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Post by Deleted on Jan 31, 2019 23:42:03 GMT -5
it’s weird my guy friends are more accepting to the women being treated as bad ass wrestlers than my women friends who like sexy soap opera storylines and when they wear cute regular clothes their just not fans of women fighting in general and they’d much rather fawn over Seth,Finn,Randall Orton and Roman.
One of the big problems is there’s so few women that are top tier performers you got Becky,Charlotte and Asuka and that’s pretty much it the rest of the women are just kinda there and aren’t treated as important and don’t get consistent tv time and when they do appear it’s just to lose.Alexa is a great talker yet they constantly give her horrible segments,Ronda talks way too much for someone that’s not good at it but she’s shined in the ring when she practices the match all week,Sasha hasn’t really ever truly clicked on the main roster and you can say the same for bayley.They need to learn how to book an actual division and get these women consistently on tv so these women can show their personality’s take Liv Morgan what do we know about her? She’s a cute blonde with a blue tongue that hangs out with 2 other chicks and loses a lot that’s not a character and it’s a shame because i’ve seen things of her outside of wwe where she’s overflowing with personality maybe instead of 205 Live they should just have an all women’s show so the fans can become familiar with all these women because the way they do it now if your not a fan of Becky,Charlotte,Asuka,Ronda and Alexa your out of luck cause none of the other women are being given the time to delevop and why would anybody be a fan of the other women on the roster when the company does so little with them?
In 2018 my favorite matches were from the women’s division the only problem is it’s the same couple women facing eachother over and over and that gets old quick.Plus not every fan thinks the same and they like different things out of WWE and if none of the current top handful of pushed women stars don’t appeal to them they have no reason to invest in the division.
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Post by eJm on Jan 31, 2019 23:46:14 GMT -5
Ironically, the biggest thing WWE did for equality was booking the women’s division like the men’s, where very few people get characters of substance and everyone else is bouncing around waiting for a good angle to be pitched and accepted by Vince.
So instead of them being a separate issue in the company like it used to be, they’re pretty much lumped in with the wider issue of lack of real interest to build character and building off reputations of a show only a third of their TV audience watches weekly.
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Nr1Humanoid
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Post by Nr1Humanoid on Feb 1, 2019 6:19:59 GMT -5
Getting rid of the stink of the Diva label is a lot to overcome. That and old Effie making herself the face of the women's revolution. As far as I know, Vince or whoever writes the script for commentary make them say stuff like that. Despite her on screen heel character, she really doesn’t seem as egotistical as most make her out to be. Fair enough. Yet, at the same time you have spontaneous stuff slapping Dusty Rhodes'hand away.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 1, 2019 7:53:44 GMT -5
As far as I know, Vince or whoever writes the script for commentary make them say stuff like that. Despite her on screen heel character, she really doesn’t seem as egotistical as most make her out to be. Fair enough. Yet, at the same time you have spontaneous stuff slapping Dusty Rhodes'hand away. To be fair, I wouldn’t have liked having another person shove their hand in my face haha
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Post by The Thread Barbi on Feb 1, 2019 9:57:18 GMT -5
Frankly I think WWE has been doing a better job with the women than it has with the men for a year or more. That's because of Aurora Rose and her sisters. As soon as she's come of age, she will debut at the Wrestlemania main event, winning the WWE, Women's, and Universal titles at once.
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Post by "Gizzark" Mike Wronglevenay on Feb 1, 2019 10:03:22 GMT -5
Frankly I think WWE has been doing a better job with the women than it has with the men for a year or more. That's because of Aurora Rose and her sisters. As soon as she's come of age, she will debut at the Wrestlemania main event, winning the WWE, Women's, and Universal titles at once. I love Triple H and Steph so if their kids are half as talented as they are I may well be totally okay with it.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 1, 2019 10:09:34 GMT -5
Frankly I think WWE has been doing a better job with the women than it has with the men for a year or more. That's because of Aurora Rose and her sisters. As soon as she's come of age, she will debut at the Wrestlemania main event, winning the WWE, Women's, and Universal titles at once. Again, I sincerely hope this idea of a near 50 year old Triple H still being this big of an egomaniac and a near 50 year old Stephanie actually being her on screen persona in real life are just a meme. There’s no way they’re even remotely close to being this evil and as egotistical as most paint them as.
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Post by lookout on Feb 1, 2019 11:09:20 GMT -5
That's because of Aurora Rose and her sisters. As soon as she's come of age, she will debut at the Wrestlemania main event, winning the WWE, Women's, and Universal titles at once. Again, I sincerely hope this idea of a near 50 year old Triple H still being this big of an egomaniac and a near 50 year old Stephanie actually being her on screen persona in real life are just a meme. There’s no way they’re even remotely close to being this evil and as egotistical as most paint them as. Of course he isn't. I'm sure back in the day he had his moments of selfishness but if anyone takes the time to watch the behind the scenes videos or listen to the actual current talent, HHH is the exact opposite these days in his current role. The dude swells with pride and even gets choked up every time a young talent puts on a great match, but especially the women it seems. The memes and jokes about him i think have long since ran their course and are unfair to him today.
