Dat Dude
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Post by Dat Dude on Apr 20, 2013 11:27:46 GMT -5
When comparing the divas of the past with those of the present, a point that is often brought up is that those in the past were given a lot more opportunities and support for their characters that women of today could only dream of. Thus the later generations were handicapped by default. So with that in mind, let's try and rank the divas based on the level of a push or exposure they were given:
Here's how I rank it in terms of who was given the biggest pushes and the most exposure:
1. Chyna 2. Trish 3. Lita 4. Sable 5. Michell McCool 6. Melina 7. Mickie James 8. AJ Lee 9. Beth Phoenix 10. Eve
How would you rank it and why?
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Post by The Beast Disincarnate on Apr 20, 2013 12:55:40 GMT -5
You forgot the unforgetable Kelly Kelly
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Dat Dude
Dennis Stamp
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Post by Dat Dude on Apr 20, 2013 13:00:28 GMT -5
You forgot the unforgetable Kelly Kelly In the bigger picture though, she only had one title reign and spent the first several years of her tenure as a jobber.
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Totorob101
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Post by Totorob101 on Apr 20, 2013 13:09:54 GMT -5
Trish is number one for me, the most overhyped female of all time for me. She was ok in the ring but i just never understood how she is rated as one of the best of all time.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 20, 2013 13:42:02 GMT -5
You forgot the unforgetable Kelly Kelly In the bigger picture though, she only had one title reign and spent the first several years of her tenure as a jobber. I would argue that Kelly would go on the list of failed pushes, but then again she first started to get a serious push when the division was already DOA. Bella Twins I would say could be a honourable mention to that list. Not in your face pushed, but always on TV pushed. Good list generally.
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kidglov3s
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Post by kidglov3s on Apr 20, 2013 13:50:42 GMT -5
My list would be
1. AJ (what other woman has had the WWE product centered around her, above the male talent, for any period of time, even if it's just 3 months or so)
2. Sable (if anyone came close to the way they used AJ in Summer 2012 it would be Sable from about Feb. 1998 to her departure in 1999)
3. Chyna
4. Sunny
5. Elizabeth
6. Sherri
7. Richter
8. Trish
9. Lita
10. Candice Michelle (as an individual wrestler I'd say she was more pushed than Lita, especially relative to overness, but Lita had the prominence in major angles that Candice did not.)
Runner Up: Michelle McCool (sure she was prominent within the women's division but was not as central to the product as Richter nor involved in major angles with men like the other women above. I don't think she was shilled as strongly as Candice was.)
Runner Up: Tori Wilson
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trollrogue
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Post by trollrogue on Apr 20, 2013 13:53:11 GMT -5
In Full Sail Land, Paige is booked as the strongest Diva out of everybody, even when she is up against established Divas like Natalya and Alicia Fox.
Now that Emma is also getting over with NXT fans, she'll probably get a similar strong booked run as a face Diva, which these days is a much better push than anything primetime face Divas in the WWE.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 20, 2013 14:07:24 GMT -5
No diva has anything on that couple of months where AJ was EVERYWHERE on WWE TV. That was brutal.
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PKO
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Post by PKO on Apr 20, 2013 14:07:35 GMT -5
I think your list is pretty much spot on Rehab. I'm sure AJ will overtake Mickie, probably Melina and possibly McCool in the next few years.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 20, 2013 15:20:54 GMT -5
Maybe I'm just forgetting some stuff, but I would have put AJ Lee, Mickie James, and Eve all above Melina. I don't remember Melina getting a whole lot of focus on television even when she was champion, whereas AJ was all over the place for a while and still gets a decent amount of time now (though not nearly as much as she was getting). Eve had some very prominent storylines for quite a while as well, plus multiple title reigns. Mickie James had the huge Trish angle and was more popular than Melina imo, and I think she cropped up more often than Melina in random matches and such. I feel like Melina was frequently an afterthought, even when she was champion, and didn't get as much attention outside her split entrance. I also would have ranked Trish at number one.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 20, 2013 15:28:18 GMT -5
Are we talking about the wrestlers or divas as in boobs being pushed up by a push-up bra!?
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Dat Dude
Dennis Stamp
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Post by Dat Dude on Apr 20, 2013 16:11:40 GMT -5
Maybe I'm just forgetting some stuff, but I would have put AJ Lee, Mickie James, and Eve all above Melina. I don't remember Melina getting a whole lot of focus on television even when she was champion, whereas AJ was all over the place for a while and still gets a decent amount of time now (though not nearly as much as she was getting). Eve had some very prominent storylines for quite a while as well, plus multiple title reigns. Mickie James had the huge Trish angle and was more popular than Melina imo, and I think she cropped up more often than Melina in random matches and such. I feel like Melina was frequently an afterthought, even when she was champion, and didn't get as much attention outside her split entrance. I also would have ranked Trish at number one. For those who site AJ's domination of coverage on RAW a few months, may have forgotten how Melina did the same on Smackdown during '05-06. Outside of Batista and Taker she was arguably the most featured star on Smackdown when she was just a manager for MNM. She was apart story-lines like: having an affair with Vince (and was confronted by Stephanie and Linda about it), sleeping with Batista before a match and then later accusing him of rape (held a press conference that took up a big chunk of a Smackdown episode), a segment on Saturday Night Main-Event teasing that she could be Vince's daughter, tying up and kidnapping Trish and challenging her to PPV match (when they were on two different brands),etc. That's not including the stuff she did when she was moved to RAW: her friendship and betrayal of Mick Foley (which also involved Vince), the K-Fed fued with Cena, and countless segments she had during her very first women's title reign. After her first injury the company never pushed her that hard again, but she was definitely the "It girl" for bookers prior to that. Mickie, had a great storyline coming out the gate but not much notable (storyline wise) until years later with the feud with McCool. Mickie seemed to be treated like a placeholder more than an air-apparent to Trish (remember her face turn was kinda by accident) and it seemed like the majority of her title reigns were after failed experiment pushes of the flavor of the months like Ashley, Candice, and others. They knew Mickie was a safe bet (due to her popularity) to put the belt on, but they were always trying to find someone to fill her spot (despite her being the most popular baby face diva). AJ had a few months where she was the center of the show, but before and afterwards she was used as an enhancement talent for the majority of her young career. She's had zero title reigns, hell zero title feuds during her WWE tenure. I do believe over time she'll surpass Mickie/Melina in that regard, but I'm taking in account the level of push throughout their entire career, and so far AJ's push has had high peaks but low valleys.
