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Post by azrael502 on Sept 25, 2011 10:08:06 GMT -5
Most of you in this thread are my kinda people. To the guy who said: "I think the better question is, is this fair to Benoit? He had a great wrestling career. I don't think the last 72 hrs of someones life should define everything they have ever done up to that point. Yeah how he went out was wrong....but it doesn't discount what he accomplished in the ring." Let's say you work at a Wendy's. The guy who works along side of you has won several Employee of the Month awards, and even a few Employee of the District, Year, ect.. Then one day, you're watching TV and they show a picture of him and the newsman says 'He killed his child, wife and then himself.' Can you honestly say that the next day/week/month/year, you'll be back in the walk-in fridge talking to a co-worker about him and say 'Yeah, he killed his family and himself, BUT YOU SHOULDA SEEN THE WAY HE MADE THE BACONATOR!!" The issue is that Benoit was an entertainer. Should the WWE have ignored the Von Erichs- a family infamous for mass suicides and abuse- no they put them in the hall of fame. Should the WWE blacklist all wrestlers who died from years of Drug abuse (like Curt Henning) or from Suicide? Should we ever judge an entertainer for anything else than what they did best- entertain us? Don't get me wrong- i don't like what Benoit did- but I don't like the way other wrestlers chose to self harm and destroy their lives either. oh cmon its a completly different situation von erich may have been a piece of s*** as a father but he didnt kill his kids and wife and those wrestlers who died from od or suicide didnt kill there familys either. but back on track his book is damn good but i have to say i wish there had been less fozzy in it cuz fozzy suck.
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Post by thetower52 on Sept 25, 2011 11:01:31 GMT -5
Fozzy is pretty damn good
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Post by probable on Sept 25, 2011 11:19:29 GMT -5
The issue is that Benoit was an entertainer. Should the WWE have ignored the Von Erichs- a family infamous for mass suicides and abuse- no they put them in the hall of fame. Should the WWE blacklist all wrestlers who died from years of Drug abuse (like Curt Henning) or from Suicide? Should we ever judge an entertainer for anything else than what they did best- entertain us? Don't get me wrong- i don't like what Benoit did- but I don't like the way other wrestlers chose to self harm and destroy their lives either. oh cmon its a completly different situation von erich may have been a piece of s*** as a father but he didnt kill his kids and wife and those wrestlers who died from od or suicide didnt kill there familys either. but back on track his book is damn good but i have to say i wish there had been less fozzy in it cuz fozzy suck. Then you're really not going to like his third book which has plenty of Dancing With the Stars talk. At the end of the day, its an autobiographical book, and music is a huge passion of his - so he has every right to talk about it as much as he wants. You buy a Chris Jericho book to hear about Chris Jericho the man - there is a WWE Encyclopaedia already on sale and its amazing. Foley gave into the pressure in his last book by including a Wresle-Meter, ranking chapters from 1 to 10 on their relevance to wrestling which I always thought was a stupid move. To a typical reviewer, that just comes across as odd and low rent.
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Post by laker8kiss on Sept 26, 2011 9:04:07 GMT -5
Just got done reading the book and Jericho was very good at explaining how he feels about Benoit now. To the guy who compared Benoit to a guy who could make a Wendy's burger well, this is my take. After you find out what he has done you will probably still eat at Wendy's but wil be left the memory of how good he made the burgers. Just like Benoit, after he did what he did people still continued to watch wrestling and fans remember his matches for what they were. Again, just my opinion.
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skulldouggory
Unicron
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Posts: 2,535
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Post by skulldouggory on Sept 26, 2011 9:21:02 GMT -5
I think the WWE can do whatever it wants. Nobody else owns the footage of benoit matches from wcw ecw and wwe, so if the WWE wants to never release anymore dvds containing his likeness then they have every right not too. Anyway, his best matches are on dvd, so what is there to complain about. If your still clutching onto the legacy of Benoit then watch your own damn dvds, just don't whine when WWE does'nt rehash the same matches again and again. Seriously people were bitching about how Randy Orton's world title win was'nt on his dvd set, anyone who wants to watch it can get on ebay and buy the ppv.
He killed his child and his wife and hung himself. Don't compare it to a drug endused heart attack or a guy killing himself due to depression or bi polar disorders. I still can't get over this love for Benoit and complaining that he does'nt get his due.
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Nikki Heyman
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Post by Nikki Heyman on Sept 26, 2011 9:29:09 GMT -5
I still can't get over this love for Benoit and complaining that he does'nt get his due. I've never asked for his "due", I've asked that he not be erased from WWE history.
