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Post by xCompackx on Feb 4, 2012 11:05:42 GMT -5
I know it's been said many times but people still think it's an easy solution - knocking out or shooting this guy in one of the limbs is one of the stupidest things I've ever heard. Imagine someone running at you from 20 feet away, you can't run away, he's got a knife (all you see is a shiny blade) and you think you have the time to pull out your gun and pop him in the leg? While he's running full pelt and the only thing staying in roughly the same place is his torso or head? Or even funnier, that you can line up a punch for him to run into before he stabs you? There's some awesome ninja's here on FAN! This. If you're a cop and someone runs at you with a blade, shooting is your only option.
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Post by Rolent Tex on Feb 4, 2012 11:59:52 GMT -5
I know it's been said many times but people still think it's an easy solution - knocking out or shooting this guy in one of the limbs is one of the stupidest things I've ever heard. Imagine someone running at you from 20 feet away, you can't run away, he's got a knife (all you see is a shiny blade) and you think you have the time to pull out your gun and pop him in the leg? While he's running full pelt and the only thing staying in roughly the same place is his torso or head? Or even funnier, that you can line up a punch for him to run into before he stabs you? There's some awesome ninja's here on FAN! Don't you mock my l33t ninja skills foo!
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Post by Kevin Hamilton on Feb 4, 2012 12:04:51 GMT -5
Another trigger happy officer, nothing new. How? I can understand some of the arguments, as misguided as I think they may be, about being able to decided appropriate force in a split second.. but when someone's coming at you with a weapon, defending yourself doesn't = trigger happy.
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Big L
Grimlock
Posts: 13,883
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Post by Big L on Feb 4, 2012 12:08:06 GMT -5
How sad
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Sektor
Unicron
The OTHER Big Red Machine.
Posts: 2,808
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Post by Sektor on Feb 4, 2012 12:19:41 GMT -5
The only objective thing that can be said, really. The police officer is gonna lose his job and probably be hated just for defending himself, and the child is dead for not being fully mentally capable. I'd be thrilled to see something positive in off topic every once in a while :/.
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Post by knuckles on Feb 4, 2012 15:18:20 GMT -5
Oh- he was autistic? Great. Dont fecking care. He attacked a Cop with a KNIFE. He was also 5 feet ten inches tall and weighed 220 lbs. He wasnt a lil kid. He got what he deserved. Dont want to die, dont attack a cop with a knife. Tough s***.
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Post by Red Impact on Feb 4, 2012 17:42:29 GMT -5
The only objective thing that can be said, really. The police officer is gonna lose his job and probably be hated just for defending himself, and the child is dead for not being fully mentally capable. I'd be thrilled to see something positive in off topic every once in a while :/. The cop probably won't lose his job unless they determined that he acted improperly, and even then probably not unless he really, really screwed up.
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Post by Danimal on Feb 5, 2012 3:38:17 GMT -5
To me it gets down to whether it was a butterknife or not. If it's a butterknife the guy overreacted. Use your nightstick, mace, kick in the balls or whatever. If it was a knife with a real edge then ya I can see shooting the kid.
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Post by El Hijo del Havoc on Feb 5, 2012 4:01:11 GMT -5
I feel bad for everyone in this situation That's all that can be said, other than some of these posts are pretty damn harsh
To me, looks like a case where one side is right for the wrong reasons and one side is wrong for the right reasons
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Cranjis McBasketball
Crow T. Robot
Knew what the hell that thing was supposed to be
Peace Love and Nothing But
Posts: 41,975
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Post by Cranjis McBasketball on Feb 5, 2012 4:13:14 GMT -5
Yeah, not surprised. That's what the cops do. Shoot you dead. Then claim self-defense. Cept in our Youtube era, people now film the shit, so now it is illegal to film cops.
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Post by Orange on Feb 5, 2012 4:15:53 GMT -5
Yeah, not surprised. That's what the cops do. Shoot you dead. Then claim self-defense. Cept in our Youtube era, people now film the s***, so now it is illegal to film cops. Quick question though, if somebody was coming at you with a knife - what the hell would you do? Try to hug him? If somebody is coming at me with a knife, their clear intention is to hurt me, so my clear intention is to hurt them back. Like I said earlier, hindsight is great, and it's awfully easy to sit from an outside perspective and judge the cop. Real easy to sit in a chair, point a finger and say "he's wrong, he should've handled that differently", but maybe that's just me, I don't know.
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Cranjis McBasketball
Crow T. Robot
Knew what the hell that thing was supposed to be
Peace Love and Nothing But
Posts: 41,975
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Post by Cranjis McBasketball on Feb 5, 2012 4:22:33 GMT -5
Yeah, not surprised. That's what the cops do. Shoot you dead. Then claim self-defense. Cept in our Youtube era, people now film the s***, so now it is illegal to film cops. Quick question though, if somebody was coming at you with a knife - what the hell would you do? Try to hug him? If somebody is coming at me with a knife, their clear intention is to hurt me, so my clear intention is to hurt them back. Like I said earlier, hindsight is great, and it's awfully easy to sit from an outside perspective and judge the cop. Real easy to sit in a chair, point a finger and say "he's wrong, he should've handled that differently", but maybe that's just me, I don't know. A) I don't own and will never own a f***ing gun. So shooting isn't an option. While I'm not a cop, I am positive they have training just for this kind of thing, how to disarm someone. I'm sure the training isn't "shoot the f***". They teach them this because being a cop is f***ing dangerous. I don't like kids and I don't like cops. I'm just sick of hearing about the police killing someone they clearly have more power than. A proper kill shot takes more skill than to wound. The cop meant to kill him and he had the training to do so.
