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Post by Final Countdown Jones on Sept 27, 2018 18:36:49 GMT -5
Imagine if AJ took the money and kicked around a few more years. No reinvention, no Bullet Club, no aggressive statement of "Nah I'm the f***ing best and just doesn't TNA wasn't using me right doesn't mean I don't still have it". He lacks that spark and leverage to make the big WWE move, probably doesn't land as good a deal as he does at the time he did, either he doesn't come to the main roster right away or he does so more of a midcarder and not a guy Vince will have a vested financial interest in pushing to the main event. Just crazy to think how much that TNA offer changed the course of his career and sent the ripples it did through the rest of wrestling in the process. It's rare TNA f***s it up so bad they do the rest of the wrestling world a net positive, but here we are.
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Shark
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Post by Shark on Sept 27, 2018 19:00:15 GMT -5
That maybe the smartest thing I've heard a wrestler say. Not just because of TNA but every company. I'm sure at some point they do it for the love of wrestling and to be a part of it but at some point you have to make money, not everyone can do this for a hobby. AJ definitely has the right mindset with regards to this. To quote The Joker, "If you're good at something, never do it for free." As I get older, I look back at some of the guys like Kevin Nash that said that they mainly just did wrestling for the money. And honestly, I can't judge them for that mindset. If you're at a job as physically demanding as pro wrestling is, you should be looking to get the best payday that you can get. I also wonder: by TNA's standards, how much was AJ getting paid in the first place, before the proposed pay cut? Treating the business like a business is the smartest thing you can really do. Maximize your earnings, set yourself up for the future. I can't be mad at them for having that mindset especially when promoters will think nothing of spitting them out without a second thought. It's true of all employers really. Be as loyal to them as they are to you.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 27, 2018 21:19:41 GMT -5
I’m not sure where those TNA guys would be if they stayed in the company.
I mean... they had to go to WWE sometime, right? They can’t have just wondered “What if”... Roode said it himself.
It’s a shame TNA couldn’t have become that rival. They had so much potential back in 2005-2011. Losing the Spike deal, changing the six sided ring and rebranding the show to “Impact Wrestling” ruined it IMO. Then they started giving the title to the likes of Chris Sabin, Eric Young, Magnus and EC3. It was decisions like that that made most fans like myself say “... This doesn’t matter any more.”
In my opinion none of those guys had any business being World Champ. To go from Styles, Joe, Angle, Sting, Roode etc to those guys just made TNA feel super Indy when they were always presented as a big deal. At least... they always believed they were.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 27, 2018 21:27:14 GMT -5
I’m not sure where those TNA guys would be if they stayed in the company. I mean... they had to go to WWE sometime, right? They can’t have just wondered “What if”... Roode said it himself. It’s a shame TNA couldn’t have become that rival. They had so much potential back in 2005-2011. Losing the Spike deal, changing the six sided ring and rebranding the show to “Impact Wrestling” ruined it IMO. Then they started giving the title to the likes of Chris Sabin, Eric Young, Magnus and EC3. It was decisions like that that made most fans like myself say “... This doesn’t matter any more.” In my opinion none of those guys had any business being World Champ. To go from Styles, Joe, Angle, Sting, Roode etc to those guys just made TNA feel super Indy when they were always presented as a big deal. At least... they always believed they were. Those others are debatable, but I'm going to 100% disagree on EC3. Yeah, he's kind of fallen off in perception since, but at the time he was red hot and pretty much the only thing in TNA anyone had anything positive to say about.
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Post by BrodietheSlayer on Sept 27, 2018 21:28:26 GMT -5
That's why I don't really care that some of the IWC have become bored with AJ's World Title run. Dude deserved to be made "The Man," at least on some level, by a major American based wrestling organization, and I'm glad at least Vince/WWE were smart enough to make him that. It's sad that Dixie and some of the others in charge of TNA never truly got that, and it's a major reason why the company was nothing more than a bombed out husk at the beginning of the year.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 27, 2018 21:58:27 GMT -5
What that tells me is AJ Styles can’t math if he says that’s over a 60% cut, though to be fair I didn’t really figure he could. I recall a different news tidbit that said TNA's offer was for a really low guarantee that would have ended up worth something similar to his old deal if he worked enough dates. That guaranteed amount may be what AJ was referring to when he said the offer was over a 60% pay cut.
