sryans
Don Corleone
BROOKLYN, BROOKLYN
Posts: 2,001
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Post by sryans on Jan 26, 2011 23:03:54 GMT -5
I think comparing this guy to Rosa Parks is silly.
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Post by Mr. Emoticon Man, TF Fan on Jan 26, 2011 23:05:11 GMT -5
Comparing this guy to Rosa Parks is absolutely insane, and does her and all those like her a huge injustice.
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Dave at the Movies
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
VINTAGE D-DAY DAVE! Always cranking dat thing.
Posts: 18,224
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Post by Dave at the Movies on Jan 26, 2011 23:08:30 GMT -5
A judge has rules to follow as well though. I can't say the name of the document of rules he is to follow though because it'd be breaking the politics rule. If a judges rules infringes on the rights of others than his rules are unjust. The bailiff had no right to touch the guy unless the guy was disrupting court. The guy clearly was not disrupting anything. He was wearing a hat and question validity of the ridiculous rule. Technically the bailiff committed assault and should be held accountable. BTW the hat guy went limp because he is not obligated to assist in his arrest. Technically resisting is only running away or using violence against the police. You don't have the right to wear hats, no rights were infringed upon. Also, courtrooms are limited public property. Yes, you have access to them but, you still must follow the rules in them. Think of schools, public property but, if you don't listen to what the administrators say, you can be thrown out or arrested. I believe you do have the right to wear whatever you want on public property. I don't believe a public servant should be able to tell you what you can wear especially when you are paying their wages. It is down right ridiculous and an abuse of power. Who is the guy hurting wearing the hat? Please tell me. If you say no one then it should not be a rule. BTW we technically have no rights in this country. They are privileges because they can be taken from you. A true right can not be taken from someone unless they infringe on someone else's rights. True rights are either all or not. Look up some George Carlin because he will say the exact same thing.
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Post by 01010010 01101001 01100011 on Jan 26, 2011 23:12:58 GMT -5
Well we'll just have to agree to disagree .
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sryans
Don Corleone
BROOKLYN, BROOKLYN
Posts: 2,001
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Post by sryans on Jan 26, 2011 23:15:17 GMT -5
So I should be able to walk into a courtroom wearing a thong? Or gang colors? Or a shirt that says "I am going to kill anyone who testifies against me?"
That is not your call, it is the judge's.
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BRV
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Wants him some Taco Flavored Kisses.
Posts: 17,012
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Post by BRV on Jan 26, 2011 23:16:18 GMT -5
That's a really silly/dangerous way of looking at the situation. I cant really explain why without getting too political, so I'll just say that using that perspective, then I guess Rosa Parks should have just kept her mouth shut and moved to the back of the bus, because she didn't "have the right" to the particular seat she was sitting on. You're right. She should have. Which is why it was such a big move when she didn't. But that was a small part of a much bigger thing happening all across the United States. It's not like we have been oppressed about wearing certain things in courtrooms and he's taking a big stand. Why even compare him with Rosa Parks in the first place? I think the easiest way to look at this is; imagine if the issue was that he was wearing no pants as opposed to wearing a hat as an act of defiance. I'm pretty sure he wouldn't be rallying the support that he is now, but the two are basically one in the same. At the end of the day, it comes down to two things: respect for authority and overall human decency, two things that this guy so clearly lacks. I don't think you need to kowtow to all things authority, but when an authority figure asks a simple request, such as "please remove your hat", what is so wrong with just doing it? It's like if there is a road block up the street, and the officer waves you to take a detour, but instead you just plow through the road block because, well, that's more convenient and because you're not just gonna listen to what authority has to say. It's not like they said "please renounce your rights as an American citizen" or "please proclaim a certain religious deity as your personal savior." It was a hat. They asked for it to be removed. Why go to these great lengths just to be difficult? As for human decency, when you're cracking wise with a bailiff or police officer, don't act all shocked and befuddled when they give you the business if you end up asking for it. It's like teasing a rottweiler. You're going to be told to stop, but you don't care, and when that dog jumps up and bites you, you've got nobody to blame but yourself. Fortunately, this thing isn't taking off in the media or online, so these guys will just fade into obscurity, which I'm sure pisses them off.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Jan 26, 2011 23:17:44 GMT -5
You're right. She should have. Which is why it was such a big move when she didn't. But that was a small part of a much bigger thing happening all across the United States. It's not like we have been oppressed about wearing certain things in courtrooms and he's taking a big stand. Why even compare him with Rosa Parks in the first place? I think the easiest way to look at this is; imagine if the issue was that he was wearing no pants as opposed to wearing a hat as an act of defiance. I'm pretty sure he wouldn't be rallying the support that he is now, but the two are basically one in the same. At the end of the day, it comes down to two things: respect for authority and overall human decency, two things that this guy so clearly lacks. I don't think you need to kowtow to all things authority, but when an authority figure asks a simple request, such as "please remove your hat", what is so wrong with just doing it? It's like if there is a road block up the street, and the officer waves you to take a detour, but instead you just plow through the road block because, well, that's more convenient and because you're not just gonna listen to what authority has to say. It's not like they said "please renounce your rights as an American citizen" or "please proclaim a certain religious deity as your personal savior." It was a hat. They asked for it to be removed. Why go to these great lengths just to be difficult? As for human decency, when you're cracking wise with a bailiff or police officer, don't act all shocked and befuddled when they give you the business if you end up asking for it. It's like teasing a rottweiler. You're going to be told to stop, but you don't care, and when that dog jumps up and bites you, you've got nobody to blame but yourself. Fortunately, this thing isn't taking off in the media or online, so these guys will just fade into obscurity, which I'm sure pisses them off. This.
