FinalGwen
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Particularly fond of muffins.
Posts: 16,429
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Post by FinalGwen on Jan 14, 2018 22:33:51 GMT -5
Yes, this is wrong to say. Incredibly wrong. Is it though? Really? If you were talking to a friend and he/she said so I met this person at a bar and then went home with them...what would you assume happened? They went and played board games? I understand what you are saying 100% AND IT SHOULD NOT MEAN CONSENT, but is that the actual reality? I think you'll find a lot of people who disagree. Maybe I'm being too devils advocate/contrarian right now I don't know. I've gone back home with several people without having sex with them. Even after drinking. There are numerous reasons why someone may want to do so, which I outlined in my last post. If they had sexually assaulted me - which thankfully hasn't happened - it would 100% be their fault and not mine. And frankly, the devil has enough people advocating for him right now, it's probably not necessary.
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Post by Fade is a CodyCryBaby on Jan 14, 2018 22:35:39 GMT -5
If she was f***ed up enough, then I could see her not being all there, and him essentially pulling a Cosby and taking full advantage of her. But she stated she felt uncomfortable the second it started...before the rest of the night ensued. I'm trying to imagine if I was this girls father and I'd clearly wanna beat the shit out of the guy, but I'd be slightly upset and bewildered at her as to why she didn't leave from the beginning when she told him to chill, and said she herself felt uncomfortable. Maybe age comes into play, if shes young and naive enough, I don't remember if the article stated her age. So a part of you would victim blame your own daughter? I would be upset if she was rationale enough to feel uncomfortable from the get-go why she didn't leave. Why she didn't text or call her friends, her family, police, anyone. I'm not victim blaming, both parties come come across incredibly bad in this situation. Azis comes off as thirsty, pushy, and desperate. She comes off as someone that could have taken action, left, but didn't and even sent signals (oral) that may have made him think she was giving consent. My mother was raped at knife-point when she was a young woman. My GF has maced and called the cops on men cat-calling her and trying to talk to her. By this girls own account, Azis wasn't violent. She even was in the bathroom for a while. She should of left the second she felt uncomfortable and it sounds like she could have. Does it make Azis any less of a creep that she didn't? No. Again..I think both parties don't come off looking well and that's by the girls own account.
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The Ichi
Patti Mayonnaise
AGGRESSIVE Executive Janitor of the Third Floor Manager's Bathroom
Posts: 37,286
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Post by The Ichi on Jan 14, 2018 22:38:18 GMT -5
Because entering someone's house, whether after drinking or not, does not give them implicit permission to have sex with you. This isn't some kind of f***ed up vampire contract. This is the worst kind of victim blaming. You might want to go back to someone's house to watch stuff together, to keep partying and chatting, to make out a bunch, or hell, to do specific kinds of sexual acts but not others on that night. (In this specific case, beyond your blanket statement, she even says how she said that maybe certain things could wait until a second date, but that was not respected.) So... Why when Ansari showed that as long as she stayed there, he was going to try to initiate sex, did she not just leave? It isn’t like he was forcing her to stay, he was just doing shitty drunk sex moves. Just leave. Because she was drunk and possibly waiting for a taxi/friend to pick her up? You've never been out drinking and ended up at someone's house because the bar closed? It doesn't mean sex has to happen, this isn't the movies.
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Post by Fade is a CodyCryBaby on Jan 14, 2018 22:41:41 GMT -5
So... Why when Ansari showed that as long as she stayed there, he was going to try to initiate sex, did she not just leave? It isn’t like he was forcing her to stay, he was just doing shitty drunk sex moves. Just leave. Because she was drunk and possibly waiting for a taxi/friend to pick her up? You've never been out drinking and ended up at someone's house because the bar closed? It doesn't mean sex has to happen, this isn't the movies. There's no indication she was drunk. In fact it's said they left the restaurant hastily, so it's unclear how inebriated she was, but she clearly is able to recollect the events of the night, and was rationale enough to feel uncomfortable when he first started touching her and even stopped him verbally. That doesn't sound like someone who's drunk. Again..she's 22. So maybe. I dunno this girls tolerance level.
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chazraps
Wade Wilson
Better have my money when I come-a collect!
Posts: 27,956
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Post by chazraps on Jan 14, 2018 22:44:12 GMT -5
This f***ing thread. Just nuke it and burn the ashes.
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Post by abjordans on Jan 14, 2018 22:48:35 GMT -5
So... Why when Ansari showed that as long as she stayed there, he was going to try to initiate sex, did she not just leave? It isn’t like he was forcing her to stay, he was just doing shitty drunk sex moves. Just leave. Because she was drunk and possibly waiting for a taxi/friend to pick her up? You've never been out drinking and ended up at someone's house because the bar closed? It doesn't mean sex has to happen, this isn't the movies. That doesn’t seem to really be what was going on there though. She admitted to being naked with him and performing oral sex more than once. She got up on the kitchen counter as soon as they walked in, i mean is that not a pretty clear sign to make a move? I mean it is kind of universal, especially in that situation. I am not saying Aziz wasn’t obnoxious, but I am not sure being obnoxious and drunk and horny deserves this kind of public shame.
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Post by Shy Guy on Jan 14, 2018 22:49:31 GMT -5
This f***ing thread. Just nuke it and burn the ashes.
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Post by 1 Free Moon-Down with Burger on Jan 14, 2018 22:51:20 GMT -5
Can Netflix get ONE person that isn't in trouble?!
