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Post by Can you afford to pay me, Gah on Dec 6, 2009 0:45:23 GMT -5
I just don't get how you can give up on Swagger. I mean he was doing great on ECW. His mic skill was getting better and better on ECW and he is a good worker. How can WWE just give up on pushing a guy. HHH didn't become a star over night. Neither did Cena. You gotta push them where you want to go and build it. Had they I don't know use Swagger right like making him US champion. Give him a couple good feuds like against Kofi. He could been MEing by next years Summerslam. Which the WWE needs another ME heel on Raw.
Now do the same thing they did Kofi to a lot of guys it will work. Give a guy a good Mid card title run and feud. Then a good ME push after that with a pin over a MEer. Boom fans are going to start reacting to them.
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Post by DSR on Dec 6, 2009 1:01:26 GMT -5
In Escobar's case, it was a mistake putting him in with Vickie from the start. How's the guy supposed to get any heat from the crowd when Vickie's stealing it? As for Melina, is it that time of year again already? They expected him to get Heat But Vickie Heat is so Big,it sucks all the Heat he was gaining Actually, it wasn't even like Vickie was stealing the guy's heat. They saddled him with her, expecting the audience's hatred for her to get him over as a heel through osmosis, or something. Problem is, they give him absolutely NOTHING on his own that would make him hateable (they let him get his ass beat by Jimmy Wang Yang, of all people, but that just made him look boring, not evil). Now, on Friday, he sounded pretty natural on the mic (though he wasn't given much of a script to work with) and he looked actually competitive for a change. Why they didn't try to debut him as a face, I just don't know. I'm not convinced yet, but I'm certainly paying more attention than when he was just "Vickie's boyfriend."
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Post by Nic Nemeth on Dec 6, 2009 1:17:03 GMT -5
Escobar is actually better as a face, from what I saw on Friday.
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Bub (BLM)
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Fed. Up.
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Post by Bub (BLM) on Dec 6, 2009 1:23:53 GMT -5
Escobar is actually better as a face, from what I saw on Friday. Your opinion is irrelevant. They lost faith in you last week.
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Dub H
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Post by Dub H on Dec 6, 2009 1:26:02 GMT -5
Vince: Now go there,have some matchs,applies this finisher SCREW IF YOU THINK ITS LAME,and if you dont get over in some weeks of doingonly some matchs,YOU GETTING FIRED!
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Post by casualobserver on Dec 6, 2009 2:43:34 GMT -5
Shocker. WWE doesn't understand long term building of wrestlers.. Oh really? What about what they're doing with Sheamus? Oh wait, I just proved your point. ;D
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Professor Chaos
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Bringer of Destruction and Maker of Doom
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Post by Professor Chaos on Dec 6, 2009 6:24:15 GMT -5
Best thing to happen to the WWE would be for TNA to take off so they can build the guys up and WWE can take them when they're ready. That's how they were always so awesome to begin with. When you've got no real competition you've gotta build everyone up yourself and that doesn't seem to work too well for them. Ain't like the old days when you can just sign a Flair, Austin, Jericho, Luger and instantly put them in the main event cause of their insta-cred.
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mrjl
Fry's dog Seymour
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Post by mrjl on Dec 6, 2009 8:56:04 GMT -5
Esssssscobar hasn't even won a match clean yet. all of his wins have been by roll up, roll up by way of interference by vicki or throwing them into the ring post. It's not a good sign when a guy who's been debuted for around 4 weeks doesn't even have a freakin finisher! ..Well..not it's much..but..he did beat Jimmy Wang Yang. ..Um..on Superstars. His finisher is like..a dropkick. ..Yeaah. it was a running front dropkick to a kneeling opponent. Similar to when a crusierweight rolls through a sunset flip and puts both feet in his opponents face, a move I've often felt should be good for some pinfalls.
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Christianv2
Dennis Stamp
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Post by Christianv2 on Dec 6, 2009 12:16:21 GMT -5
This has become the most ludicrous thing as of late... it'd be a smaller list to say the names of the people they DO have faith in compared to the ones they lost faith in.
Who they have faith in: HHH Shamers Cena Kofi
Who they lost faith in: Every single other wrestler/staff/announcer/employee in WWE
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Post by The Peoples Elbow on Dec 6, 2009 13:46:26 GMT -5
Ok, I can understand Escobar, but I gotta call smarkbait on Melina. There's no way in hell.
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H-Fist
Hank Scorpio
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Post by H-Fist on Dec 6, 2009 14:31:35 GMT -5
From what I could tell with the Vickie/Escobar thing, the crowd pretty much no sold the face turn other than the one-liners. No heat on the handicap match. No heat on the Hart Dynasty for winning. No real desire for Double E to fire up. He was a better face than heel, but that's not saying much, in the ring. The problem is partly that no one cared about him when he was a heel, so the face turn is another "whatever" on top of the original apathy. The lines he delivered were okay, and his delivery was better than his heel stuff, but again...just passable. It struck me as being over-the-top Rosie Perez head-bobbing, finger-waving stereotypical Latino thing. I'm not saying he needs to be homogenized away from his ethnicity; but rather, his delivery needs to be a bit more believable and less over-the-top.