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Post by cool guy on Apr 20, 2013 16:17:17 GMT -5
I thought this was going to be a really weird, meta WWE.com list.
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Sam Punk
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Post by Sam Punk on Apr 20, 2013 16:36:02 GMT -5
Solid list. Chyna was 100% wwe hype.
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trollrogue
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Post by trollrogue on Apr 20, 2013 16:49:53 GMT -5
I remember one of the first things they did after debuting Melina and MNM was having her pose nude with the Tag Team belts Mercury and John Morrison won covering her 'lady parts'. She was a big deal fairly quick, to say the least.
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kidglov3s
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Post by kidglov3s on Apr 20, 2013 17:09:15 GMT -5
I can see the arguments for Melina, some of which I was not aware of due to my wrestling hiatus from more/less 2000 to 2009 and me only seeing the PPVs from that era and the occasional tv on Youtube. I guess my response would be on the level of relevance. It sounds like Melina was a big deal, yes, but in the midcard for the most part. Her stuff all seems contained within the realm of the tag team and Diva's divisions, and furthermore most of this is happening on the B Show, Smackdown.
A woman like AJ has the entire product basically revolving around her and Lita and Elizabeth are jumping from main event angle to main event angle. Sunny is... well, Sunny, basically the unpolished prototype of what the future would bring in Sable and AJ. Chyna is briefly a number one contender for the WWF title at Summerslam, in the ring hugging HHH as he wins his first world title, and holding the intercontinental title, having competitive matches with men like Jericho and Jarrett. Sable is about the second or third most prominent act in the company when they finally overtake WCW in the ratings and skyrocket in all areas, the first PPV after that, Unforgiven 98, Sable is in one of the three top billed matches, she also won matches against men and would have major roles on other PPVs, including KOTR where she simply appears in-ring yet is on the video cover. How f***ed up is it in retrospect that Edge's first PPV match is being Sable's token partner for her mixed tag match? Trish is steeped into McMahonamania at its worst in 2001. When Vince took his first risks with expansion and had one show on MTV he made sure to put everything he had behind Wendy Richter, bringing in Cyndi Lauper and promoting her in the second highest profile match at the biggest show in the company's history to that point, Wrestlemania.
Compared to that stuff even with her exploits written out I feel like Melina is relatively inconsequential. More of a Jacqueline than a Sable. However my own biases of what I'm familiar with and what I lived through might be playing a role in how I envision the answer to this question, I think in particular I overrated Sherri's degree of being pushed. I think there's a difference between tv time and narrative significance. When I was watching shows in 2006 I felt bombarded with the message of "CHEER FOR CANDICE MICHELLE, CHEER FOR CANDICE MICHELLE", and that's the kind of feeling I associate with someone being "most pushed". I never felt like they went for the hard sell with Melina the way that they did with the women I listed.
Great thread.
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welshjobber
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Post by welshjobber on Apr 20, 2013 17:21:36 GMT -5
Stacy Keibler deserves a mention.
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Post by Joe Neglia on Apr 20, 2013 17:37:42 GMT -5
Sunny is an absolute must on this sort of list. In the early days of super-widespread internet use, she was one of the biggest things around for a bit.
Does Stephanie McMahon count? She automatically makes #1, if so. Miss Kitty was pretty over-pushed during her tenure. If there is a bonus slot for special attractions that were pushed hard when they were around but weren't a part of the regular crew - Mae Young and Moolah. Hell, they even gave Moolah the strap again.
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Dat Dude
Dennis Stamp
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Post by Dat Dude on Apr 20, 2013 17:44:50 GMT -5
Sunny is an absolute must on this sort of list. In the early days of super-widespread internet use, she was one of the biggest things around for a bit. Does Stephanie McMahon count? She automatically makes #1, if so. Miss Kitty was pretty over-pushed during her tenure. If there is a bonus slot for special attractions that were pushed hard when they were around but weren't a part of the regular crew - Mae Young and Moolah. Hell, they even gave Moolah the strap again. I was trying to focus more on wrestlers and less on valets/personalities (Otherwise Vickie, Stephanie, Sunny etc. would be very high on my list), but I was more aiming towards who was given the most opportunities to succeed both in the ring, on the mic, and character development wise over the course of their entire careers.
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Post by celticjobber on Apr 20, 2013 18:30:26 GMT -5
Torrie Wilson was a pretty big part of Smackdown for about a year or two, so she deserves to be on the list. And I really don't remember Melina getting much of a big push.
1. Chyna 2. Trish 3. Lita 4. Sable 5. Torrie Wilson 6. AJ Lee 7. Michelle McCool 8. Mickie James 9. Dawn Marie 10. Candice Michelle
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