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Post by The Thread Barbi on Feb 1, 2019 12:09:17 GMT -5
Guys, I wasn't being serious H and Stephanie have done more for the coming generation and honoured the past way more than Papa Vince ever did.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 1, 2019 14:39:05 GMT -5
Guys, I wasn't being serious H and Stephanie have done more for the coming generation and honoured the past way more than Papa Vince ever did. Yeah, I figured haha no worries man. Aurora for universal champion, dammit!
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Post by Kevin Hamilton on Feb 1, 2019 19:33:06 GMT -5
Wrestling is a niche product. Singling out women's wrestling is as dopey as singling out tag team wrestling. It's ALL niche.
But women be shoppin mirite?
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Post by Final Countdown Jones on Feb 1, 2019 21:03:06 GMT -5
I can't even buy into the idea it's niche or strongly contributing to audience decline like some have bafflingly said when you look at the reactions that the top women get. But even if it was, WWE's sports entertainment format at its absolute strongest and most interesting is a variety show. When it has a variety of in-ring styles and tones for its matches. Give me some tag stuff, some womens' stuff, some comedy stuff. Show me submission specialists wrangling people into holds, high flyers leaping off of shit, and power dudes lifting fully grown human beings like they weigh nothing. The women clearly have a large portion of the audience behind them, their matches are bangers, and as long as there is a strong appeal and demand, there's really no ground to stand on in trying to back up the fact you don't personally like something with weird claims and theories and facts trying to claim it's hurting the show or people don't really like it.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 1, 2019 21:13:57 GMT -5
It really is wild how far the division has come even just from five years ago. WrestleMania 35, it's looking VERY likely the Raw Women's title will main event. WrestleMania 30? They shoved the entire division into a single match and used it as the piss-break post-end-of-the-streak, then after calling up really the first of the new faces of the division in Paige the next night, had her win the belt in one move then go on to do a terrible lesbian angle with AJ that went nowhere. Then come Mania 31 the only women's match on the card was the two of them beating the Bellas in under seven minutes. Wrestling is a niche product. Singling out women's wrestling is as dopey as singling out tag team wrestling. It's ALL niche. But women be shoppin mirite? Honestly I'd say it's MORE dopey than that. I could at least theoretically get why someone might have a point with tag wrestling since it's at least a markedly different style by its very nature so I could see it being reasonable that someone might like one but not the other. End of the day there really isn't a difference between a good men's match and a good women's match.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 1, 2019 21:15:10 GMT -5
I think people overcompensate because they feel the need to “make up” for the attitude era. The matches are mostly bland and they don’t really have a story. If not for Rhonda they would be still opening the show and most of them should be. Charlotte / Sasha main-evented a PPV long before Rousey was part of the company.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 1, 2019 21:19:05 GMT -5
Wrestling is a niche product. Singling out women's wrestling is as dopey as singling out tag team wrestling. It's ALL niche. But women be shoppin mirite? And what is the deal with wimmin' thinking they can be athletes too? I mean, come on, show us a tit! Real talk though, I've been more invested in women's storylines the last few years than the men's. The last men's moment that gave me chills was Miz cashing in Money in the Bank on Orton. Every damn week with Becky I'm feeling the same way as that. And I post the gifs for laughs and I know she doesn't get a lot of respect online, but give me a good Nikki Bella forearm beatdown over some stupid flippy move from a Finn Balor or a Dolph Ziggler any day. At a fundamental level, the women are doing a lot of good stuff right now. There's room for men and women and if they both can draw then wrestling as a whole will be better for it.
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Shai
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Post by Shai on Feb 1, 2019 22:30:31 GMT -5
I think people overcompensate because they feel the need to “make up” for the attitude era. The matches are mostly bland and they don’t really have a story. If not for Rhonda they would be still opening the show and most of them should be. Charlotte / Sasha main-evented a PPV long before Rousey was part of the company. This. Don't give Ronda the credit for that please. Charlotte/Sasha HITC happened what 4 months before she showed up?
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Post by Deleted on Feb 1, 2019 22:48:17 GMT -5
Charlotte / Sasha main-evented a PPV long before Rousey was part of the company. This. Don't give Ronda the credit for that please. Charlotte/Sasha HITC happened what 4 months before she showed up? Lot longer than that. That was October 2016, she showed up in January 2018.