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Post by abjordans on Jan 14, 2018 22:53:22 GMT -5
This f***ing thread. Just nuke it and burn the ashes. I feel like you can’t talk about anything on this board. Is it not a valid discussion in this day and age where the line is drawn on issues like this? Does every awkward sexual encounter someone has have to ruin their career now? I am not excusing rape whatsoever, but I don’t think that doesn’t mean you can’t discuss the instances when things don’t seem so cut and dry.
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Kyn
Don Corleone
Posts: 1,623
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Post by Kyn on Jan 14, 2018 22:54:03 GMT -5
She got up on the kitchen counter as soon as they walked in, i mean is that not a pretty clear sign to make a move? Um, no? I've sat on more than one kitchen counter, drunk and sober, and it has literally never occurred to me that it was an invitation for sex. I wasn't signalling my availability - "Hey dudes, I'm tipsy & sitting on a counter, now's the time to hit on me!"
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Post by Shy Guy on Jan 14, 2018 22:55:58 GMT -5
I feel like you can’t talk about anything on this board. Is it not a valid discussion in this day and age where the line is drawn on issues like this? Does every awkward sexual encounter someone has have to ruin their career now? I am not excusing rape whatsoever, but I don’t think that doesn’t mean you can’t discuss the instances when things don’t seem so cut and dry. This thread can keep going, I just checked out when someone mentioned "real victims", and and someone openly admitting they would question their own daughter if she was in a situation like this. This is a very serious topic, so if things aren't "cut and dry", I think people should be careful with their words, instead of pointing fingers immediately
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Post by The Last Hero on Jan 14, 2018 22:56:52 GMT -5
I've gone back home with several people without having sex with them. Even after drinking. There are numerous reasons why someone may want to do so, which I outlined in my last post. I still don't think that is the experience or thought process of most people. I'm not saying it's right, but I think it's a reality that can reasonably be acknowledged.
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Post by abjordans on Jan 14, 2018 22:56:54 GMT -5
She got up on the kitchen counter as soon as they walked in, i mean is that not a pretty clear sign to make a move? Um, no? I've sat on more than one kitchen counter, drunk and sober, and it has literally never occurred to me that it was an invitation for sex. Yea if you strip away all context of what was going on that is the case.
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Kyn
Don Corleone
Posts: 1,623
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Post by Kyn on Jan 14, 2018 23:01:52 GMT -5
Um, no? I've sat on more than one kitchen counter, drunk and sober, and it has literally never occurred to me that it was an invitation for sex. Yea if you strip away all context of what was going on that is the case. With context, the idea that someone is signalling their sexual availability by sitting on a counter is still ludicrous.
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Post by abjordans on Jan 14, 2018 23:05:27 GMT -5
Yea if you strip away all context of what was going on that is the case. With context, the idea that someone is signalling their sexual availability by sitting on a counter is ludicrous. You know there is a difference between jumping up on a countertop and having a conversation and getting on a counter when kissing and undressing with someone. When I have been in that situation, things are usually getting hot and heavy. I am not some weirdo with a counter fetish, but I mean, that is a typical move of an escalating makeout session. And anyway, you are focusing in on a little detail and ignoring my overall point: that this girl, by her own words and account of the night, was giving EXTREMELY mixed signals.
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Post by Pooh Carlson on Jan 14, 2018 23:08:51 GMT -5
When they walked back in, she complimented his marble countertops. According to Grace, Ansari turned the compliment into an invitation.
“He said something along the lines of, ‘How about you hop up and take a seat?’”
WHAT DOES SHE THINK IS GONNA HAPPEN? Aziz definitely should've pulled back obviously, but you can also, uh, use freakin common sense and not put yourself in a situation like this.
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Kyn
Don Corleone
Posts: 1,623
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Post by Kyn on Jan 14, 2018 23:09:41 GMT -5
With context, the idea that someone is signalling their sexual availability by sitting on a counter is ludicrous. You know there is a difference between jumping up on a countertop and having a conversation and getting on a counter when kissing and undressing with someone. When I have been in that situation, things are usually getting hot and heavy. I am not some weirdo with a counter fetish, but I mean, that is a typical move of an escalating makeout session. They weren't kissing or undressing at that point. From the article: "When they walked back in, she complimented his marble countertops. According to Grace, Ansari turned the compliment into an invitation. “He said something along the lines of, ‘How about you hop up and take a seat?’” Within moments, he was kissing her." ETA: I'm out now, before I get heated.
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Post by abjordans on Jan 14, 2018 23:11:23 GMT -5
You know there is a difference between jumping up on a countertop and having a conversation and getting on a counter when kissing and undressing with someone. When I have been in that situation, things are usually getting hot and heavy. I am not some weirdo with a counter fetish, but I mean, that is a typical move of an escalating makeout session. They weren't kissing or undressing at that point. From the article: "When they walked back in, she complimented his marble countertops. According to Grace, Ansari turned the compliment into an invitation. “He said something along the lines of, ‘How about you hop up and take a seat?’” Within moments, he was kissing her." He invidted her to “hop up and take a seat” and she did! Come on, this is an adult, she knows what is going on.
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Post by The Last Hero on Jan 14, 2018 23:14:57 GMT -5
The solution is; "Hey can I do this?" then get a yes/no before doing anything. Sure maybe it's a "beta" move but its almost foolproof.
K.
/thread?
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Post by abjordans on Jan 14, 2018 23:19:31 GMT -5
The solution is; "Hey can I do this?" then get a yes/no before doing anything. Sure maybe it's a "beta" move but its almost foolproof. K. /thread? Hey, I ain’t saying Aziz has smooth moves and wasn’t obnoxious as hell. But, was a crime committed or a tellall necessary? I am not sold on that whatsoever.
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