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Post by Magic knows Black Lives Matter on Mar 18, 2014 18:31:41 GMT -5
If anything, this shows how f***ing low the standards for wrestling plots are. I know this thread is not entirely serious, so please forgive me for this rant. Let's plug this logic into any other form of fiction. Imagine if a TV show had extremely poor four seasons only to have a decent finale. Would we say it was a great series or that the finale redeemed the series? Of course not. Any reasonable person would say "That's a decent finale. The show is still shitty due to torturing me week in and week out with bad writing." A good piece of fiction shouldn't be like a f***ing test of endurance to see if you are worthy of seeing the ending, and narrative tension should not revolve around "Will the writers actually bother wrapping this plot around or not?" Yeah, maybe this storyline will have a decent ending. It will still be a bad storyline because of how badly paced it was. This guy gets it.
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mrjl
Fry's dog Seymour
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Post by mrjl on Mar 18, 2014 18:35:06 GMT -5
Sure. But man was it a crappy road getting there. A good ending doesn't forgive how bad the previous 5 or so months have been. If you're happy with that, cool. But I don't consider this a real victory in any sense of the word. It's pretty clear it was done out of necessity rather than any real long term planning. what would you have done differently that potentially ends with Bryan holding the WWE title at Mania? Keeping the belt on Bryan would make the Authority ineffective so less heat. Scrapping the Wyatt angle leaves Bryan with nothing to do for two or three months.
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mrjl
Fry's dog Seymour
Posts: 20,319
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Post by mrjl on Mar 18, 2014 18:36:50 GMT -5
If anything, this shows how f***ing low the standards for wrestling plots are. I know this thread is not entirely serious, so please forgive me for this rant. Let's plug this logic into any other form of fiction. Imagine if a TV show had extremely poor four seasons only to have a decent finale. Would we say it was a great series or that the finale redeemed the series? Of course not. Any reasonable person would say "That's a decent finale. The show is still shitty due to torturing me week in and week out with bad writing." A good piece of fiction shouldn't be like a f***ing test of endurance to see if you are worthy of seeing the ending, and narrative tension should not revolve around "Will the writers actually bother wrapping this plot around or not?" Yeah, maybe this storyline will have a decent ending. It will still be a bad storyline because of how badly paced it was. of course it all depends on how you view things. I view most fiction these days as tests of endurance.
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Post by Magic knows Black Lives Matter on Mar 18, 2014 18:40:12 GMT -5
If anything, this shows how f***ing low the standards for wrestling plots are. I know this thread is not entirely serious, so please forgive me for this rant. Let's plug this logic into any other form of fiction. Imagine if a TV show had extremely poor four seasons only to have a decent finale. Would we say it was a great series or that the finale redeemed the series? Of course not. Any reasonable person would say "That's a decent finale. The show is still shitty due to torturing me week in and week out with bad writing." A good piece of fiction shouldn't be like a f***ing test of endurance to see if you are worthy of seeing the ending, and narrative tension should not revolve around "Will the writers actually bother wrapping this plot around or not?" Yeah, maybe this storyline will have a decent ending. It will still be a bad storyline because of how badly paced it was. of course it all depends on how you view things. I view most fiction these days as tests of endurance. ...Why? I'm honestly curious, why? Are you just a glutton for punishment? If I take time out to invest in a fictional story, it's because I think the story is interesting and I want to see how it ends. If I think it's shit 1/4 of the way into the story, I'm out.
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Post by Magnum Opus on Mar 18, 2014 18:49:31 GMT -5
of course it all depends on how you view things. I view most fiction these days as tests of endurance. ...Why? I'm honestly curious, why? Are you just a glutton for punishment? If I take time out to invest in a fictional story, it's because I think the story is interesting and I want to see how it ends. If I think it's shit 1/4 of the way into the story, I'm out. mrjl is a not terribly elaborate troll, you're not going to ever get a satisfying answer.
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mrjl
Fry's dog Seymour
Posts: 20,319
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Post by mrjl on Mar 18, 2014 19:17:45 GMT -5
of course it all depends on how you view things. I view most fiction these days as tests of endurance. ...Why? I'm honestly curious, why? Are you just a glutton for punishment? If I take time out to invest in a fictional story, it's because I think the story is interesting and I want to see how it ends. If I think it's shit 1/4 of the way into the story, I'm out. I tend to like characters more than I like stories. I'm also not a huge fan of plot twists and so many stories these days have what seems to be arbitrary twists to extend them, false climaxes that derail a perfectly logical plot, just so the ending can be a bigger deal. I'm more interested in seeing the hero of the story succeed, than see them overcome unconquerable odds. So many writers end up stacking the deck against the hero it feels like the reason they win in the end is because it's time to end the story, not because it makes sense So the way fiction is written these days even if I bail on one story there's very few options that won't leave me right in the same situation.
