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Post by celticjobber on Jun 3, 2012 16:18:43 GMT -5
Kevin Bacon's character in "White Water Summer".
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Post by Red Impact on Jun 3, 2012 16:19:53 GMT -5
...i take it you don't have a problem with the past suffering of the native american people, being forced to leave their land to make room for white people. by forcing the space hippies to move from their world which grants them eternal life, they're going to die so that a bunch of aliens obsessed with plastic surgery can look young (and like hell they'd share it with billions) Not really the same thing. The species in the movie was dying. The surgery they were getting was to try to stave off death. It wasn't a matter of being vain, it was a matter of having vital, technology so they wouldn't die out. They explained in the movie and said that there was a reason they couldn't just colonize the planet (It'd take 10 years to have any effect and many would die in the meantime). To be similar to the Native Americans, the reasons for pushing them out would have been purely greed. They don't really make that case in the movie. Secondly, the planet was in Federation space. It's very unlikely that this new technology could be kept from the Federation when they're surrounded in Federation territory and probably would likely have a heavy contingent of Federation ships breathing down their neck until they did produce it. The Federation would have gotten their hands on it, and the things it could have cured would have helped far more. As the prior tenet goes, the good of the many outweighs the good of the few. Finally, this wasn't going to be a long and arduous journey suffered by the space hippies. In fact, the way the plan was set up, they wouldn't even know they were making it. Yes, they would grow older as a result of it, but the thing is, they never intended to live forever when they moved to the planet. They weren't going to force an unnatural death on the species by any means. They went to the planet solely and entirely to escape technology, and there's plenty of planets available where they can do that. So the situations don't really correlate with me.
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Futureraven: Beelzebruv
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Post by Futureraven: Beelzebruv on Jun 3, 2012 16:31:18 GMT -5
Actually, they were going to force them from their home so they wouldn't die when Starfleet bombed the planet to allow the benefits be felt by billions. Also, it was more than plastic surgery the aliens wanted, they were going to die without the treatment Starfleet were offering. And since Starfleet were running the operation, they were going to get the benefits. Keep in mind that Picard was perfectly happy to see similar incidents take place throughout the series when ordered to by Starfleet. Yep. In "The Ensigns Of Command" he sends Data to remove a colony from a Sheliak planet. In "Journey's End", he tries to remove a Native American colony from a Cardassian planet. Also, as harsh as it is, when it's this scale, yeah, I would move the 600 people, for a start, whatever the benefits they have, the space hippies get too so it's not like they'll die. But 600 people being moved, to benefit a population of 9.85 Trillion (quick google search), it'd be the equivelent of moving 1 creature on the planet down to a microbe to benefit all the rest, I wouldn't give it a second thought. For another thing, this is an internal matter, the people the Federation are aligned with are the same race as the people who they're moving. Who after a fight didn't let them have any other area of the planet, but exiled them into space. So they Space hippies aren't exactly perfect. The Federation errs in helping one side in an internal matter, but it's not like the Prime Directive hasn't been broken before.
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Post by Sero on Jun 3, 2012 16:35:25 GMT -5
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Push R Truth
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Post by Push R Truth on Jun 3, 2012 17:21:41 GMT -5
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Post by Cela on Jun 3, 2012 17:35:59 GMT -5
Avatar, too bad they were so cartoonishly over the top.
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CMWaters
Ozymandius
Rolled a Seven, Beat the Ads.
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Post by CMWaters on Jun 3, 2012 17:38:48 GMT -5
Four words: Ferris Bueller's Day Off. You're saying it was right to skip out of school, get his sick best friend to come with him, and take his sick best friend's father's car out? ...wait, Ferris ISN'T suppossed to be the villain here? BULL!
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Legion
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Hail Hydra!
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Post by Legion on Jun 3, 2012 17:46:06 GMT -5
2012. Why exactly is Oliver Platt the jerk? Everything he says is pretty correct, given the situation. I have said this to people so many times.
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wildojinx
Wade Wilson
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Post by wildojinx on Jun 3, 2012 17:50:39 GMT -5
Animal House, or heck, any movie where a teacher is tormented by students who dont care about education (though i guess its ok if the teacher is being oppressive to the students).
