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Post by Magic knows Black Lives Matter on Oct 5, 2019 11:58:19 GMT -5
Aight, I've slept on it. Here's my two big thoughts. f*** Brock Lesnar and his punk ass daddy. I am...actually ok with this? It's like MMA when somebody gets blasted with a lucky shot in the opening seconds and loses. You didn't get beat, you got caught. It's happened to the best in the world, including Brock himself. If Kofi had to lose, I prefer this than him getting beat in a usual 8 minute Brock fest. That being said, the boy better getting strapped up at Mania after slapping Brock around or I'mma be hot.
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Post by EoE: Well There's Your Problem on Oct 5, 2019 12:09:02 GMT -5
OK, so being a stat guy, here's a little graphic I whipped up of the 61 recognised world champions there have been in WWE and their recognised combined time as either WWE Champion, World Heavyweight Champion or Universal Champion: Only 353 of that total was in Lesnar's full-time run in 2002-2004. They've given the bloke nearly three years with the belt as a part-timer. (And again, I say this every time I mention this stat, it's shocking how little Reigns has actually been world champion given how hard they've pushed him)
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Post by eJm on Oct 5, 2019 12:10:49 GMT -5
For me, after some time thinking about it, I’m not offended by it as much as not surprised. Of course this is how Kofi’s reign was going to end. Of course all of his build was going to end in 7-8 seconds. Like, how else was it going to end? A 10 minute competitive match like Bryan and Balor had? Don’t be stupid.
To put it simply, this is the stuff that keeps me from WWE in general. NXT I need the time to watch fully but main roster can clear off, really.
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Post by carp (SPC, Itoh Respect Army) on Oct 5, 2019 12:23:08 GMT -5
I'm not talking about kayfabe, I'm talking about real life because from the fan's perspective, the hero Kofi was beaten by Brock and then they brought in a UFC guy to face Brock while he's tossed to the side. Fans these days aren't stupid, they know how the inner workings go. Isn't that... like, it's not exactly a worked shoot, but it's the same kind of logic, right? The story is written such that 'real things' are the reason fans should care? And isn't this giving them way too much credit? Maybe they're not sneakily trying to give the impression that Kofi will absolutely never pin Brock because the bookers think Brock is better because MMA and Kofi isn't on his level and big tough guys are the only ones they think fans should care about.... maybe all that's actually just true?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 5, 2019 12:29:07 GMT -5
I'm not talking about kayfabe, I'm talking about real life because from the fan's perspective, the hero Kofi was beaten by Brock and then they brought in a UFC guy to face Brock while he's tossed to the side. Fans these days aren't stupid, they know how the inner workings go. Isn't that... like, it's not exactly a worked shoot, but it's the same kind of logic, right? The story is written such that 'real things' are the reason fans should care? And isn't this giving them way too much credit? Maybe they're not sneakily trying to give the impression that Kofi will absolutely never pin Brock because the bookers think Brock is better because MMA and Kofi isn't on his level and big tough guys are the only ones they think fans should care about.... maybe all that's actually just true? Yeah that's what it is. The company is smarter than most fans think and when it comes to this booking they knew that fans would hate the result which in turn makes Kofi a martyr for bad booking and gets fans behind him. I mean Lesnar's entire storyline over the past 18 months is that he's a guy paid big money to come and take over, doesn't wrestle much and everyone hates it which is pretty realistic. It's not giving them too much credit because they've used this storyline in the past when it comes to Lesnar and the same when it comes to underdogs. Besides Kofi, last night they pretty much said "MMA guys are better than WWE guys" when Cain had to come out and save Mysterio so everyone in WWE falls right in line. Doesn't matter who, Vince loves his MMA people. Even Ronda herself was running roughshod until she got booed.
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mrbananagrabber
King Koopa
Paul Heyman's unofficial joke writer
Posts: 11,823
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Post by mrbananagrabber on Oct 5, 2019 12:54:52 GMT -5
I’m not able to watch WWE due to reasons and I feel like I’m missing a lot.
Welp, no, I’m not.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 5, 2019 13:04:52 GMT -5
I’m seeing a lot of comments that the title loss was so disrespectful to Kofi. Did people think Cena getting destroyed by Brock for his title was so disrespectful too? I don’t recall a similar reaction when that happened. The Cena thing was different because Cena was the status quo. He was super established for over a decade to the point he could comfortably afford being absolutely crushed and it put Lesnar fully on the map as the most unstoppable force in the company. Not to mention Cena still had a way more competitive match than Kofi did.