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Post by disqospider on Mar 18, 2014 19:33:08 GMT -5
...Why? I'm honestly curious, why? Are you just a glutton for punishment? If I take time out to invest in a fictional story, it's because I think the story is interesting and I want to see how it ends. If I think it's shit 1/4 of the way into the story, I'm out. I tend to like characters more than I like stories. I'm also not a huge fan of plot twists and so many stories these days have what seems to be arbitrary twists to extend them, false climaxes that derail a perfectly logical plot, just so the ending can be a bigger deal. I'm more interested in seeing the hero of the story succeed, than see them overcome unconquerable odds. So many writers end up stacking the deck against the hero it feels like the reason they win in the end is because it's time to end the story, not because it makes sense So the way fiction is written these days even if I bail on one story there's very few options that won't leave me right in the same situation. So you just...hate conflict? How on earth does that work? A resolution is only satisfactory if it's earned. If Frodo's walk to Mordor is just a casual stroll through a field of flowers, how on earth is it satisfying when he throws the ring in the volcano?
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Post by Kevin Hamilton on Mar 18, 2014 19:34:14 GMT -5
As I'm sure has been mentioned- Nah, not really. It's in a good place now, but had people not just rejected the Rumble with utter disdain, we probably wouldn't be here either.
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Post by Neo: "The One" who CLAPS on Mar 18, 2014 19:34:36 GMT -5
I'm going to laugh if Batista wins the title at Mania. And then cry. My laugh will be more of a, "going off the deep end" laugh. Think Walter White in the crawl space
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Bang Bang Bart
Ozymandius
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Post by Bang Bang Bart on Mar 18, 2014 19:37:52 GMT -5
People rejecting the Rumble's outcome, as well as CM Punk being a butt-f***ing quitter (I mean that in a nice way, obvs) helped moved things along.
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Post by Hit Girl on Mar 18, 2014 19:46:56 GMT -5
Nope. "Wait and See" didn't work, because it implies this was all part of WWE's plan. It wasn't. What worked was the fans making it clear that WWE's booking was shit, and essentially forcing them to change it. Now they are on the right track. The question now is whether WWE concludes the storyline properly. This sets a good precedent. If you want WWE to shift direction and overcome their terrible forced shoehorned booking, the fans now know how to do it. Sabotage and hijacking.
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mrjl
Fry's dog Seymour
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Post by mrjl on Mar 18, 2014 19:49:21 GMT -5
I tend to like characters more than I like stories. I'm also not a huge fan of plot twists and so many stories these days have what seems to be arbitrary twists to extend them, false climaxes that derail a perfectly logical plot, just so the ending can be a bigger deal. I'm more interested in seeing the hero of the story succeed, than see them overcome unconquerable odds. So many writers end up stacking the deck against the hero it feels like the reason they win in the end is because it's time to end the story, not because it makes sense So the way fiction is written these days even if I bail on one story there's very few options that won't leave me right in the same situation. So you just...hate conflict? How on earth does that work? A resolution is only satisfactory if it's earned. If Frodo's walk to Mordor is just a casual stroll through a field of flowers, how on earth is it satisfying when he throws the ring in the volcano? I hate what I feel is artificially extended conflict, or conflict that requires someone to be stupid for it to work.
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543Y2J
Patti Mayonnaise
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Post by 543Y2J on Mar 18, 2014 19:49:23 GMT -5
I am trying desperately to not count the chickens before they hatch. As far as the build/booking goes yeah definitively, but lets see if they fully follow through on the night. I really really hope that they will do
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BRV
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Post by BRV on Mar 18, 2014 19:51:52 GMT -5
The alternate timeline where Punk is still around would be a very different place that threads like this don't exist. Ever since the "Occupy Raw" segment last Monday, it could be argued that CM Punk walking out is the best thing that could have happened for WWE. The rumored WrestleMania card that turned out to be almost dead-on accurate featured CM Punk vs. Triple H and Daniel Bryan vs. Sheamus. So instead of getting the logical, necessary conclusion to the Daniel Bryan-Triple H feud AND Daniel Bryan walking out of WrestleMania as WWE World Heavyweight Champion, we would've gotten CM Punk extending his feud with The Authority through the Royal Rumble and Elimination Chamber, a possible Sheamus heel turn, and Bryan getting shoved into the middle of the card. The way I see it, CM Punk's departure was the greatest thing he was responsible for since the Straight Edge Society.