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Post by Cela on Jun 3, 2012 18:02:29 GMT -5
2012. Why exactly is Oliver Platt the jerk? Everything he says is pretty correct, given the situation. I have said this to people so many times. It's not that what he says is wrong, it's just the way he goes about doing and saying it that makes him a total prick.
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Post by Mighty Attack Tribble on Jun 3, 2012 19:56:15 GMT -5
I have said this to people so many times. It's not that what he says is wrong, it's just the way he goes about doing and saying it that makes him a total prick. To be honest, in that situation the softly-softly approach doesn't cut it.
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Post by Hit Girl on Jun 3, 2012 20:02:52 GMT -5
Walter Donovan and Belloq from the Indiana Jones movies.
Setting aside who they are aligned with, fundamentally they are doing the same thing as the hero and looking for artifacts.
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Post by Evilution E5150 on Jun 3, 2012 20:15:36 GMT -5
I suppose they're not outright villains, but Keys and the government personnel were justifiably hunting ET and were right to quarentine the house. He's an alien. He could brought something dangerous with him. i even thought that as a kid i mean hes clearly dying and i'm like what is Elliot's problem they're trying to help for f***s sale
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 3, 2012 20:23:15 GMT -5
Walter Donovan and Belloq from the Indiana Jones movies. Setting aside who they are aligned with, fundamentally they are doing the same thing as the hero and looking for artifacts. Not really. Indy wants to put the artifacts in a museum. Belloq and Donovan wanted to obtain them for personal gain. And you can't really ignore that they were both working with the Nazis.
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Post by Hit Girl on Jun 3, 2012 20:33:35 GMT -5
Walter Donovan and Belloq from the Indiana Jones movies. Setting aside who they are aligned with, fundamentally they are doing the same thing as the hero and looking for artifacts. Not really. Indy wants to put the artifacts in a museum. Belloq and Donovan wanted to obtain them for personal gain. And you can't really ignore that they were both working with the Nazis. The end intention is different, but they are still just searching for artifacts. As for the Nazis, in Belloq and Donovan's case, they were a means to an end and little more.
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Post by BlackoutCreature on Jun 3, 2012 21:47:47 GMT -5
Not really. Indy wants to put the artifacts in a museum. Belloq and Donovan wanted to obtain them for personal gain. And you can't really ignore that they were both working with the Nazis. The end intention is different, but they are still just searching for artifacts. As for the Nazis, in Belloq and Donovan's case, they were a means to an end and little more. In this case I don't think the bad guys are actually right as much as much as the good guy is just as wrong. Let's face it, Indy is basically looting ancient treasures from independent states and moving them across international borders without any kind of real authority to do any of this. He might believe his goals are noble in his head, but in the end he's really just a thief.
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Post by Bob Schlapowitz on Jun 3, 2012 21:53:56 GMT -5
Ed Harris (I forget his character's name) in The Rock.
He had very noble intentions, but went about it the wrong way.
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Dr. T is an alien
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Post by Dr. T is an alien on Jun 3, 2012 22:10:30 GMT -5
Ed Harris (I forget his character's name) in The Rock. He had very noble intentions, but went about it the wrong way. That is the one I was going to post, but since I got distracted watching "X-Men: First Class" I will have to pick something else. How about the X-Men films? Just about every single one of them feature a antagonist that feels that a war between the mutants and the humans are inevitable and that they need to position themselves in order to be the one that wins that war. Were Shaw and Magneto wrong? The moment that the humans at large found out about mutants they sicced two navies on them without provocation. Later there were several pieces of legislature designed to deal with the "mutant problem". That does not sound particularly accepting to me. Was Stryker wrong? There WERE mutants, and powerful ones at that, who were plotting a first strike against humans. Without developing tactics to deal with mutants those mutants could be successful.
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Magician under the moonlight
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Always Beaten To The Punchline. Always.
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Post by Magician under the moonlight on Jun 3, 2012 22:48:04 GMT -5
Michael Douglas's character in Falling Down, we studied that movie in CEGEP.
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darthalexander
Hank Scorpio
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Post by darthalexander on Jun 3, 2012 22:57:43 GMT -5
Gone Baby Gone. Least I think so.
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