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Post by 01010010 01101001 01100011 on Jan 26, 2011 23:19:35 GMT -5
You're right. She should have. Which is why it was such a big move when she didn't. But that was a small part of a much bigger thing happening all across the United States. It's not like we have been oppressed about wearing certain things in courtrooms and he's taking a big stand. Why even compare him with Rosa Parks in the first place? I think the easiest way to look at this is; imagine if the issue was that he was wearing no pants as opposed to wearing a hat as an act of defiance. I'm pretty sure he wouldn't be rallying the support that he is now, but the two are basically one in the same. At the end of the day, it comes down to two things: respect for authority and overall human decency, two things that this guy so clearly lacks. I don't think you need to kowtow to all things authority, but when an authority figure asks a simple request, such as "please remove your hat", what is so wrong with just doing it? It's like if there is a road block up the street, and the officer waves you to take a detour, but instead you just plow through the road block because, well, that's more convenient and because you're not just gonna listen to what authority has to say. It's not like they said "please renounce your rights as an American citizen" or "please proclaim a certain religious deity as your personal savior." It was a hat. They asked for it to be removed. Why go to these great lengths just to be difficult? As for human decency, when you're cracking wise with a bailiff or police officer, don't act all shocked and befuddled when they give you the business if you end up asking for it. It's like teasing a rottweiler. You're going to be told to stop, but you don't care, and when that dog jumps up and bites you, you've got nobody to blame but yourself. Fortunately, this thing isn't taking off in the media or online, so these guys will just fade into obscurity, which I'm sure pisses them off. Wonderfully put.
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Post by sam_III on Jan 26, 2011 23:20:02 GMT -5
Comparing this guy to Rosa Parks is absolutely insane, and does her and all those like her a huge injustice. I think comparing this guy to Rosa Parks is silly. K, well, to clear this up. I am not trying to imply that this guys actions were as significant as Rosa Parks, or that they will have any lasting historical, political or social implications in anyway comprable to that of Civil Rights hero Rosa Parks. What I WAS trying to say was that if you take the approach of "If Person A, who is in a position of power/authority, tells Person B to do something, they should do it without asking questions, and regardless if it is right or wrong of them to do so" then you can end up justifying some pretty silly things, like people saying stuff like "Rosa Parks was wrong, she should have shut up and moved to the back" edit: took out a link because I was missrepresenting someones opinion. Dont want to do that
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Jan 26, 2011 23:25:17 GMT -5
Comparing this guy to Rosa Parks is absolutely insane, and does her and all those like her a huge injustice. I think comparing this guy to Rosa Parks is silly. K, well, to clear this up. I am not trying to imply that this guys actions were as significant as Rosa Parks, or that they will have any lasting historical, political or social implications in anyway comprable to that of Civil Rights hero Rosa Parks. What I WAS trying to say was that if you take the approach of "If Person A, who is in a position of power/authority, tells Person B to do something, they should do it without asking questions, and regardless if it is right or wrong of them to do so" then you can end up justifying some pretty silly things, like people saying stuff like "Rosa Parks was wrong, she should have shut up and moved to the back" Dude, I didn't say she was wrong. I was just trying to point out that the reason she was a big deal is that according to the way things were at the time, she "should" have gone to the back, because that was the rule or whatever. But THAT was a real infringement of rights and not something as trivial as a damn hat. Don't wanna give off the impression that I am against Rosa Parks.
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Post by sam_III on Jan 26, 2011 23:25:34 GMT -5
At the end of the day, it comes down to two things: respect for authority and overall human decency, two things that this guy so clearly lacks. Really? I mean, I can kind of meet you halfway on the respect for authority thing. I would say he has a lack of respect for unwarranted, unjustified and abusive authority, but whatever. I can see how some people view those two things as the same. But you would go as far to say that this specific individual lacks overall human decency because he didnt want to take his hat off?
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Jay Peas 42
El Dandy
Totally flips out ALL the time.
Is looking forward to a Nation of Domination Kwannza Special.
Posts: 8,329
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Post by Jay Peas 42 on Jan 26, 2011 23:28:48 GMT -5
This is why we as a culture need to start dressing better.
