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Post by "Playboy" Don Douglas on Dec 8, 2016 11:14:48 GMT -5
I found Christian quite overrated as both a wrestler and promo (especially as a face) and that Randy Orton beating him for the title after 2 days was both; A: Hilarious & B: Absolutely the right call. Christian should never have been at World Title level. I agree with this, but I also rate him significantly higher than I did Edge. His big push as the top heel was the beginning of my loss of interest in WWE.
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Post by Alice Syndrome on Dec 8, 2016 11:25:32 GMT -5
The WWE's rehab offer and legends deals are a joke. Both have been used in the most cynical way to get former talent, often at the lowest point in their lives to sign away various rights, from royalties from 'future technologies' and their right to sue over injuries sustained on the WWE's watch. As much as people like to rag on Scott Steiner, he's 100% right in the way he's handled the WWE's approaches, consulting a lawyer when he got the first offer for a legends deal, who stated what they wanted him to sign was basically illegal and not worth the paper it's written on. I don't agree with most of what Sunny does, but I'll definitely still sympathize with her for WWE immediately cutting off her funding for the $100 a day rehab she was in after Linda lost her election, and sending her to some shitty bedbug infested one, then calling her ungrateful and cutting her out completely when she tweeted about it.
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Post by 2coldMack is even more baffled on Dec 8, 2016 11:56:48 GMT -5
I find Disco to be severely underrated. I actually find him to be an upgraded version of the Honky Tonk Man, and not just because they both had music related gimmicks. HTM was a guy who was a better character than he was a wrestler, and Disco is a guy who found a pretty solid middle ground as far as working the character into having coherent wrestling matches.
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Post by Alice Syndrome on Dec 8, 2016 13:32:58 GMT -5
Intergender matches are a good thing IMO. When you show a woman being able to kick just as much ass as a man, that's progressive.
I mean, there's the idiotic crap like that Chris Dickison vs Kimber Lee match, but frankly I'd hate the sloppy shit Dickison did if it was against a man too.
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Post by Clash, Never a Meter Maid on Dec 8, 2016 14:22:34 GMT -5
Intergender matches are a good thing IMO. When you show a woman being able to kick just as much ass as a man, that's progressive. I mean, there's the idiotic crap like that Chris Dickison vs Kimber Lee match, but frankly I'd hate the sloppy shit Dickison did if it was against a man too. I would personally like to see more physically powerful women compete in intergender matches, around the 140-180 range. Minoru Suzuki's had some fun intergender stuff with Asuka, Aja Kong, etc. Ex: I love Sasha Banks, but she's super lean and I wouldn't be able to buy her beating the WWE main eventers. But other than that, I agree.
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Post by häšhtå.gdālėÿ on Dec 8, 2016 14:53:19 GMT -5
I found Christian quite overrated as both a wrestler and promo (especially as a face) and that Randy Orton beating him for the title after 2 days was both; A: Hilarious & B: Absolutely the right call. Christian should never have been at World Title level. I agree with this, but I also rate him significantly higher than I did Edge. His big push as the top heel was the beginning of my loss of interest in WWE. Christian >>> Edge? That's insane to me! That's why this thread is neat. Everyone's opinion about wrestling is so wildly varied; and there is no "right"! I personally don't put Christian in the same universe as Edge.
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Post by Citizen Snips on Dec 8, 2016 15:12:36 GMT -5
Intergender matches are a good thing IMO. When you show a woman being able to kick just as much ass as a man, that's progressive. I mean, there's the idiotic crap like that Chris Dickison vs Kimber Lee match, but frankly I'd hate the sloppy shit Dickison did if it was against a man too. I would personally like to see more physically powerful women compete in intergender matches, around the 140-180 range. Minoru Suzuki's had some fun intergender stuff with Asuka, Aja Kong, etc. Ex: I love Sasha Banks, but she's super lean and I wouldn't be able to buy her beating the WWE main eventers. But other than that, I agree. I agree that it depends on the situation. For example, I could buy Charlotte in the Cruiserweight Division or Nia Jax lasting for a spell in the Rumble, but Becky Lynch challenging The Miz would be a step too far.
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Allie Kitsune
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Always Feelin' Foxy.
