King Ghidorah
El Dandy
On Probation for Charges of two counts of Saxual Music.
How Absurd
Posts: 8,330
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Post by King Ghidorah on Jan 4, 2013 12:11:19 GMT -5
I always find it funny when things like this come up. People get mad at companies trying to stop Piracy. Is it wrong for then to want to make money off their games. With this and the women & children first thread you appear to be trying a little too hard lately You appear to be taking the words I type too seriously.
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Post by SsnakeBite, the No1 Frenchman on Jan 4, 2013 12:27:05 GMT -5
I always find it funny when things like this come up. People get mad at companies trying to stop Piracy. Is it wrong for then to want to make money off their games. How is buying a game second-hand piracy? That's not fighting piracy, that's trying to make people pay twice for one product.
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kolani
Bubba Ho-Tep
Posts: 516
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Post by kolani on Jan 4, 2013 13:41:12 GMT -5
It's kind of sad that you could've written the headline without saying which company it was and I would've correctly guessed 'Sony'. I don't know why Sony seems to want such complete totalitarian control of this sort of thing, but it really mostly seems to just be because they can. Microsoft has been looking into this as well for some time now, expecting that they wouldn't do it if Sony does is ignorant and naive. In fact, Microsoft would likely benefit more from it, their attach rates are generally lower.
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Post by Cyno on Jan 4, 2013 13:43:13 GMT -5
Honestly, I'd expect Nintendo to actually do this sorta thing before Sony or Microsoft.
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King Ghidorah
El Dandy
On Probation for Charges of two counts of Saxual Music.
How Absurd
Posts: 8,330
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Post by King Ghidorah on Jan 4, 2013 14:59:37 GMT -5
I always find it funny when things like this come up. People get mad at companies trying to stop Piracy. Is it wrong for then to want to make money off their games. How is buying a game second-hand piracy? That's not fighting piracy, that's trying to make people pay twice for one product. When you buy second hand, you are enjoying the developers creation without them seeing any money. Same deal with Piracy.
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Post by Zombie Mod is not a ghoul. on Jan 4, 2013 15:26:48 GMT -5
How is buying a game second-hand piracy? That's not fighting piracy, that's trying to make people pay twice for one product. When you buy second hand, you are enjoying the developers creation without them seeing any money. Same deal with Piracy. sorry but your wrong on that one, piracy leaves the developers with no money from the copy at all, second hand means they at least had money from the original sale of the game.
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Post by SsnakeBite, the No1 Frenchman on Jan 4, 2013 15:29:12 GMT -5
How is buying a game second-hand piracy? That's not fighting piracy, that's trying to make people pay twice for one product. When you buy second hand, you are enjoying the developers creation without them seeing any money. Same deal with Piracy. Like hell. The guy I bought it from or who gave it to me still payed for it and as the owner of the product, has the right to sell it. And since they didn't have to spend a single penny to make a new product, there is no reason for them to recive one extra penny either. IKEA doesn't come crying when I buy furniture they made at a garage sale. By that logic, no-one should be allowed to make presents, ever.
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Legion
Fry's dog Seymour
Amy Pond's #1 fan
Hail Hydra!
Posts: 22,715
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Post by Legion on Jan 4, 2013 15:32:51 GMT -5
How is buying a game second-hand piracy? That's not fighting piracy, that's trying to make people pay twice for one product. When you buy second hand, you are enjoying the developers creation without them seeing any money. Same deal with Piracy. They saw the money the first time round, this sort of thing will make people who play and complete games fast second guess buying a game at all, because who wants to pay full price for a game that has no multiplayer or replay value? If you cannot sell on after completion of an action-adventure style game, or a game you dont get on with or even just a bad game, games purchases will fall because people will wait for bargain bins. The only games that will then sell will be the faceless yearly games from the huge studios that people trust whatever they do.
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King Ghidorah
El Dandy
On Probation for Charges of two counts of Saxual Music.