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Post by Mr. Emoticon Man, TF Fan on Jan 26, 2011 23:29:26 GMT -5
I think the easiest way to look at this is; imagine if the issue was that he was wearing no pants as opposed to wearing a hat as an act of defiance. I'm pretty sure he wouldn't be rallying the support that he is now, but the two are basically one in the same. At the end of the day, it comes down to two things: respect for authority and overall human decency, two things that this guy so clearly lacks. I don't think you need to kowtow to all things authority, but when an authority figure asks a simple request, such as "please remove your hat", what is so wrong with just doing it? It's like if there is a road block up the street, and the officer waves you to take a detour, but instead you just plow through the road block because, well, that's more convenient and because you're not just gonna listen to what authority has to say. It's not like they said "please renounce your rights as an American citizen" or "please proclaim a certain religious deity as your personal savior." It was a hat. They asked for it to be removed. Why go to these great lengths just to be difficult? As for human decency, when you're cracking wise with a bailiff or police officer, don't act all shocked and befuddled when they give you the business if you end up asking for it. It's like teasing a rottweiler. You're going to be told to stop, but you don't care, and when that dog jumps up and bites you, you've got nobody to blame but yourself. Fortunately, this thing isn't taking off in the media or online, so these guys will just fade into obscurity, which I'm sure pisses them off. Wonderfully put. Agreed.
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Post by Alex Shelley on Jan 26, 2011 23:42:38 GMT -5
This is why we as a culture need to start dressing better. And who gets to decide what "better" means? Cause if it were up to me, everybody would be required to dress like this: If you don't have a mohawk, you are required to wear a hat 100% of the time. It's indecent not to have a mohawk and disrespectful to show a non-mohawked head.
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Dave at the Movies
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
VINTAGE D-DAY DAVE! Always cranking dat thing.
Posts: 18,224
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Post by Dave at the Movies on Jan 26, 2011 23:50:06 GMT -5
At the end of the day, it comes down to two things: respect for authority and overall human decency, two things that this guy so clearly lacks. Really? I mean, I can kind of meet you halfway on the respect for authority thing. I would say he has a lack of respect for unwarranted, unjustified and abusive authority, but whatever. I can see how some people view those two things as the same. But you would go as far to say that this specific individual lacks overall human decency because he didnt want to take his hat off? That is the thing. Authority deserves no respect if that authority is corrupt. There are very few courts in the US that can say they are not corrupt. This particular court in New Hampshire I can assure is corrupt. You guys are acting like the authority in this country is innocent. Guess what. It's not and no one has a true obligation to respect them or follow their absurd rules except of course the threat of violence.
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Post by Mr. Emoticon Man, TF Fan on Jan 27, 2011 0:32:21 GMT -5
Requesting that people follow accepted and completely harmless courtroom decorum lest they face the consequences is a sign of corruption...? Mmkay...
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Dave at the Movies
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
VINTAGE D-DAY DAVE! Always cranking dat thing.
Posts: 18,224
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Post by Dave at the Movies on Jan 27, 2011 0:35:14 GMT -5
Requesting that people follow accepted and completely harmless courtroom decorum lest they face the consequences is a sign of corruption...? Mmkay... This court arrested a guy for sitting down too slow so....yeah. lol
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Jan 27, 2011 0:52:58 GMT -5
I think every one should just agree to disagree and let this thread die. It's just back and forth arguing right now.
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Dave at the Movies
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
VINTAGE D-DAY DAVE! Always cranking dat thing.
Posts: 18,224
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Post by Dave at the Movies on Jan 27, 2011 1:00:25 GMT -5
I think every one should just agree to disagree and let this thread die. It's just back and forth arguing right now. I agree. I really enjoyed the debate from everyone that disagreed with me and respect your viewpoints because I understand where you guys are coming from. Kane needs to retire and gives the guys in keene a hand on this civil disobedience. He moved up to New Hampshire and is apart of the same free state movement.
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SEAN CARLESS
Hank Scorpio
More of a B+ player, actually
I'm Necessary Evil.
Posts: 5,770
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Post by SEAN CARLESS on Jan 27, 2011 1:08:58 GMT -5
Requesting that people follow accepted and completely harmless courtroom decorum lest they face the consequences is a sign of corruption...? Mmkay... That harmless courtroom decorum needs to be amended to the 21st century. We're basing rules on social standards from over a hundred years ago. That's the point. The court is within its rights to enforce their rules. But the rules in question (this one) are stupid and in desperate need of amendment to suit the times. Hats are part of overall clothing ensemble now, and in no way convey disrespect. Most are designed to wear indoors. This ain't your grandad's rain-drenched fedora here. It's an accent to your outfit. (I say this as a perpetual hat-wearer). I find the whole thing absurd. I like to think that the dude's bald/balding and doesn't want his frazzled dome exposed. I wouldn’t. Let's call it the Heyman law. Some dudes should just keep hats on for the betterment of human civilization.
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