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Matt
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Post by Matt on Feb 2, 2019 1:18:38 GMT -5
Wrestling is a niche product. Singling out women's wrestling is as dopey as singling out tag team wrestling. It's ALL niche. But women be shoppin mirite? And what is the deal with wimmin' thinking they can be athletes too? I mean, come on, show us a tit! Real talk though, I've been more invested in women's storylines the last few years than the men's. The last men's moment that gave me chills was Miz cashing in Money in the Bank on Orton. Every damn week with Becky I'm feeling the same way as that. And I post the gifs for laughs and I know she doesn't get a lot of respect online, but give me a good Nikki Bella forearm beatdown over some stupid flippy move from a Finn Balor or a Dolph Ziggler any day. At a fundamental level, the women are doing a lot of good stuff right now. There's room for men and women and if they both can draw then wrestling as a whole will be better for it. What’s the biggest thread on this board? It features the women mostly in bikinis and ass shots from Raw. I don’t think it’s fair to call it out like show us a tit.
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Post by Clash, Never a Meter Maid on Feb 2, 2019 7:27:44 GMT -5
Believe it or not my mom had a similar reaction to the Rumble when I talked to her about it on Monday, something to the effect of "They have to stop with all these women. That show was just too long and wore me out." Here's a cold hard dose of reality: Women's wrestling is a niche product. It isn't a draw. The only time an actual women's feud did draw was something like Wendi Richter vs. Moolah and that was billed as quite literally Richter ending Moolah's 28 year title reign. And it had Cyndi Lauper for mainstream MTV crossover appeal. Frankly I think WWE misread the room on this one. The whole "Give divas a chance!" deal was a reaction to a frankly insulting 30 second match with the Bellas and whoever. A chance means give this like 6 minutes. It didn't mean entire women's Royal Rumbles, HIAC matches, Elimination Chambers, Money in the Bank, etc. The serious dilemma is that women's titles over the past 20 years mean basically nothing, but now WWE is focusing more time and creative into titles that try as they might just don't MATTER very much. Say what you want about stuff like the Mandy Rose angle but I can at least grasp that it's targeting a specific demo. That's one massive problem the whole Women's Revolution has. There's really no target audience for it. A lot of grown women don't want to watch women's wrestling. They want hunky beefcake men. Younger men 18-35 don't care about this either, since they would prefer hard hitting men's wrestling or sexualized women (as noted elsewhere here). Viewers over 50 have zero use for women's wrestling in general, having never had it as a major part of their wrestling experience. So basically you're left with a target audience of preteen girls, which is just never going to be a real serious demo for a wrestling product. That's the problem with WWE to me right now. The whole product has no target audience. You can appeal to kids and families like in the 1980s. You can go hard after a male 18-35 demo like the Attitude Era and the guys dragged the girls to the arenas with them. WWE says they appeal to kids but the show is full of ambiguous characters that aren't clearly good or bad, angles that would confuse, shows that are too long, etc. 8 year old me was instantly fascinated by Hogan/Andre with Dibiase wanting to buy the belt. 8 year old me would not want to see a bunch of women on a wrestling show. Maybe a wild undercard deal like the Jumping Bomb Angels, but not like 40% of the show. What I don't think people here realize is that fans don't have to "adjust" to anything. If WWE has veered too far away from what they want, they don't adjust. They stop watching. Every intelligent wrestling company makes adjustments to their product if they want to continue making money. Look at WWE when they launched Attitude. Look at WCW when they went international and pushed into new markets outside of the southern US, look at how NJPW has become more character oriented over the years. And those risks/adjustments paid off for them. WWE's primary demographic is wrestling fans, and all wrestling fans don't entirely consist of guys. And it's wildly inaccurate to automatically assume as such. "Hunky beefcake men" and sexualized women have never, ever been the primary draw for a wrestling show, and that's even less true in 2019. I've spoken to female wrestling fans, and yes, they want to see hard-hitting women's wrestling where most of the workers are taken seriously. The market for serious women's wrestling exists, it's real. If it wasn't, then Becky, Rousey, Flair or Asuka wouldn't be as over as they are today with crowds. Gender isn't going to matter with WWE fans if they showcase the workers to look like stars. And women's titles, much like any belt, are as important as a promotion claims they are. The way WWE announcers and video packages are hyping up the feuds for the Raw and Smackdown Women's Titles? Yeah, they're being made more important than ever. As a kid I liked hot girls as much as the next hetero boy, but I watched Superstars and Raw/Smackdown because I wanted to see fights. At least for me, I thought Bull Nakano was a badass and I liked women like Alundra Blayze, and Trish Stratus after she stepped up her game, stopped the bra/panties crap and became a better worker. The Kat bored me, I wasn't into Kelly Kelly and Torrie made me roll my eyes much of the time. And I wasn't alone in that sentiment.
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Post by David-Arquette was in WCW 2000 on Feb 2, 2019 11:56:55 GMT -5
I am of the minority that just isn't a fan of women's wrestling, good or bad. I am happy for them that the women's revolution is happening, and there is a roster full of talent, I'm just not in to it.
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