|
Post by wcw on Jan 5, 2011 3:44:07 GMT -5
To further defend my HIRE RUSSO comment I decided to analyze the ppv cards of TNA. July 2009- Victory Road Main Event - Kurt Angle defeats Foley ---------------DUTCH LEAVES TNA---------------- August 2009 - Hard Justice Main Event - Kurt Angle defeats Sting and Morgan September 2009 - No Surrender Main Event - AJ defeats Kurt, Hernandez, Morgan, and Sting October 2009 - Bound For Glory Main Event - AJ defeats Sting November 2009 - Turning Point Main Event - AJ defeats Daniels and Joe December 2009 - Final Resolution Main Event - AJ defeats Daniels ----------------HOGAN and BISCHOFF arrive -------------- January 2010 - Genesis Main Event - AJ defeats Kurt Then we get an influx of Nasty Boyism, Love Spongeism, and Hogan Bischoff and Flair being center stage. True Russo may have been holding the title of head booker in 2010, but it is pretty obvious the creative direction went in a completely different way once HogSchoff arrived. I don't think it was coincidental. For all the complaints about TNA never concentrating on young/homegrown talent, it amazes me that the person who did just that, Russo, is still hated more than any other. Why are you giving Russo a pass on the booking of the Hogan era and the Dutch era. Also you are way overrating the 4 months he had control over. The product has his tendencies all over it (Weak babyfaces, a complete lack of meaning to anything, yo yo booking, overbearing heels that overstay their welcome, and swerves) since 2007. FIRE RUSSO.
|
|
|
Post by Hammer Smashed Ball on Jan 5, 2011 3:57:10 GMT -5
Wow. A whole year already. That's insane. I remember being home for winter break and watching that with so much excitement. I voted "no" by the way.
|
|
MrBRulzOK
Wade Wilson
Mr No-Pants Heathen
Something Witty Here.
Posts: 26,719
|
Post by MrBRulzOK on Jan 5, 2011 4:19:44 GMT -5
Let's see. Last year they were averaging a 1.1
These days they are averaging a... 1.1
So no, I don't think it really was worth much of anything outside of slightly increased production values and even that hasn't seemed to make any difference ratings wise.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 5, 2011 7:19:21 GMT -5
The Hogan debut segment (head-to-head with Bret and Shawn reconciling on Raw) drew 2.2 million viewers, IIRC. I think it was a 1.8 quarter hour rating. Interest was definitely there. The following three weeks (Thursday) they did 1.3, 1.3, and 1.4. They were back down to the 1.2/1.1 range until they moved to Monday and that is when the serious decline happened.
|
|
|
Post by poi zen rana on Jan 5, 2011 10:07:21 GMT -5
Why are you giving Russo a pass on the booking of the Hogan era and the Dutch era. Also you are way overrating the 4 months he had control over. The product has his tendencies all over it (Weak babyfaces, a complete lack of meaning to anything, yo yo booking, overbearing heels that overstay their welcome, and swerves) since 2007. FIRE RUSSO. I don't mean to over estimate Russo's booking or imply he is is the best booker ever. Far from it. Nor am I trying to say his era was devoid of swerves and strong heels and etc. I am simply stating that I preferred the Russo era to the Dutch/Russo era and to the Russo/Bischoff era. That doesn't mean I hold Russo up on some pedestal. I get why it may seem that way, complimenting Russo has become such a taboo that admitting you don't find the guy useless is akin to bowing before the guy in many eyes
|
|
|
Post by lordoflords on Jan 5, 2011 16:51:01 GMT -5
To further defend my HIRE RUSSO comment I decided to analyze the ppv cards of TNA. July 2009- Victory Road Main Event - Kurt Angle defeats Foley ---------------DUTCH LEAVES TNA---------------- August 2009 - Hard Justice Main Event - Kurt Angle defeats Sting and Morgan September 2009 - No Surrender Main Event - AJ defeats Kurt, Hernandez, Morgan, and Sting October 2009 - Bound For Glory Main Event - AJ defeats Sting November 2009 - Turning Point Main Event - AJ defeats Daniels and Joe December 2009 - Final Resolution Main Event - AJ defeats Daniels ----------------HOGAN and BISCHOFF arrive -------------- January 2010 - Genesis Main Event - AJ defeats Kurt Then we get an influx of Nasty Boyism, Love Spongeism, and Hogan Bischoff and Flair being center stage. True Russo may have been holding the title of head booker in 2010, but it is pretty obvious the creative direction went in a completely different way once HogSchoff arrived. I don't think it was coincidental. For all the complaints about TNA never concentrating on young/homegrown talent, it amazes me that the person who did just that, Russo, is still hated more than any other. THIS 100% I mean look at RAW, Head Writer Mr Gerwicks who booked HORRIBLE crap in 2009 with Hornswaggle being of the main focus, then in 2010, the producted improved dramatically with Gerwicks still as head writer. The creative direction was the main key, Thanks to Steph/Vince.