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Posts: 46,277
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Post by Allie Kitsune on Dec 8, 2016 15:28:06 GMT -5
I would personally like to see more physically powerful women compete in intergender matches, around the 140-180 range. Minoru Suzuki's had some fun intergender stuff with Asuka, Aja Kong, etc. Ex: I love Sasha Banks, but she's super lean and I wouldn't be able to buy her beating the WWE main eventers. But other than that, I agree. I agree that it depends on the situation. For example, I could buy Charlotte in the Cruiserweight Division or Nia Jax lasting for a spell in the Rumble, but Becky Lynch challenging The Miz would be a step too far. Context is pretty much everything. Like if tiny, reckless Sasha tried to do the whole "Eddie beat Brock, so I can beat Brock too, because Eddie!" thing, Brock should mash her like an orange, all that "Making History" stuff aside. But someone bigger/more powerful in with someone closer to their own size? There are ways to make that believable. I wouldn't even think twice if they had Nia Jax squash Curtis Axel. Or even Asuka squashing Curtis Axel.
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Post by Clash, Never a Meter Maid on Dec 8, 2016 16:04:59 GMT -5
I would personally like to see more physically powerful women compete in intergender matches, around the 140-180 range. Minoru Suzuki's had some fun intergender stuff with Asuka, Aja Kong, etc. Ex: I love Sasha Banks, but she's super lean and I wouldn't be able to buy her beating the WWE main eventers. But other than that, I agree. I agree that it depends on the situation. For example, I could buy Charlotte in the Cruiserweight Division or Nia Jax lasting for a spell in the Rumble, but Becky Lynch challenging The Miz would be a step too far. No, that I could buy into. Miz isn't puny, but Lynch is far from a delicate waif herself. Watching Rey Mysterio essentially make Kane look like a goof for a brief period did a lot to alter what I can believe in pro wrestling. I was fine with that.
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Post by The Dark Order Inferno on Dec 8, 2016 16:16:47 GMT -5
I agree with this, but I also rate him significantly higher than I did Edge. His big push as the top heel was the beginning of my loss of interest in WWE. Christian >>> Edge? That's insane to me! That's why this thread is neat. Everyone's opinion about wrestling is so wildly varied; and there is no "right"! I personally don't put Christian in the same universe as Edge. If Edge didn't get to step on Matt Hardy's neck on camera to gain heat, he'd be remembered alongside the likes of Alberto del Rio. They'd been trying to push Edge a long, long time before his scumbag gimmick, from day one he was the guy from that friendship/tag team they wanted on top, even putting him with Hulk Hogan of all people, but it didn't take so they kept on trying. Christian got over on his own and his reward was to be told there was no advancement for him no matter how hard he works to improve, and by the time he finally got near the world title scene he was older and banged up and was never a long term prospect.
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Post by Citizen Snips on Dec 8, 2016 16:29:51 GMT -5
I agree that it depends on the situation. For example, I could buy Charlotte in the Cruiserweight Division or Nia Jax lasting for a spell in the Rumble, but Becky Lynch challenging The Miz would be a step too far. No, that I could buy into. Miz isn't puny, but Lynch is far from a delicate waif herself. Watching Rey Mysterio essentially make Kane look like a goof for a brief period did a lot to alter what I can believe in pro wrestling. I was fine with that. I definitely agree that Becky's well built (I think we have the same unease at tiny Sasha calling out Kevin Owens for a historical main event) and deliberately chose The Miz as he's probably their least physically imposing big name...but for me, seeing them side by side, I couldn't buy Becky making Miz tap. I also thought Rey going toe to toe with Kane was a bit much...Edge, Triple H? Ok. Kane? Nah for me. And don't even get me started on Shane throwing hands with Kane and Taker, and I will apologize in advance for my posts if he ever gets in the ring with Lesnar. It wouldn't be a "Cancel the WWE Network!!" moment or anything, just an agree to disagree on Lynch in that situation. And in the interest of fairness, that segment did end with Miz flailing around like the gutless coward he is.
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Post by "Playboy" Don Douglas on Dec 8, 2016 16:43:36 GMT -5
I agree with this, but I also rate him significantly higher than I did Edge. His big push as the top heel was the beginning of my loss of interest in WWE. Christian >>> Edge? That's insane to me! That's why this thread is neat. Everyone's opinion about wrestling is so wildly varied; and there is no "right"! I personally don't put Christian in the same universe as Edge. Well, in the ring, I put them about the same. I enjoyed their tag work. For me, Edge's promos and facial expressions were just incredibly forced, especially as a heel. It felt like a hammy B actor who wasn't a fan but was aware of wrestling playing the part of a bad guy wrestler. It didn't help that it felt like he feuded with John Cena for 5 years before it had even been one.