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on Sept 27, 2018 21:59:59 GMT -5
Imagine if AJ took the money and kicked around a few more years. No reinvention, no Bullet Club, no aggressive statement of "Nah I'm the f***ing best and just doesn't TNA wasn't using me right doesn't mean I don't still have it". He lacks that spark and leverage to make the big WWE move, probably doesn't land as good a deal as he does at the time he did, either he doesn't come to the main roster right away or he does so more of a midcarder and not a guy Vince will have a vested financial interest in pushing to the main event. Just crazy to think how much that TNA offer changed the course of his career and sent the ripples it did through the rest of wrestling in the process. It's rare TNA f***s it up so bad they do the rest of the wrestling world a net positive, but here we are. It's a life changing decision he made
He went from making $350K to over $2Mill 4 years later in WWE
Hell, even consider this; does he still keep the AJ Styles name? Samoa Joe as far as his contributions to current guys right now is undervalued. He's the reason guys are coming from Indies and Japan and able to keep the name people associate them with instead of switching it. If AJ stays in TNA he's probably like Roode, EY, Joe where 2 of those guys got top runs in NXT but they were down their coaching before they came up to the main roster so that's another 2 years off his career
James Storm opened the door for TNA guys, Samoa Joe knocked the door open for indie guys to be able to keep their names and some their value, and AJ has knocked it out the park more than you could have ever hoped. Vince went from let's see what he can do, to f*** it he's our guy and one of the first guys in a long time where he came from another company as a big name (2 in fact) and Vince still made him one his stars
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Post by Final Countdown Jones on Sept 27, 2018 22:12:01 GMT -5
Imagine if AJ took the money and kicked around a few more years. No reinvention, no Bullet Club, no aggressive statement of "Nah I'm the f***ing best and just doesn't TNA wasn't using me right doesn't mean I don't still have it". He lacks that spark and leverage to make the big WWE move, probably doesn't land as good a deal as he does at the time he did, either he doesn't come to the main roster right away or he does so more of a midcarder and not a guy Vince will have a vested financial interest in pushing to the main event. Just crazy to think how much that TNA offer changed the course of his career and sent the ripples it did through the rest of wrestling in the process. It's rare TNA f***s it up so bad they do the rest of the wrestling world a net positive, but here we are. It's a life changing decision he made He went from making $350K to over $2Mill 4 years later in WWE Hell, even consider this; does he still keep the AJ Styles name? Samoa Joe as far as his contributions to current guys right now is undervalued. He's the reason guys are coming from Indies and Japan and able to keep the name people associate them with instead of switching it. If AJ stays in TNA he's probably like Roode, EY, Joe where 2 of those guys got top runs in NXT but they were down their coaching before they came up to the main roster so that's another 2 years off his career James Storm opened the door for TNA guys, Samoa Joe knocked the door open for indie guys to be able to keep their names and some their value, and AJ has knocked it out the park more than you could have ever hoped. Vince went from let's see what he can do, to f*** it he's our guy and one of the first guys in a long time where he came from another company as a big name (2 in fact) and Vince still made him one his stars
Well what's crazy about it is that AJ at once feels like a guy who got WWE-ified and turned into a "Vince creation" while also feeling 100% like AJ Styles. Like no amount of forced marketing phrases from Cole can change that he's still AJ. It's probably just on him as a talent for making it work, but he's survived Vinceification so much better than pretty much anyone else who made their name elsewhere.