|
|
NOwave
Don Corleone
Posts: 1,735
|
Post by NOwave on Jan 6, 2011 17:58:46 GMT -5
I have to agree with everyone else here. It wasn't worth it to bring in Hogan and Bischoff, who apparently insisted on coming as a package deal. Bischoff alone might have been justifiable, based on the improvements in production of the TV programs,(although I don't know how that translated into additional revenue) but Hogan brought in essentially no new viewers. You could further argue that the Monday night experiment, as well as the presence of the Nasty Boys, Val Venis, BTLS and others were expenses that could have avoided.
On the other hand, TNA couldn't possibly know this in advance. Hogan is far and away the biggest single name in the business. He turned around BOTH WWF(Hulkamania) and WCW(NWO heel turn) making millions of dollars for both companies in the process. A justifiable risk up front? I think so.
In retrospect, a mistake. I'd shake hands, walk away, and keep trying if I were TNA management, with no anger or disrespect from either party. It was simply a business manuever that didn't work. Happens all the time.
|
|
|
Post by A Platypus Rave on Jan 8, 2011 2:18:11 GMT -5
Last year, 1/8/2010 to be exact, I went to a house show in New York and the place was packed...
Today I went to house show in the same place, while still filling the majority of the place they weren't close to selling out.
So there's that...
|
|
|
Post by Horatio Hornswoggle on Jan 8, 2011 3:03:26 GMT -5
Last year, 1/8/2010 to be exact, I went to a house show in New York and the place was packed... Today I went to house show in the same place, while still filling the majority of the place they weren't close to selling out. So there's that... Ditto, I flirted with TNA for a while, with friends showing me some excellent matches - one house show at the Liverpool Olympia (1st in the UK I believe), everyone going mental. Cut to a few months later at the M.E.N in Manchester, struggling to fill up despite major advertising and far more 'reputable' venue. A distinct lack of enthusiasm from the crowd, not to mention some mind-boggling 'twists' that included denying us a ladder match that had been the main thing advertised. Instead we got some unexplained, and nonsensical, three-way tag match that even the wrestlers couldn't quite figure out.
|
|
|
Post by lildude8218 on Jan 8, 2011 3:24:05 GMT -5
Last year, 1/8/2010 to be exact, I went to a house show in New York and the place was packed... Today I went to house show in the same place, while still filling the majority of the place they weren't close to selling out. So there's that... but TNA wasn't even booked in New York today. you accidentally went to a bee keepers convention.
|
|
|
Post by A Platypus Rave on Jan 8, 2011 5:39:57 GMT -5
Last year, 1/8/2010 to be exact, I went to a house show in New York and the place was packed... Today I went to house show in the same place, while still filling the majority of the place they weren't close to selling out. So there's that... but TNA wasn't even booked in New York today. you accidentally went to a bee keepers convention. hmm.. that explains all the bees
|
|
|
Post by toodarkmark on Jan 8, 2011 20:16:32 GMT -5
They accomplished in getting me to stop watching after watching every week for 5 years. Congrats E and HH!
|
|
|
Post by golding on Jan 8, 2011 21:06:38 GMT -5
It's interesting to see the same people on the WWE forum who argue that ratings don't matter in the face of year-by-year declining ratings for RAW, argue on this forum that stable ratings in the face of big moves is a bad thing.
