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Post by Kevin Hamilton on Aug 28, 2015 22:07:21 GMT -5
There's a pretty big gulf between 'not the best fighter in the world' and 'average at best'.
Bottom line, dude was a world champion fighter. He wasn't around long enough, nor did he have a complete enough set of skills to be considered 'the best' at any one time. No one can argue that. But to deride what he DID accomplish seems unfair as well.
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Emmet Russell
King Koopa
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Post by Emmet Russell on Aug 28, 2015 22:21:42 GMT -5
I LOVE this about him. He's such a subversion of the normal way wrestling works. It's like he has no respect for the very PROCESS of wrestling. "No, I don't do fancy moves. I hurt people." and he does the same stuff over and over. And he shuts down dude's signature spots all the time. Like tonight with the old school. He's just the best. I'm so bored with the usual formula of WWE matches and he's such a breath of fresh air compared to that. This reminds me of what Bryan and Vinny are always saying on their show: "everyone wrestles the same in WWE." Everyone except Lesnar. We all know wrestling is fake, but watching Lesnar makes us suspend disbelief because it looks real: Brock bleeds, repeats moves that are effective, trash talks his opponents and doesn't give a damn what anyone thinks of him - it's so great. He's my favourite guy in all of wrestling and all of his stuff is must-see. I get more enjoyment out of watching him bounce around while Heyman talks than seeing Cena and Owens have the same match with the same sequences for the third time in three months.
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mo
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
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Post by mo on Aug 29, 2015 7:22:25 GMT -5
Should have been 6-2. Dude got screwed in that first Mir fight. I don't watch much wrestling anymore, but he was one of the few that keeps me interested.
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Post by Aboutreika18 on Aug 29, 2015 7:28:52 GMT -5
He's just the best. I'm so bored with the usual formula of WWE matches and he's such a breath of fresh air compared to that. This reminds me of what Bryan and Vinny are always saying on their show: "everyone wrestles the same in WWE." Everyone except Lesnar. We all know wrestling is fake, but watching Lesnar makes us suspend disbelief because it looks real: Brock bleeds, repeats moves that are effective, trash talks his opponents and doesn't give a damn what anyone thinks of him - it's so great. He's my favourite guy in all of wrestling and all of his stuff is must-see. I get more enjoyment out of watching him bounce around while Heyman talks than seeing Cena and Owens have the same match with the same sequences for the third time in three months. I think it was Maffew who said Lesnar and Owens are the two best at wrestling like they're actually trying to win the match.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 29, 2015 8:08:17 GMT -5
This reminds me of what Bryan and Vinny are always saying on their show: "everyone wrestles the same in WWE." Everyone except Lesnar. We all know wrestling is fake, but watching Lesnar makes us suspend disbelief because it looks real: Brock bleeds, repeats moves that are effective, trash talks his opponents and doesn't give a damn what anyone thinks of him - it's so great. He's my favourite guy in all of wrestling and all of his stuff is must-see. I get more enjoyment out of watching him bounce around while Heyman talks than seeing Cena and Owens have the same match with the same sequences for the third time in three months. I think it was Maffew who said Lesnar and Owens are the two best at wrestling like they're actually trying to win the match. I like Owens a lot but... Not really. Owens wrestles more like he's running down a checklist of all the cool stuff he wants to fit in.
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ASYLUMHAUSEN
Fry's dog Seymour
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Post by ASYLUMHAUSEN on Aug 29, 2015 9:31:48 GMT -5
Brock's whole aura is tied to his MMA stint at this point.
He doesn't look like a "wrestler" in the traditional sense (not that he ever really did), he looks like a guy who is there to f*** people up. And, sure, he could fire off that shooting star press...or an ARMBAR...or stuff like that...but this incarnation of Brock? It just wouldn't fit.
He is there to destroy and lay waste to everything and everybody in front of him. The form of the destructor and all that.
And it is pretty much the perfect angle/gimmick for him to work.
Having the Greatest Mic Worker in the history of the business as his hype man? Icing on the cake.
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Post by häšhtå.gdālėÿ on Aug 29, 2015 10:37:36 GMT -5
Should have been 6-2. Dude got screwed in that first Mir fight. I don't watch much wrestling anymore, but he was one of the few that keeps me interested. It must have been the "YOU TAPPED OUT" chants that followed him into every single other fight following Frank Mir 1 that tainted his career and make some people think of him as only average.