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Post by Red Impact on Feb 5, 2012 8:55:43 GMT -5
Quick question though, if somebody was coming at you with a knife - what the hell would you do? Try to hug him? If somebody is coming at me with a knife, their clear intention is to hurt me, so my clear intention is to hurt them back. Like I said earlier, hindsight is great, and it's awfully easy to sit from an outside perspective and judge the cop. Real easy to sit in a chair, point a finger and say "he's wrong, he should've handled that differently", but maybe that's just me, I don't know. A) I don't own and will never own a f***ing gun. So shooting isn't an option. While I'm not a cop, I am positive they have training just for this kind of thing, how to disarm someone. I'm sure the training isn't "shoot the f***". They teach them this because being a cop is f***ing dangerous. I don't like kids and I don't like cops. I'm just sick of hearing about the police killing someone they clearly have more power than. A proper kill shot takes more skill than to wound. The cop meant to kill him and he had the training to do so. Every person with gun training, whether military, hunting, or police, will be trained to shoot center of mass. It's not about wound vs. kill, you aim for the easiest place to hit, and the place that moves the least in a target that's coming toward you. So no, a "proper kill shot" doesn't take more skill. The easiest place to hit is a place with lots of important, squishy organs that will cause fast death. You don't aim for the head, legs or arm, you go for the torso and abdomen. And if someone comes at you with a knife, trying to disarm the attacker without seriously hurting them isn't going to be top priority. None of this action hero bulls*** flies in real life, if someone is coming at you with a deadly weapon, your goal is to neutralize them in the best way you have, not to let them get close and try to take it away. That's what training will teach you. If you let them get within stabbing distance, the odds of them seriously injuring or killing you is pretty high, no matter how much jiu jitsu training you have.
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wrasslinmachine
Don Corleone
Savagely protecting the innocent since 1987.
Posts: 1,971
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Post by wrasslinmachine on Feb 5, 2012 11:12:41 GMT -5
Another trigger happy officer, nothing new. How? I can understand some of the arguments, as misguided as I think they may be, about being able to decided appropriate force in a split second.. but when someone's coming at you with a weapon, defending yourself doesn't = trigger happy. It was a butter knife. Maybe these cops should be trained a little better on taking down someone with a blade. I could understand if the kid wielded a gun then you have no choice.
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Post by Red Impact on Feb 5, 2012 12:03:06 GMT -5
How? I can understand some of the arguments, as misguided as I think they may be, about being able to decided appropriate force in a split second.. but when someone's coming at you with a weapon, defending yourself doesn't = trigger happy. It was a butter knife. Maybe these cops should be trained a little better on taking down someone with a blade. I could understand if the kid wielded a gun then you have no choice. The story states that the knife had already cut through fabric, and I've never seen a butter knife that could slash like that. So either the knife had been sharpened significantly, in which case it's become just a normal knife, or it was never a butter knife as the parents insisted. Otherwise, you don't want to let a person with a blade get within stabbing distance of you, unless in the few seconds you have you can tell for certain that the knife, for certain, isn't dangerous. When you lunge at someone with a weapon, they're within their rights to take you down with whatever they have. And I don't care how much training you have, you don't let a person with a knife get within distance to use it if you can help it in any way. No amount of training can make that situation completely safe, especially considering that training takes place in a controlled environment, not with a mentally ill armed assailant in a basement. You're not obligated to put yourself in a potentially deadly situation because some guy decided to lunge at you with a weapon.
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Post by "Gizzark" Mike Wronglevenay on Feb 5, 2012 13:00:55 GMT -5
I don't think anything that happens to that cop is going to be any worse than what is already inside his head knowing he shot a 15-year-old boy.
As for the autism thing, speaking as someone diagnosed with it, f*** that.
In fact, it's Asperger's specifically that I was diagnosed with, and I don't care how f***ing antisocial it makes us as a group, I'm not about to go attacking a cop with a knife, butter knife or not. That is just ridiculous, and honestly I don't blame the cop for reacting the way he did.
Not entirely, anyway. As the kid's mum said the stun gun was an option, but then over here our cops don't carry guns anyway.
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Post by Piccolo on Feb 5, 2012 14:00:10 GMT -5
Yeah, unless anyone can honestly tell me that they've seen a butter knife that could cut through fabric when slashed at someone, I'm afraid the "it was a butter knife" claim sounds like a blatant lie.
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Post by Danimal on Feb 5, 2012 22:04:42 GMT -5
Yeah, unless anyone can honestly tell me that they've seen a butter knife that could cut through fabric when slashed at someone, I'm afraid the "it was a butter knife" claim sounds like a blatant lie. You don't know if it really slashed the unform, lots of he said/she said in the article. Parent could be lying. So could the cop. Could be combinaton where a butterknife causes a little tear(just has to catch right) and the cop exaggerates(possibly opening the tear himself to make it look better).
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Post by sludgehammer on Feb 5, 2012 22:24:11 GMT -5
More deaths are caused by blunt stabbing instruments than sharp knives anyway. With enough force a butter knife can be jammed into you.
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Post by Danimal on Feb 6, 2012 0:23:37 GMT -5
More deaths are caused by blunt stabbing instruments than sharp knives anyway. With enough force a butter knife can be jammed into you. True, but lots of stuff could be deadly if used right and with enough force. A butter knife is not a more deadly weapon than a nightstick. If the weapon was a butterknife than the nightstick and maybe some mace would be more reasonable. It's not like the cop has to go hand-to-hand. I wasn't there so don't really know but IF the weapon was a butterknife, which is a big if, I'd say the cop could defend himself well without blasting. Against a real knife that can slash your gut or throat open ya blast away.
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