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Post by 01010010 01101001 01100011 on Sept 26, 2011 9:47:07 GMT -5
I still can't get over this love for Benoit and complaining that he does'nt get his due. I've never asked for his "due", I've asked that he not be erased from WWE history. Which he never has been but, of course that hasn't stopped that ridiculous line of thinking yet.
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Post by Bob Schlapowitz on Sept 26, 2011 10:53:18 GMT -5
I've never understood why people say he's been "erased" from history.........He's still got a listing in the WWE Encyclopedia, he's still listed in the title histories and event results..............What do people want? A "Best of That Guy Who Murdered His Family" DVD?
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"Hollywood" Cactus Matt
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
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Post by "Hollywood" Cactus Matt on Sept 26, 2011 11:51:32 GMT -5
But, we have looked at all the facts. Benoit murdered his wife, son and himself over the course of a three day weekend. I don't know where that diary story came from, but what makes you think they didn't look through it? Excerpts from that diary have been read elsewhere in the media. If there were pages missing or a message in the back indicating people were coming to get him, do you think the family would just keep that a secret and not tell anyone? Also, you're siding with a diary over a mountain of evidence proving he did it? Honestly, what else could there possibly be giving you doubt? The fact that None of us were in the house when it happened. I wasn't in the house when O.J. Simpson allegedly killed his wife and her friend; I wasn't in the house when Michael Jackson allegedly molested those kids. I wasn't in the house when Roman Polanski drugged and raped a 13-year-old girl; I wasn't in the hotel room when Sid Vicious (from the Sex Pistols, not the wrestler) allegedly killed Nancy Spungen before ODing himself; I wasn't in the garage when Kurt Cobain allegedly killed himself; I wasn't in the house even born yet when Marvin Gaye's father allegedly shot and killed him during a heated argument. Using your logic, none of those things actually happened the way the "official report" said they did, because none of "us" were there to confirm it. EDIT: It turns out, I was born almost four years before Marvin Gaye died, but my point still stands.
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Post by warriorthug4edge on Sept 26, 2011 14:11:03 GMT -5
I am curious since it's been brought up. If Benoit didn't do it, what's a scenario that makes any amount of sense as an explanation? Just for the sake of argument, I'd be curious to hear anything remotely plausible. There really isn't one. The only even remote thought is that it was a triple murder set to make Benoit look like the murderer, but considering that forensic testing can safely determine when someone died, it ain't there.
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Post by thetower52 on Sept 26, 2011 15:26:44 GMT -5
I've never understood why people say he's been "erased" from history.........He's still got a listing in the WWE Encyclopedia, he's still listed in the title histories and event results..............What do people want? A "Best of That Guy Who Murdered His Family" DVD? They do have a best of DVD from before he went bat**** insane so they all should be happy and accept there childhood hero is a murderer
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Nikki Heyman
Fry's dog Seymour
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Post by Nikki Heyman on Sept 26, 2011 23:47:05 GMT -5
I've never understood why people say he's been "erased" from history.........He's still got a listing in the WWE Encyclopedia, he's still listed in the title histories and event results..............What do people want? A "Best of That Guy Who Murdered His Family" DVD? I want: -When I buy a WM book that says "EVERY superstar" and "EVERY match" to not falsely advertise, and completely omit matches, like, oh, the MAIN EVENT OF WMXX. They actually did this, I have the book. -When I buy a DVD that is covering an event that oooo, he who should not be named is involved, that they don't censor the commentary for fear of offending someone. -when I watch an event on 24/7 I don't have a "Narrator" lying to me that the "Footage was destroyed". I don't need or want him on a pedestal. I want that he is properly acknowledged for his place in history, warts and all. If WWE were allowed to document actual world history, people would never hear anything about genocidal dictators by the logic they use for their materials.