How Absurd
Posts: 8,330
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Post by King Ghidorah on Jan 4, 2013 15:37:20 GMT -5
When you buy second hand, you are enjoying the developers creation without them seeing any money. Same deal with Piracy. Like hell. The guy I bought it from or who gave it to me still payed for it and as the owner of the product, has the right to sell it. And since they didn't have to spend a single penny to make a new product, there is no reason for them to recive one extra penny either. IKEA doesn't come crying when I buy furniture they made at a garage sale. By that logic, no-one should be allowed to make presents, ever. Did that IKEA funiture take millions of dollars to make? And I'm pretty sure those presents were bought new right? If I made 500 King Ghidirah tasty ass sandwiches, and I got 500 customers waiting, and the first 250 people decide to to sell their sandwiches to the 250 people behind them, well I'm left with 250 sandwiches and I lose out on money. No matter which way you slice is, Used games are hurting developers on the same level as Piracy is.
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Post by DrBackflipsHoffman on Jan 4, 2013 15:42:05 GMT -5
You're making it too obvious, now.
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King Ghidorah
El Dandy
On Probation for Charges of two counts of Saxual Music.
How Absurd
Posts: 8,330
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Post by King Ghidorah on Jan 4, 2013 15:42:47 GMT -5
When you buy second hand, you are enjoying the developers creation without them seeing any money. Same deal with Piracy. They saw the money the first time round, this sort of thing will make people who play and complete games fast second guess buying a game at all, because who wants to pay full price for a game that has no multiplayer or replay value? If you cannot sell on after completion of an action-adventure style game, or a game you dont get on with or even just a bad game, games purchases will fall because people will wait for bargain bins. The only games that will then sell will be the faceless yearly games from the huge studios that people trust whatever they do. Let's be honest here, what's the difference between "I'll wait for a used copy." And "I'll wait for it to hit the bargain bin." Same effect, you get your lower price, and the developer gets cash. If Sony believes they can sustain software sales with this idea, that's not for me to guess about.
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Post by Vice honcho room temperature on Jan 4, 2013 15:44:03 GMT -5
They saw the money the first time round, this sort of thing will make people who play and complete games fast second guess buying a game at all, because who wants to pay full price for a game that has no multiplayer or replay value? If you cannot sell on after completion of an action-adventure style game, or a game you dont get on with or even just a bad game, games purchases will fall because people will wait for bargain bins. The only games that will then sell will be the faceless yearly games from the huge studios that people trust whatever they do. Let's be honest here, what's the difference between "I'll wait for a used copy." And "I'll wait for it to hit the bargain bin." Same effect, you get your lower price, and the developer gets cash. If Sony believes they can sustain software sales with this idea, that's not for me to guess about. One is perfectly legal as defined by the courts the other isn't
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King Ghidorah
El Dandy
On Probation for Charges of two counts of Saxual Music.
How Absurd
Posts: 8,330
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Post by King Ghidorah on Jan 4, 2013 15:49:21 GMT -5
Maybe I have my keyboard set to Spanish. I'm not arguing the legality of it all, I'm not arguing if this is a good idea or not. What I'm saying is, by buying a used game, developers get the same amount of money they would have received if you would have downloaded it for free. The only difference is, you paid someone for it.
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Bo Rida
Fry's dog Seymour
Pulled one over on everyone. Got away with it, this time.
Posts: 23,516
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Post by Bo Rida on Jan 4, 2013 15:51:57 GMT -5
How is buying a game second-hand piracy? That's not fighting piracy, that's trying to make people pay twice for one product. When you buy second hand, you are enjoying the developers creation without them seeing any money. Same deal with Piracy. It goes deeper than that though, without the second hand market people won't be able to trade old games against new ones and many game shops will close, losing a major way people buy new games will hurt the industry. Plus with the advent of online codes and DLC developers are increasingly likely to see money from 2nd hand games, I'm also guessing shops do some of their advertising for them (nothing builds a buzz like a midnight launch). So if Sony did implement this they'd piss of retailers and 3rd party developers. That's without going into other issues, personally I'm more bothered by certain titles going out of print quickly and becoming unavailable, you can point to legal downloads but they're not available forever.
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Post by Vice honcho room temperature on Jan 4, 2013 15:56:58 GMT -5
Maybe I have my keyboard set to Spanish. I'm not arguing the legality of it all, I'm not arguing if this is a good idea or not. What I'm saying is, by buying a used game, developers get the same amount of money they would have received if you would have downloaded it for free. The only difference is, you paid someone for it. And when corporations try to limit the rights of the consumer I don't understand why one would support them. Trade ins differ the price of buying new games, help keep the legacy of older games so people would want to buy the sequel or future works from that developer, and same with borrowed games which this would kill. Also used games is a limited quantity unlike pirating where if I can get as many copies as I want but there's only so many to buy used.