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Post by eJm on Oct 5, 2019 13:12:14 GMT -5
I’m seeing a lot of comments that the title loss was so disrespectful to Kofi. Did people think Cena getting destroyed by Brock for his title was so disrespectful too? I don’t recall a similar reaction when that happened. The Cena thing was different because Cena was the status quo. He was super established for over a decade to the point he could comfortably afford being absolutely crushed and it put Lesnar fully on the map as the most unstoppable force in the company. Not to mention Cena still had a way more competitive match than Kofi did. Like, it felt like a big moment because it literally never happened to Cena before outside of, what, the Nexus beatdown?
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on Oct 5, 2019 13:18:07 GMT -5
For me, after some time thinking about it, I’m not offended by it as much as not surprised. Of course this is how Kofi’s reign was going to end. Of course all of his build was going to end in 7-8 seconds. Like, how else was it going to end? A 10 minute competitive match like Bryan and Balor had? Don’t be stupid. To put it simply, this is the stuff that keeps me from WWE in general. NXT I need the time to watch fully but main roster can clear off, really. Wednesday Nights are the saving grace
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Post by Some Baritone guy IS REDEEMED! on Oct 5, 2019 13:32:51 GMT -5
I'm not really mad that Lesnar won the title again. I'm not happy about it, but I had resigned myself to that the moment this match was announced.
I'm not even mad that they're taking Kofi out of the title picture for the sake of Cain Velasquez. After all I figured Kofi Kingston wasn't going to be in the main event scene once his title reign ended, because that was just how fan favorite champions end up.
What I'm mad about is the disrespectful way this was done, and how much of a slap in the face this was to Kofi Kingston, to the fans who have supported him, the people who paid for tickets to see this "match", and to the entirety of the Smackdown roster since February.
After they spent the entire time between then and now having the roster do everything to make Kofi Kingston into not only a credible world champion, but look like legitimately one of the best in the world combined with Kofi Kingston's own amazing work, making him the most universally beloved world champion since Daniel Bryan, we as fans who have supported WWE deserved a better ending to this saga. The roster deserved a better ending, and most of all Kofi Kingston deserved a better ending than this.
I know any underdog story eventually ends when the champion finally loses his world title. But WWE cheated its fans out of watching their champion face the monster who had dominated RAW for years, to go head to head with him, give him the fight of his life, give every last ounce of courage and strength he has before finally succumbing to the unstoppable might of the beast.
Instead we get 9 seconds. We get a match that basically declared to us "The last 9 months are effectively null and void. Now back to the status quo."
Kofi's title win was one of the few moments in wrestling that nearly moved me to tears.
And he deserved better than this.
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TWERKIN' MAGGLE
Crow T. Robot
Black Lives Matter
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Member is Online
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Post by TWERKIN' MAGGLE on Oct 5, 2019 13:36:28 GMT -5
I think that Vince shouldn't be served at restaurants until he fixes his terrible booking. And he should never be allowed to have steak again regardless of that.
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Nosnorb
El Dandy
Nachos and Fraggle Rock are TIMELESS.
Posts: 7,796
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Post by Nosnorb on Oct 5, 2019 13:37:42 GMT -5
It's like MMA when somebody gets blasted with a lucky shot in the opening seconds and loses. You didn't get beat, you got caught. It's happened to the best in the world, including Brock himself. If Kofi had to lose, I prefer this than him getting beat in a usual 8 minute Brock fest. That being said, the boy better getting strapped up at Mania after slapping Brock around or I'mma be hot. Kofi got beat. The MMA match I was reminded of was CM Punk's first time in the cage. Kofi losing was pretty similar to that - dude walked (or rather ran and jumped) straight into an F5.
Brock got lucky that Kofi made such a massive mistake.
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on Oct 5, 2019 13:49:22 GMT -5
It's like MMA when somebody gets blasted with a lucky shot in the opening seconds and loses. You didn't get beat, you got caught. It's happened to the best in the world, including Brock himself. If Kofi had to lose, I prefer this than him getting beat in a usual 8 minute Brock fest. That being said, the boy better getting strapped up at Mania after slapping Brock around or I'mma be hot. Kofi got beat. The MMA match I was reminded of was CM Punk's first time in the cage. Kofi losing was pretty similar to that - dude walked (or rather ran and jumped) straight into an F5.
Brock got lucky that Kofi made such a massive mistake.