Maybe pulling Vickie out of the picture and letting him form a team with a "traded-for" Primo to feud with the Harts would be a good thing for the brand. It would be a fair chance for Escobar to get over without being forced down fans' throats.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 6, 2009 14:35:17 GMT -5
Escobar is actually better as a face, from what I saw on Friday. Your opinion is irrelevant. They lost faith in you last week. Yeah but they lost faith in YOU about two hours ago
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Krimzon
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Post by Krimzon on Dec 6, 2009 15:22:04 GMT -5
Move him to ECW. Change his name to Tyler Reks. Can the original Tyler Reks. Nobody would notice.
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metylerca
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Post by metylerca on Dec 6, 2009 16:48:03 GMT -5
Is there proof of this outside of "reportedly"?
I mean, I could just fabricate a news report to say WWE has lost faith in John Morrison and people would bite.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 6, 2009 16:54:23 GMT -5
I dunno, I try not to think about things like this so much. As fans, we're going to look at the wrestlers and think, "This guy should be pushed because he's a good wrestler/is exciting/has a good look/ is a company guy/ has been there for so long" and etc. but WWE has their own reasons for pushing people. A lot of it might be, simply, who has the drive to try to get themselves pushed, who works well with others, who has a personality that will get them noticed to writers, agents, bookers, veterans, et.al.
Someone like Kenny from the Spirit Squad looked like he was going to be the breakout member of that group, he seemed to have the skills for it but, then, you hear from a bunch of people that he wasn't well liked and had his issues and where is he now?
Who would've thought that Nicky, of all people, in that group wouldn't stayed around the longest? Who knows, his personality around others might be the reason why. The most talented people in any profession are not necessarily the most successful, it's just how things work out.
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Krimzon
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Post by Krimzon on Dec 6, 2009 16:59:45 GMT -5
Is there proof of this outside of "reportedly"? I mean, I could just fabricate a news report to say WWE has lost faith in John Morrison and people would bite. No we would not. John Morrison hasn't been pushed down the card or jobbed to the done-nothing Hart Dynasty in a snoozer of a segment on SD!. Ziggles, E******, & Swa all fit some part of that.
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metylerca
King Koopa
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Don't be alarmed.
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Post by metylerca on Dec 6, 2009 17:54:30 GMT -5
Is there proof of this outside of "reportedly"? I mean, I could just fabricate a news report to say WWE has lost faith in John Morrison and people would bite. No we would not. John Morrison hasn't been pushed down the card or jobbed to the done-nothing Hart Dynasty in a snoozer of a segment on SD!. Ziggles, E******, & Swa all fit some part of that. So then my next question is... how does jobbing or losing a match mean WWE has no faith in you? I always use Carlito in this example because it seemed every week he lost a match, a PWI report came out the next day that he was 'unhappy' and on his way out soon. Yet, he's still on RAW.
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Post by Mayonnaise on Dec 6, 2009 17:58:38 GMT -5
No we would not. John Morrison hasn't been pushed down the card or jobbed to the done-nothing Hart Dynasty in a snoozer of a segment on SD!. Ziggles, E******, & Swa all fit some part of that. So then my next question is... how does jobbing or losing a match mean WWE has no faith in you? I always use Carlito in this example because it seemed every week he lost a match, a PWI report came out the next day that he was 'unhappy' and on his way out soon. Yet, he's still on RAW. He has also cussed out Trips in a Spanish paper and, told people at press conferences he was quitting but, is still around. Carlito is never a good example.
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Post by celticjobber on Dec 6, 2009 18:15:46 GMT -5
Ok, I can understand Escobar, but I gotta call smarkbait on Melina. There's no way in hell. Why? She botches alot more than Mickie James ever did and some people here were just about ready to burn Mickie at the stake just a few weeks ago. And she has a reputation for rubbing some people backstage the wrong way (like when she cried in the ring after being switched to Smackdown last year).
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metylerca
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Post by metylerca on Dec 6, 2009 18:25:57 GMT -5
So then my next question is... how does jobbing or losing a match mean WWE has no faith in you? I always use Carlito in this example because it seemed every week he lost a match, a PWI report came out the next day that he was 'unhappy' and on his way out soon. Yet, he's still on RAW. He has also cussed out Trips in a Spanish paper and, told people at press conferences he was quitting but, is still around. Carlito is never a good example. I stand corrected, but you get my point. Punk lost all the time on RAW and ECW, but there was never a point where WWE lost faith in him, despite the internet thinking he was purposely being berried~! It's all speculation. I'd bet that Escobar will have a match next Friday and get a reaction from the crowd, then he'll continue his program. I doubt he'll be written off and fired.
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