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Post by Harry The Arrow was Wrong! on Aug 29, 2015 11:04:00 GMT -5
It works for him. If Cesaro were just doing Euro-cuts or Reigns just Superman punches it would be boring, but Brock spamming moves fits. I assume it's near whatever planet considered Brock the best fighter in the world. One time he WAS ufc WORLD champ... come on people... I love Lesnar and he had a decent run in UFC but lets be honest here, at the time he was nowhere near the best fighter in the world. When he was champion so were Silva and GSP. Those two are contenders for best fighters of all time, Lesnar is not even close to that. On topic, I love Lesnars style of wrestling. It's completely different to anybody else in the company.
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Post by basicdugganomix on Aug 29, 2015 11:54:45 GMT -5
Diverticulitis ended brock's run
Came back way too early for Overeem and Velasquez
They threw him out there with elite guys and he won.
I honestly think pre-surgery brock was a monster
Brock is trying to win. So is rusev. This is still a match i want to see.
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Post by Apricots And A Pear Tree on Aug 29, 2015 11:59:25 GMT -5
Brock's whole aura is tied to his MMA stint at this point. That explains why I don't really give a shit about him.
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suave
Dennis Stamp
"I only got on my knees for God and maybe to lick a girl's pussy" -Teddy Hart
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Post by suave on Aug 29, 2015 12:05:46 GMT -5
I love Brock. He's my favorite in the E right now, no question. I like my wrestling matches to feel like knock down, drag out fights. Like maybe I'm crazy for this, but I loved both Mayweather/Pacquiao and Rock/Cena 1. Why? Because they were built like prizefights. My favorite match ever is Hogan/Andre at WM3 because they were both built up as being unstoppable, and when they fought you really felt like it was an epic event. Brock is the best character in wrestling today. He's an antisocial monster who f***s up everyone. Great gimmicks don't have to be complicated, but they have to be good, and Brock's is the best one going. Every match he's in feels like a legitimate huge matchup, because of the way he's been built and the way he plays the character. He's a cold-hearted destroyer. I love that. Brock for motherf***ing president.
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Post by idislikeeverything on Aug 29, 2015 12:11:58 GMT -5
One time he WAS ufc WORLD champ... come on people... I love Lesnar and he had a decent run in UFC but lets be honest here, at the time he was nowhere near the best fighter in the world. When he was champion so were Silva and GSP. Those two are contenders for best fighters of all time, Lesnar is not even close to that. On topic, I love Lesnars style of wrestling. It's completely different to anybody else in the company. No one is talking in all of MMA - they are talking about in his division. The one he was champ of and, thus, best in. I am baffled how this is so hard for people to understand, lol.
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Post by Harry The Arrow was Wrong! on Aug 29, 2015 15:30:05 GMT -5
I love Lesnar and he had a decent run in UFC but lets be honest here, at the time he was nowhere near the best fighter in the world. When he was champion so were Silva and GSP. Those two are contenders for best fighters of all time, Lesnar is not even close to that. On topic, I love Lesnars style of wrestling. It's completely different to anybody else in the company. No one is talking in all of MMA - they are talking about in his division. The one he was champ of and, thus, best in. I am baffled how this is so hard for people to understand, lol. He said that Lesnar was "the best fighter in the world" and that the other weight divisions were "lesser titles" I'm not gonna argue that Lesnar wasn't the best in UFC HW division at that time because he was. Let's be real though, the HW division was pretty terrible when Lesnar won the belt.
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ASYLUMHAUSEN
Fry's dog Seymour
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Post by ASYLUMHAUSEN on Aug 29, 2015 15:34:18 GMT -5
Brock's whole aura is tied to his MMA stint at this point. That explains why I don't really give a shit about him. I couldn't possibly give less of a shit about MMA/UFC (though I am fascinated by Rhonda Rousey like many, many others) and I think this aspect is exactly what makes Brock fun for some reasons. That, Heyman & the absolute devastation he leaves in his wake.
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Post by idislikeeverything on Aug 29, 2015 15:39:48 GMT -5
No one is talking in all of MMA - they are talking about in his division. The one he was champ of and, thus, best in. I am baffled how this is so hard for people to understand, lol. He said that Lesnar was "the best fighter in the world" and that the other weight divisions were "lesser titles" I'm not gonna argue that Lesnar wasn't the best in UFC HW division at that time because he was. Let's be real though, the HW division was pretty terrible when Lesnar won the belt. Well, I do disagree with other weight divisions being lesser.
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Post by Hit Girl on Aug 29, 2015 16:07:18 GMT -5
I could have watched him suplex Bo for at least a half hour
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Post by misconduct was wrong on Aug 29, 2015 19:16:12 GMT -5
While everyone seems to go out there to wrestle and put on a show, Lesnar goes out there to beat people into a coma. It's a different feel and I love it.