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on Sept 27, 2018 22:21:50 GMT -5
It's a life changing decision he made He went from making $350K to over $2Mill 4 years later in WWE Hell, even consider this; does he still keep the AJ Styles name? Samoa Joe as far as his contributions to current guys right now is undervalued. He's the reason guys are coming from Indies and Japan and able to keep the name people associate them with instead of switching it. If AJ stays in TNA he's probably like Roode, EY, Joe where 2 of those guys got top runs in NXT but they were down their coaching before they came up to the main roster so that's another 2 years off his career James Storm opened the door for TNA guys, Samoa Joe knocked the door open for indie guys to be able to keep their names and some their value, and AJ has knocked it out the park more than you could have ever hoped. Vince went from let's see what he can do, to f*** it he's our guy and one of the first guys in a long time where he came from another company as a big name (2 in fact) and Vince still made him one his stars
Well what's crazy about it is that AJ at once feels like a guy who got WWE-ified and turned into a "Vince creation" while also feeling 100% like AJ Styles. Like no amount of forced marketing phrases from Cole can change that he's still AJ. It's probably just on him as a talent for making it work, but he's survived Vinceification so much better than pretty much anyone else who made their name elsewhere. And that's what makes him special
At the end of the day when he came into WWE he was a finished product as far as character and presentation goes because it all goes back to him being phenomenal which itself is a great nickname
Sure you have typical Vince humor especially during his babyface run so far but overall he's a guy who takes little direction (Vince told him to be a pitbull) and use it in his favor. As soon as he came into the door he felt like a WWE superstar as compared to a guy trying to adapt to be one
Dixie wasn't wrong in a sense when she said AJ was coming into his own when he was at the end of his TNA run but I think she meant it totally different from what we actually got to see from him
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Post by Susan "Poison" Candy on Sept 27, 2018 22:23:18 GMT -5
I'd love for there to be a roast of Dixie Carter where she has to sit there and listen to every stupid thing she's done for six hours. That could be the reality show you were so desperate for, Dixie! ”welcome to the Comedy Central roast of Dixie Carter presented by Daffney featuring roast master Jesse Sorensen” Eric Young: Watching Dixie Carter running a company is like watching Stephen Hawking run.
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Post by 2coldMack is even more baffled on Sept 28, 2018 1:59:12 GMT -5
Imagine if AJ took the money and kicked around a few more years. No reinvention, no Bullet Club, no aggressive statement of "Nah I'm the f***ing best and just doesn't TNA wasn't using me right doesn't mean I don't still have it". He lacks that spark and leverage to make the big WWE move, probably doesn't land as good a deal as he does at the time he did, either he doesn't come to the main roster right away or he does so more of a midcarder and not a guy Vince will have a vested financial interest in pushing to the main event. Just crazy to think how much that TNA offer changed the course of his career and sent the ripples it did through the rest of wrestling in the process. It's rare TNA f***s it up so bad they do the rest of the wrestling world a net positive, but here we are. Like, no shit, just look at it through one facet: If AJ takes that offer, where is the Bullet Club now? Are they nearly even as over as they are now?