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Post by Hit Girl on Dec 8, 2016 16:54:12 GMT -5
I thought Zeus was awesome. While he may have been a terrible wrestler, his wrecking machine superhuman heel persona was superb.
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Futureraven: Beelzebruv
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Post by Futureraven: Beelzebruv on Dec 8, 2016 17:15:10 GMT -5
I thought Zeus was awesome. While he may have been a terrible wrestler, his wrecking machine superhuman heel persona was superb. Same, my first VHS as a kid was Survivor Series 1989, hadn't seen anything before that, and I totally bought him as an unstoppable monster who'd straight up murder you.
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Post by The Dark Order Inferno on Dec 8, 2016 17:54:25 GMT -5
Diesel vs Mabel was not a bad idea. Cool champions should battle monster heels. The problem with Mabel's turn and ascension to main event heel was the speed of it and the lack of change, he went from a JTTS tag team to main event heel without any real repackaging except a king of the ring win and a frown.
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魔界5号
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Post by 魔界5号 on Dec 8, 2016 18:23:55 GMT -5
Big Guns are the best tag team in Japan and serious contenders for best team in the world. Bodyguard has gotten so much better over the years and Zeus has been awesome for a while now.
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Eunös ✈
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Tolerated, just not practically liked.
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Post by Eunös ✈ on Dec 9, 2016 10:16:30 GMT -5
Speaking of Inter gender.
I think Beth Phoenix could have been the next Chyna.
Call me crazy but I could have bought Beth Phoenix as an Intercontinental champion.
I think the overall WWE title would be overkill but I think she could have been a fit in the mid card.
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Post by Jumpin' Jesse Walsh on Dec 9, 2016 10:45:06 GMT -5
Diesel vs Mabel was not a bad idea. Cool champions should battle monster heels. The problem with Mabel's turn and ascension to main event heel was the speed of it and the lack of change, he went from a JTTS tag team to main event heel without any real repackaging except a king of the ring win and a frown. I don't necessarily fault them for thinking that program would work. After all, they did the same with Hogan for years. The main problem is that it wasn't 1985 anymore, and that type of program by the mid '90s was outdated and predictable. And as stated, Mabel wasn't really that dynamic a character to pull it off. I do understand the line of thinking though.
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MWC
Don Corleone
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Post by MWC on Dec 9, 2016 12:13:22 GMT -5
Shawn Michaels/Chris Jericho from WM19 doesn't hold up as well today as it did back then. Prefer Lesnar/Angle and even Rock/Austin today.
ROH's attempt to brand Jay Lethal as the "Greatest ROH Champion Ever" is laughable. Must have heard Kelly/Corino say it a good chunk of times during the Final Battle PPV. Maybe in the current era, but not all-time.
I love PWG and it's probably my favorite company right now but I do have one problem with it. The shows and matches start to blend together. It's lost the "You need to see this show" or "You must see this match" feel. If a friend wants to borrow a PWG show I can just hand them one and know they'll be satisfied.
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Post by Clash, Never a Meter Maid on Dec 9, 2016 13:43:14 GMT -5
No, that I could buy into. Miz isn't puny, but Lynch is far from a delicate waif herself. Watching Rey Mysterio essentially make Kane look like a goof for a brief period did a lot to alter what I can believe in pro wrestling. I was fine with that. I definitely agree that Becky's well built (I think we have the same unease at tiny Sasha calling out Kevin Owens for a historical main event) and deliberately chose The Miz as he's probably their least physically imposing big name...but for me, seeing them side by side, I couldn't buy Becky making Miz tap. I also thought Rey going toe to toe with Kane was a bit much...Edge, Triple H? Ok. Kane? Nah for me. And don't even get me started on Shane throwing hands with Kane and Taker, and I will apologize in advance for my posts if he ever gets in the ring with Lesnar. It wouldn't be a "Cancel the WWE Network!!" moment or anything, just an agree to disagree on Lynch in that situation. And in the interest of fairness, that segment did end with Miz flailing around like the gutless coward he is. Hmmmm....I personally could see a scenario where Miz gets his arm worked on by Lynch, and he only can get a two count after the SCF because he's in too much pain before tapping to a Dis-Arm-Her. But I agree it would depend on the situation and the kinds of workers they are. Someone like Ellsworth, he has no business going over any of the top girls.
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