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Post by DrBackflipsHoffman on Jan 4, 2013 15:57:11 GMT -5
When you buy second hand, you are enjoying the developers creation without them seeing any money. Same deal with Piracy. It goes deeper than that though, without the second hand market many game shops will close, losing a major way people buy new games will hurt the industry. Plus with the advent of online codes and DLC developers are increasingly likely to see money from 2nd hand games. So if Sony did implement this they'd piss of retailers and 3rd party developers. That's without going into other issues, personally I'm more bothered by certain titles going out of print quickly and becoming unavailable, you can point to legal downloads but they're not available forever. Maybe I have my keyboard set to Spanish. I'm not arguing the legality of it all, I'm not arguing if this is a good idea or not. What I'm saying is, by buying a used game, developers get the same amount of money they would have received if you would have downloaded it for free. The only difference is, you paid someone for it. And when corporations try to limit the rights of the consumer I don't understand why one would support them. Trade ins differ the price of buying new games, help keep the legacy of older games so people would want to buy the sequel or future works from that developer, and same with borrowed games which this would kill. Also used games is a limited quantity unlike pirating where if I can get as many copies as I want but there's only so many to buy used. You both make very good arguments, but allow me to counter all that with - Prove me wrong!
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kidglov3s
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Wants her Shot
Who is Tiger Maskooo?
Posts: 15,870
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Post by kidglov3s on Jan 4, 2013 15:59:07 GMT -5
I think we'll see something like this eventually for all media. With the embracing of stuff like Netflix we're seeing a shift away from the ownership model that we fought for and earned with stuff like the Betamax case.
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King Ghidorah
El Dandy
On Probation for Charges of two counts of Saxual Music.
How Absurd
Posts: 8,330
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Post by King Ghidorah on Jan 4, 2013 16:06:31 GMT -5
When you buy second hand, you are enjoying the developers creation without them seeing any money. Same deal with Piracy. It goes deeper than that though, without the second hand market people won't be able to trade old games against new ones and many game shops will close, losing a major way people buy new games will hurt the industry. Plus with the advent of online codes and DLC developers are increasingly likely to see money from 2nd hand games, I'm also guessing shops do some of their advertising for them (nothing builds a buzz like a midnight launch). So if Sony did implement this they'd piss of retailers and 3rd party developers. That's without going into other issues, personally I'm more bothered by certain titles going out of print quickly and becoming unavailable, you can point to legal downloads but they're not available forever. All this is true, that's why It's silly to think this will even happen, but 30% of a sale still isn't 100%. And when corporations try to limit the rights of the consumer I don't understand why one would support them. Trade ins differ the price of buying new games, help keep the legacy of older games so people would want to buy the sequel or future works from that developer, and same with borrowed games which this would kill. Also used games is a limited quantity unlike pirating where if I can get as many copies as I want but there's only so many to buy used. Sony doesn't care about legacy. Wanna enjoy old games, buy our HD collections. Sure, some people trade in used toward new, but what about trading used for used.
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Legion
Fry's dog Seymour
Amy Pond's #1 fan
Hail Hydra!
Posts: 22,715
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Post by Legion on Jan 4, 2013 16:13:40 GMT -5
I think we'll see something like this eventually for all media. With the embracing of stuff like Netflix we're seeing a shift away from the ownership model that we fought for and earned with stuff like the Betamax case. I will fight that with my last breath. I want to own something, not some digital data on a hard drive I could lose or crash. I want things on display on a shelf. Others do too. Digital distribution is likely the future, but it isn't my future.
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King Ghidorah
El Dandy
On Probation for Charges of two counts of Saxual Music.
How Absurd
Posts: 8,330
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Post by King Ghidorah on Jan 4, 2013 16:16:42 GMT -5
It goes deeper than that though, without the second hand market many game shops will close, losing a major way people buy new games will hurt the industry. Plus with the advent of online codes and DLC developers are increasingly likely to see money from 2nd hand games. So if Sony did implement this they'd piss of retailers and 3rd party developers. That's without going into other issues, personally I'm more bothered by certain titles going out of print quickly and becoming unavailable, you can point to legal downloads but they're not available forever. You both make very good arguments, but allow me to counter all that with - Prove me wrong! How did you get one of my tasty ass sandwiches.
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