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Post by HMARK Center on Aug 29, 2015 20:09:26 GMT -5
He's just the best. I'm so bored with the usual formula of WWE matches and he's such a breath of fresh air compared to that. This reminds me of what Bryan and Vinny are always saying on their show: "everyone wrestles the same in WWE." Everyone except Lesnar. We all know wrestling is fake, but watching Lesnar makes us suspend disbelief because it looks real: Brock bleeds, repeats moves that are effective, trash talks his opponents and doesn't give a damn what anyone thinks of him - it's so great. He's my favourite guy in all of wrestling and all of his stuff is must-see. I get more enjoyment out of watching him bounce around while Heyman talks than seeing Cena and Owens have the same match with the same sequences for the third time in three months. This is a vital point and a huge reason why I don't really watch WWE; yes, they may have the all-time most athletically gifted roster they've ever had, and yes those guys are capable of wrestling many different styles, but holy shit, do so many of their matches feel identical. I was listening to OSW Review, where Jay and (guest host) Maffew talked about the NXT Brooklyn show, and they brought up how the crowd's investment in Sasha vs. Bayley was built up via a smart, simple storyline that allowed both characters room to breathe and develop, and for the fans to feel passionately about the outcome. Then, come match time, they told another pretty simple story, but did it very, very effectively, and had the crowd red-hot by the end...which is basically the core of pro wrestling. A typical main roster main event match, though, tends to devolve really, really quickly into finisher spamming, and the storylines don't offer much for the wrestlers to integrate into their actual matches. It leaves things feeling monotonous. Now, Brock's "Too Many Suplexes!" style would seem to be a similar strike against him, but he does it in a very different way; Brock doesn't engage in finisher/signature spamming so that you can get a host of false finishes, he does it because "This move hurts you, my goal is to beat you, and I'm going to hurt you in order to accomplish that." Brock wrestles to win, and it makes any match he's in immediately feel infinitely different from just about any other match on the card. He's effectively the only guy that WWE can advertise that can get me interested enough to go out of my way to see a show; with anybody else, even guys I like, I can go into the show knowing I can paint by numbers, so to speak, in terms of how their matches will be structured, what the psychology will be, etc. With Lesnar, it's just "shut up, stop trying to impress the crowd, and take this beating". I do think he'd benefit form varying up a bit for drama's sake, but only when it makes sense; like, the Rollins match would've been a good time for him to vary the suplex offense, since the story should've been "Rollins is too quick and agile to get caught in a German suplex if he knows it's coming".
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Post by molson5 on Aug 29, 2015 20:29:18 GMT -5
No one is talking in all of MMA - they are talking about in his division. The one he was champ of and, thus, best in. I am baffled how this is so hard for people to understand, lol. He said that Lesnar was "the best fighter in the world" and that the other weight divisions were "lesser titles" I'm not gonna argue that Lesnar wasn't the best in UFC HW division at that time because he was. Let's be real though, the HW division was pretty terrible when Lesnar won the belt. I think you could argue that the UFC heavyweight division is weaker now than it was when Brock was champ. Regardless, a healthy Brock dominates a heavyweight MMA division in any promotion. It's true that heavyweight MMA has less talent than other divisions because if you're super-athletic at 245-pounds you're playing in the NFL or NBA. But for those heavyweights who stick with MMA - Brock is better than all of them. A full-time healthy committed Brock would destroy Mir or Struve or Werdum or Nelson or Hunt or Arlovski. A Healthy Brock v. Cain fight might be epic, but Cain might be on the downswing now.
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Post by Harry The Arrow was Wrong! on Aug 29, 2015 22:11:52 GMT -5
He said that Lesnar was "the best fighter in the world" and that the other weight divisions were "lesser titles" I'm not gonna argue that Lesnar wasn't the best in UFC HW division at that time because he was. Let's be real though, the HW division was pretty terrible when Lesnar won the belt. I think you could argue that the UFC heavyweight division is weaker now than it was when Brock was champ. Regardless, a healthy Brock dominates a heavyweight MMA division in any promotion. It's true that heavyweight MMA has less talent than other divisions because if you're super-athletic at 245-pounds you're playing in the NFL or NBA. But for those heavyweights who stick with MMA - Brock is better than all of them. A full-time healthy committed Brock would destroy Mir or Struve or Werdum or Nelson or Hunt or Arlovski. A Healthy Brock v. Cain fight might be epic, but Cain might be on the downswing now. Yeah it is pretty weak now but I wouldn't say Lesnar is better than all of them. I don't think he gets past Werdum, JDS or Stipe even if he has full health. Stipe and JDS are excellent strikers and Werdum is at his best when taken down. The rest I could see him beating.
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