I know some people here seem to be adamant about painting 2010 as some sort of disaster for TNA, but the truth is that it's been a really good year in terms of quality. Yeah, there are your occasional bad bits with Abyss generating power from Hulk Hogan's ring. But it's not even 1:1 with the quality stuff TNA provided.
Ric Flair and Fortune are a fantastic group, and have comprised only those stars made known in TNA. For all the clamoring people make about how TNA only favors "WWE rejects", one would think that group would get at least some kind of praise. But not really... instead we hear nitpicky nonsense like how "THERE'S SIX PEOPLE IN FORTUNE I HOPE THE WWE INCLUDES THAT IN THE RISE AND FALL OF TNA BY THE END OF THIS YEAR"
The PPV's showcased quality wrestling time after time. Pope saw a great push in the middle of 2010, peaking with the 8-card stud up to his unfortunate injury. Mr. Anderson has demonstrated great ability both as a heel and a face, and shows how much he benefits from not being guided by WWE scriptwriters. MCMG were given their first run as tag team champions, and they've been booked strong with several awesome matches with three extraordinary teams. They made a darn good ECW tribute show, and didn't just drop them immediately thereafter (which is something people so often complain about -- in fact, they used those older stars to put over TNA's homegrown stars.
I'm happy with TNA's 2010. With the jaded nature of online wrestling fans, I'm not especially surprised that so many people disagree. But it's unfortunate that some peoples' inherent biases against particular people in the wrestling world can't allow them to see an honest to goodness enjoyable product.
|
|
|
Post by Spankymac is sick of the swiss on Jan 8, 2011 21:10:16 GMT -5
It's interesting to see the same people on the WWE forum who argue that ratings don't matter in the face of year-by-year declining ratings for RAW, argue on this forum that stable ratings in the face of big moves is a bad thing. I know some people here seem to be adamant about painting 2010 as some sort of disaster for TNA, but the truth is that it's been a really good year in terms of quality. Yeah, there are your occasional bad bits with Abyss generating power from Hulk Hogan's ring. But it's not even 1:1 with the quality stuff TNA provided. Ric Flair and Fortune are a fantastic group, and have comprised only those stars made known in TNA. For all the clamoring people make about how TNA only favors "WWE rejects", one would think that group would get at least some kind of praise. But not really... instead we hear nitpicky nonsense like how "THERE'S SIX PEOPLE IN FORTUNE I HOPE THE WWE INCLUDES THAT IN THE RISE AND FALL OF TNA BY THE END OF THIS YEAR" The PPV's showcased quality wrestling time after time. Pope saw a great push in the middle of 2010, peaking with the 8-card stud up to his unfortunate injury. Mr. Anderson has demonstrated great ability both as a heel and a face, and shows how much he benefits from not being guided by WWE scriptwriters. MCMG were given their first run as tag team champions, and they've been booked strong with several awesome matches with three extraordinary teams. They made a darn good ECW tribute show, and didn't just drop them immediately thereafter (which is something people so often complain about -- in fact, they used those older stars to put over TNA's homegrown stars. I'm happy with TNA's 2010. With the jaded nature of online wrestling fans, I'm not especially surprised that so many people disagree. But it's unfortunate that some peoples' inherent biases against particular people in the wrestling world can't allow them to see an honest to goodness enjoyable product. You're right, Fourtune(which, nitpicky as it is, is STILL dumb for having six guys in "FOURtune") is a fantastic group comprised of all TNA guys, minus Flair,but since he's the leader/mentor, that's fair. It's just a pity they're used as the lackeys/enforcers for Hogan's group, who are clearly the alpha heels.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2011 21:23:32 GMT -5
When you really look at it 2010 was a real disaster.
Just terrible.
For a young company this was a stagnant year both creatively and business wise and that's a BIG setback. If they were already well established they could afford these kinds of mistakes because their fanbase is loyal enough to float through it.
2011 will be an uphill year. They'll really need to bring their "A" game to rebuild the brand this year. The potential viewing audience is already so leery of the product's massive quality fluctuations that even if they were to create a few months of quality product it still wouldn't be enough - they'd need to do at least 3 quarters of great story telling to undo the damage from this year.
Considering Hogan and Bischoff were brought in to do all this from Jan, I'd say they better find some new individuals to base the company's direction on.
|
|