can't 'make' someone every night or suddenly so it means nothing. There has to be an arc. MVP's time will come, and if it doesn't, it's because someone else is doing better than he is at engaging the crowd. I'm not saying that you should try and push everyone, because then you start to get to dangerous levels of where nobody is a star because they're all treated as equals, so nobody stands out. However, I also believe that you can still push people without burying others. Now granted, I will give you that the Miz/Cena storyline did make a bit of sense. However, the following third match where if he lost he'd be banished for RAW... and Summerfest. Of course, that didn't really do much for his credibility afterwards. And I seem to recall another match in which Miz was made to look like an utter fool in another match where he tapped out almost immediately to the STFU. This may have been due to timing issues, but still... after having him do so much better before, did they really need to make him look so weak afterwards? Me thinks not. As for the Triple H/MVP match, like I said, Trips won with basically ONE MOVE. How is that supposed to make him come across as strong? If anything it makes his victory come off as nothing more than a fluke and MVP come off as a jobber. True, the one move was his finisher, but still... And the problem about Triple H's promo is simple. COMEDY IN WRESTLING DOES NOT SELL PAY PER VIEWS. Nobody is paying to see Paul Levesque's fun time variety hour. Just look back a few years ago when Triple H was constantly cracking jokes even before the whole DX reunion and how adamantly most people frowned upon it. Comedy is fine for throw away segments and all, but when you're supposed to make your opponents come off as threats, ha ha comedy does not exactly help them come across as such. Maybe some of this is personal preference, but that's just my feelings on the subject.
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Big L
Grimlock
Posts: 13,883
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Post by Big L on Oct 15, 2009 20:38:57 GMT -5
So I guess we have these two to blame for the fact that RAW is staler than year old bread these days. Suppose I'm not surprised by this revelation, though I would think Triple H has more to do with it then Michaels. totally agree!
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Post by El Cokehead del Knife Fight on Oct 15, 2009 21:27:10 GMT -5
*Cut to CM Punk in an MRI* Punk: So you think this will be my last time in here? Nurse: We can only hope so, Mr. Punk. We can only hope so. That isn't teh heatz, that's just a minor case of firecrotch.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Oct 15, 2009 22:33:44 GMT -5
How can DX have heat? Seriously, they seem to dish out heat across the WWE Universe like twin suns. They never get heat themselves... just everyone ends up pissing them off ;D
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Post by southsider on Oct 15, 2009 22:47:57 GMT -5
I personally would say this falls more to the writers than it does to DX - they did at least make Legacy way more credible in a very short period of time than they have ever been, while it's the writers who have stubbornly done Cena / Orton for five PPVs in a row rather than elevate guys like Mark Henry or Kofi who are at the very least over enough to warrant a filler title match. ever think that they are working together so much because they don't want to put anyone else over? hey, just going with the theme of the "story"
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Dirty Hazy
Hank Scorpio
Pictured Above: The Future Mrs. Hazy
Posts: 5,008
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Post by Dirty Hazy on Oct 16, 2009 2:30:40 GMT -5
Let the pig roasting begin!
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Post by Ryushinku on Oct 16, 2009 3:02:09 GMT -5
They've got so much heat, they need Radaway!
...I'll see myself out.
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Post by Perpetual Nirvana on Oct 16, 2009 3:13:44 GMT -5
*Cut to CM Punk in an MRI* Punk: So you think this will be my last time in here? Nurse: We can only hope so, Mr. Punk. We can only hope so. That isn't teh heatz, that's just a minor case of firecrotch. Well he is dating Lita.
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