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Perd
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Post by Perd on Mar 18, 2014 19:54:13 GMT -5
Enduring this storyline, is like Andy Dufrense's escape from Shawshank. Yeah, we're all gonna come out clean, on the other side, but we still had to crawl through a river of shit to get there.
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Post by disqospider on Mar 18, 2014 19:55:28 GMT -5
Enduring this storyline, is like Andy Dufrense's escape from Shawshank. Yeah, we're all gonna come out clean, on the other side, but we still had to crawl through a river of shit to get there. And it would have been worse if we really did "wait and see". Bryan would likely be facing Bray in a throwaway opener to WM, and we'd have *shudder* Batista vs. Orton in the main event.
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Post by Amazing Kitsune on Mar 18, 2014 19:57:56 GMT -5
I, Calvin, declare a permanent victory for the "Wait & See" movement on the FAN forums in the case of Daniel Bryan vs. The Authority storyline which will culminate in one of the biggest pay offs in WWE history at Wrestlemania XXX. If you are a "Wait & See" follower like I am, and feel truly justified in this victory simply say "Yes!" YES! YES! YES! You just jinxed it, you son of a bitch.
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Post by psychokiller on Mar 18, 2014 20:00:54 GMT -5
WWE deserves some credit for finally listening to the fans, but their original plan was for Batista to be in the main event of WrestleMania vs. Orton & Punk vs. Triple H. Plans changed due to the fans shitting all over it & Punk leaving. Bryan was supposed to be in some mid-card match against Sheamus.
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Post by "American Cream" Dusty Loads on Mar 18, 2014 20:05:49 GMT -5
I'm disappointed Punk left, I was totally looking forward to the future classic Punk vs Korporate Kane.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 18, 2014 20:10:25 GMT -5
of course it all depends on how you view things. I view most fiction these days as tests of endurance. ...Why? I'm honestly curious, why? Are you just a glutton for punishment? If I take time out to invest in a fictional story, it's because I think the story is interesting and I want to see how it ends. If I think it's shit 1/4 of the way into the story, I'm out. With me it depends on what it is and how easily I can sever emotional connection to it. Final Fantasy 13? Because I spent $60, I was going to put up with that game...for about 12 hours before I was so disgusted I gave the game away for free. I was able to put up with something I hated for 12 hours before I became disgusted, all because I paid $60 for it. That JJ Abrams show, Fringe? I put up with nearly two seasons of nothing happening and them shafting my favorite character from any type of character arc for multiple seasons, because I'll always think weird sci-fi shit is cool and John Noble was knocking out performances left and right. I stopped about 5 episodes short of the series finale. It's weird. I just don't have that kind of tolerance for WWE anymore. I mean, I haven't even been posting much not because I think the Hunner/D. Bryan match is going to suck but it's like (putting aside health issues) I'm done caring where it goes anymore. It took them too long to book the really obvious shit I wanted to see and I guess I don't care how that sounds because I'm saying it anyway. If I gotta put up with months of them booking stupid and petty shit, only for them to backtrack after weeks of the crowd coming within a goat's beard of just throwing feces into the ring? I just keep thinking, why bother? D. Bryan is probably going to beat Hunner and have his cool WM Moment with the title, but it's just...my vote of NO CONFIDENCE still stands because we had to put up with so much shit along with #HijackRaw to get to this point. The thing is too, that affects how I even view the rest of the product. It's cool Cesaro is tearing it up in matches left and right, but I don't think it's going to matter because WWE has decreed their midcard to be the place where pushes go to die. It is a void from which there is no escape. Naomi wearing an awesome eye-patch and still being decent in ring isn't going to matter because unless she's going to feud with a Total Diva, it's like WWE has outsourced any effort into booking the women in anything outside the bare minimum to the E! Network. I only think the really optimistic sincerely do the "Wait and See" anymore. The best WWE gets (and what they deserve) is "Wait and See...if the WWE decides to not be ridiculous." Which...if you're going to watch, that's how I'd recommend.
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