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Post by Threadkiller [Classic] on Sept 27, 2011 1:41:30 GMT -5
I've never understood why people say he's been "erased" from history.........He's still got a listing in the WWE Encyclopedia, he's still listed in the title histories and event results..............What do people want? A "Best of That Guy Who Murdered His Family" DVD? I want: -When I buy a WM book that says "EVERY superstar" and "EVERY match" to not falsely advertise, and completely omit matches, like, oh, the MAIN EVENT OF WMXX. They actually did this, I have the book. -When I buy a DVD that is covering an event that oooo, he who should not be named is involved, that they don't censor the commentary for fear of offending someone. -when I watch an event on 24/7 I don't have a "Narrator" lying to me that the "Footage was destroyed". I don't need or want him on a pedestal. I want that he is properly acknowledged for his place in history, warts and all. If WWE were allowed to document actual world history, people would never hear anything about genocidal dictators by the logic they use for their materials. Well, not if the genocidal dictators were on their payroll at the time they went about exterminating people like they were frigging Daleks. Knowing WWE, it wouldn't surprise me if a lot of footage of his actually was destroyed. Not that I expect it, but simply that it wouldn't surprise me. You know, plausible deniability if Linda decides to run or Congress decides to get nosy. Not that having Benoit's footage or not having it would amount to a hill of beans either way. But as someone who took a very long time to deal with my emotions about what Benoit did, I appreciated not having to see his matches or hear commentators talking about him when I watched 24/7. I'm good now, but I'll never actually seek out anything with him in it ever again, and I'll fastforward past any mentions of him. I just can't conceive of a scenario where I want to encounter him as a performer in any shape, form, or fashion on my television screen, because Benoit the man destroyed Benoit the performer, in my eyes. If I could find Sean "Val Venis" Morley's shoot about Benoit on YouTube, I'd put it here, because it sums up exactly what I (and a lot of people) feel about Benoit, vis-a-vis the man vs. the performer.
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chazraps
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Post by chazraps on Sept 27, 2011 16:16:37 GMT -5
I've never understood why people say he's been "erased" from history.........He's still got a listing in the WWE Encyclopedia, he's still listed in the title histories and event results..............What do people want? A "Best of That Guy Who Murdered His Family" DVD? I want: -When I buy a WM book that says "EVERY superstar" and "EVERY match" to not falsely advertise, and completely omit matches, like, oh, the MAIN EVENT OF WMXX. They actually did this, I have the book. -When I buy a DVD that is covering an event that oooo, he who should not be named is involved, that they don't censor the commentary for fear of offending someone. -when I watch an event on 24/7 I don't have a "Narrator" lying to me that the "Footage was destroyed". I don't need or want him on a pedestal. I want that he is properly acknowledged for his place in history, warts and all. If WWE were allowed to document actual world history, people would never hear anything about genocidal dictators by the logic they use for their materials. The WWE markets a family product. Most world history books aren't geared toward all ages. I'd think most families, and the WWE itself, would like to avoid the "that guy murdered his wife, son and then himself over the course of a weekend" conversation whenever possible. This whole thing wouldn't be an issue had Benoit not murdered his family and then killed himself. I'd have liked the see the Benoit-Jericho ladder match on the Jericho set last year as much as you do. I don't blame the WWE for this as much as Benoit himself, for murdering his family and then killing himself over the course of a weekend.
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Post by johnpricesuperstar on Oct 1, 2011 6:30:17 GMT -5
What an entertainer does in their private life is none of our business. We can only appreciate their art. If WWF banned/deleted every wrestler who has died prematurely from Drugs or Suicide there would only be Dennis Stamp left.
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donny
Team Rocket
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Post by donny on Oct 1, 2011 7:51:00 GMT -5
What an entertainer does in their private life is none of our business. We can only appreciate their art. If WWF banned/deleted every wrestler who has died prematurely from Drugs or Suicide there would only be Dennis Stamp left. By not acknowledging the wife and child that Benoit took with him, you are ignoring a huge part of what he did. Trust me: Chris Benoit has not been erased from history because he committed suicide. It's what he did before that suicide that renders his "art" irrelevant.
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Post by wildojinx on Oct 1, 2011 9:16:27 GMT -5
Come to think of it, have they removed any footage of nancy from old cwf/ecw/nwa/wcw footage when its shown on 24/7?
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Post by kriskomet on Oct 1, 2011 9:18:06 GMT -5
The fact that None of us were in the house when it happened. I wasn't in the house when O.J. Simpson allegedly killed his wife and her friend; I wasn't in the house when Michael Jackson allegedly molested those kids. I wasn't in the house when Roman Polanski drugged and raped a 13-year-old girl; I wasn't in the hotel room when Sid Vicious (from the Sex Pistols, not the wrestler) allegedly killed Nancy Spungen before ODing himself; I wasn't in the garage when Kurt Cobain allegedly killed himself; I wasn't in the house even born yet when Marvin Gaye's father allegedly shot and killed him during a heated argument. Actually The Sid Vicious case has never actually been proven either way so its a pretty bad example. While its not out of the realm of possibility that he did do it, I honestly don't think he did. But back on subject I have to say that I agree with WWE's treatment of the Benoit situation. If they don't want to release a DVD with him on it, that's fine by me, I wouldn't want to buy anything with him on it anyways. They're not changing their title history, so whats the problem? Someone mentioned that he'll be forgotten and I actually think thats more of a pro then a con, once Chris Benoit isn't the first thing the casual wrestling fans associate with the business then maybe WWE can start to grow again. Just my 2 cents.
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