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Post by Final Countdown Jones on Sept 28, 2018 2:14:29 GMT -5
Imagine if AJ took the money and kicked around a few more years. No reinvention, no Bullet Club, no aggressive statement of "Nah I'm the f***ing best and just doesn't TNA wasn't using me right doesn't mean I don't still have it". He lacks that spark and leverage to make the big WWE move, probably doesn't land as good a deal as he does at the time he did, either he doesn't come to the main roster right away or he does so more of a midcarder and not a guy Vince will have a vested financial interest in pushing to the main event. Just crazy to think how much that TNA offer changed the course of his career and sent the ripples it did through the rest of wrestling in the process. It's rare TNA f***s it up so bad they do the rest of the wrestling world a net positive, but here we are. Like, no shit, just look at it through one facet: If AJ takes that offer, where is the Bullet Club now? Are they nearly even as over as they are now? f***, bigger than Bullet Club; think about that period of New Japan and how rare and elusive the IWGP title was; only five guys have held it in the past seven years, and AJ was the first one to break the Okada/Tana cycle. How completely f***ing different would New Japan's main event scene be without AJ in there? Would we have seen IWGP Heavyweight Champion Karl Anderson? Without AJ to negotiate a deal for him and Gallows, does Omega even become the new leader and have his main event ascension? Would that give Naito the position of dethroning Okada's big run after all? God this really f***s up everything.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 28, 2018 3:08:46 GMT -5
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Post by EoE: Well There's Your Problem on Sept 28, 2018 3:41:06 GMT -5
Like, no shit, just look at it through one facet: If AJ takes that offer, where is the Bullet Club now? Are they nearly even as over as they are now? f***, bigger than Bullet Club; think about that period of New Japan and how rare and elusive the IWGP title was; only five guys have held it in the past seven years, and AJ was the first one to break the Okada/Tana cycle. How completely f***ing different would New Japan's main event scene be without AJ in there? Would we have seen IWGP Heavyweight Champion Karl Anderson? Without AJ to negotiate a deal for him and Gallows, does Omega even become the new leader and have his main event ascension? Would that give Naito the position of dethroning Okada's big run after all? God this really f***s up everything. Butterfly effect moments are really some of the most utterly fascinating parts of being a wrestling fan.
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Post by 111111 on Sept 28, 2018 6:08:14 GMT -5
He wasn't even asking for a pay rise, he was asking for the same amount he was already getting which is actually a paycut when you take inflation in to account.
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Post by Futureraven: Beelzebruv on Sept 28, 2018 9:04:10 GMT -5
Like, no shit, just look at it through one facet: If AJ takes that offer, where is the Bullet Club now? Are they nearly even as over as they are now? f***, bigger than Bullet Club; think about that period of New Japan and how rare and elusive the IWGP title was; only five guys have held it in the past seven years, and AJ was the first one to break the Okada/Tana cycle. How completely f***ing different would New Japan's main event scene be without AJ in there? Would we have seen IWGP Heavyweight Champion Karl Anderson? Without AJ to negotiate a deal for him and Gallows, does Omega even become the new leader and have his main event ascension? Would that give Naito the position of dethroning Okada's big run after all? God this really f***s up everything. Even going back to Bullet Club, if he doesn't give them the momentum, do Omega/The Buck/Scurll have anything like the momentum that can get them into Hot Topic, almost showing a whole new life to do business outside WWE. Would something like All In ever have happened? A one off indy show with that much hype behind it. It's a totally different landscape.
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Post by Dr. T is an alien on Sept 28, 2018 12:16:21 GMT -5
What that tells me is AJ Styles can’t math if he says that’s over a 60% cut, though to be fair I didn’t really figure he could. I think he might have thought that they were offering a contract worth 57% of what he made before, which would be generous to call 60%.
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Post by cabbageboy on Sept 28, 2018 14:24:48 GMT -5
That's the ultimate hilarity of TNA. In 2013 Styles revamped his look and character to a darker, slightly slowed down wrestler. He was right on the precipice of being something huge. So of course TNA ends up making no money off of him, low balls him big time on a new deal, and then Styles immediately jumps to NJPW and joins the Bullet Club, wins the IWGP title, and goes on to become WWE champion 3 years later.
What all of this signified was that Dixie had spent so much on the Hogan/Bischoff era that TNA was financially wrecked. The surreal nature of it is that they had AJ win the BFG Series in 2013 and dethrone Bully Ray at BFG...all the while asking him to take a 60% pay cut?! That's like saying the guy is good enough to main event for you, win the title, but not to get paid.
That was AJ Pritchard referred to in his podcast where he wanted to sign him a year earlier but Dixie stalled it off and then AJ quit.
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Post by héad.casé on Sept 29, 2018 6:17:21 GMT -5
The funniest part about all this is the night AJ dropped the title to Magnus and left, they protected and booked him like 80's Hogan in that match.
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Post by OVO 40 hunched over like he 80 on Sept 29, 2018 10:04:17 GMT -5
Abyss would’ve taken a hundred percent pay cut.
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