Exactly how I looked at it myself
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Post by Rudy Gobert Fadeaway on Oct 5, 2019 13:56:35 GMT -5
My general opinion of this a day later is that
If they do something to build on this with Kofi that's like actually substantial??? This is great If they don't do shit with this and Kofi just goes on to do unrelated midcard to upper midcard stuff? This is awful
The stuff with Cain I cannot defend in any capacity though. That shit had me laughing like a hyena.
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Post by Vanilla Gorilla on Oct 5, 2019 14:31:45 GMT -5
Just trying to reconcile this versus Backlund/Diesel. Different time and era. Different circumstances between Backlund and Kofi. Trying to build a new star versus going back to the same old nonsense. Putting over New Generation talent instead of old school talent versus MMA talent over wrestling talent.
This just feels different. It feels reductive and insulting. The transparency and audacity of it all.
I hope this isn’t the end for Kofi as a main eventer. Maybe a Royal Rumble win is next for him.
I am trying to collect my thoughts and I am struggling to. This is the closest I have been to walking away from WWE altogether since Katie Vick. With AEW here I have a place to go. Thank goodness.
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schma
Hank Scorpio
Posts: 6,889
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Post by schma on Oct 5, 2019 14:33:17 GMT -5
WWE has lost their way. They would never have treated any of their champions from the 80's or 90's the way they treated Kofi last night. Even when Brock killed Cena it was still a longer match and Cena had some hope spots to at least put up a fight. Kofi has been champion since Wrestlemania and just lost in 10 seconds last night. I know it's fake and predetermined but he's got to be pretty frustrated, wouldn't blame him if he decided to take some time off and reassess what he wants to do with his career. I don't blame Brock. He does exactly what he's told with no care for anything else other than getting paid. It's creative's fault for booking it that way. They could have told Brock to lost in 10 seconds and he'd have done it if they paid him. I sure would love to know what kofi really thinks..and if he protested it any. Because if he didnt he should have...unless they are planning a rematch where he gets it back. Exactly right about brock...its all vinces call on how his matches go...I'm not sure why people get so mad at him when he's just doing what he's told. If vince wanted a 20 minute match to make kofi look good losing, brock would have done it...but that obviously isnt what vince wanted so why get mad at him? Vince deserves all the fire from everyone in this situation. To be fair, Brock has been shown in the past to wield some power over the booking of the match to the point where the people he's working with need to clear ideas by him. Now this, was probably all Vince but Brock is not always blameless for his lazy matches.
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on Oct 5, 2019 14:39:30 GMT -5
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 5, 2019 14:43:01 GMT -5
Aight, I've slept on it. Here's my two big thoughts. f*** Brock Lesnar and his punk ass daddy. I am...actually ok with this? It's like MMA when somebody gets blasted with a lucky shot in the opening seconds and loses. You didn't get beat, you got caught. It's happened to the best in the world, including Brock himself. If Kofi had to lose, I prefer this than him getting beat in a usual 8 minute Brock fest. That being said, the boy better getting strapped up at Mania after slapping Brock around or I'mma be hot. Interesting you say that because here's what Lance Storm just said
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mattperiolat
King Koopa
Thank you, Brodie... for everything.
Posts: 11,445
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Post by mattperiolat on Oct 5, 2019 14:45:22 GMT -5
Nine seconds. That’s the part that hurts. And it’s BROCK. AGAIN.
That’s why I’m salty. Now, to be fair, I’m not even watching WWE at the moment, I’ve gotten so tired of this, but Kofi was a bright spot over the past year - unexpectedly so. A talent who earned it, made good on it and drew money. And he was happy. Made us happy too.
I have no clue what will happen to him now, which is the fear. I just don’t want him forgotten, not after this. WWE needs to give back after all he gave.
Oh, and this from Bryan:
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on Oct 5, 2019 14:45:42 GMT -5
Aight, I've slept on it. Here's my two big thoughts. f*** Brock Lesnar and his punk ass daddy. I am...actually ok with this? It's like MMA when somebody gets blasted with a lucky shot in the opening seconds and loses. You didn't get beat, you got caught. It's happened to the best in the world, including Brock himself. If Kofi had to lose, I prefer this than him getting beat in a usual 8 minute Brock fest. That being said, the boy better getting strapped up at Mania after slapping Brock around or I'mma be hot. Interesting you say that because he's what Lance Storm just said Thank you Lance because I feel like I have been saying this since the beginning but not that articulated Combat sports have the tendency to have a flash finish. Hell, the UFC premiere on Fox was hyped up with this big HW title match and I believe it ended in like 1 min with Dos Santos knocking out Cain
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