Mozenrath
FANatic
Foppery and Whim
Speedy Speed Boy
Posts: 121,125
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Post by Mozenrath on Apr 26, 2022 6:27:24 GMT -5
In what may be best described as everyone dodging a bullet, Marty Scurll could never quite nab the RoH World title even if he was the most over person in the company many times over. Then the pandemic saved him from almost certainly being the one to take the 10 pounds of gold from Aldis. He even choked at having a post-Speaking Out career because his ego wouldn't allow him to keep a low profile. Granted, AEW and now ROH wouldn't have been options regardless, but still. |
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Post by drjayphd (feat. Pitbull) on Apr 26, 2022 10:36:44 GMT -5
Bray Wyatt couldn’t win a feud to save his life. In fact his last feud murdered The Feind Bray won a bunch of feuds. the problem (especially pre-feind) was it didn't matter when he won or lost... because his feuds were all built on literally nothing. they were busy work feuds based on vague and spooky nonsense that basically existed either because they couldn't figure out how to end someone else's feud... or because was so important they needed to do something but they didn't have anything to do...That's probably the worst part of it too, they started to set it up as The Fiend Changes You and it should have been a vehicle to make permanent changes to characters (like the edict from Vince recently about turning more people) but more often than not, the long term ramapercussions were wet fart sounds. |
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Post by Instant Classic on Apr 26, 2022 10:58:55 GMT -5
Brown Strowman any time he wrestled for the universal title.
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CMWaters
Ozymandius
Rolled a Seven, Beat the Ads.
Bald and busy
Posts: 63,089 
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Post by CMWaters on Apr 26, 2022 11:31:07 GMT -5
WWF Vader. This was him in WCW:  This was him in WWF:  |
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Apr 26, 2022 11:40:06 GMT -5
Brown Strowman any time he wrestled for the universal title. I am convinced that Vince booked Braun to choke as a way to curb his ego, and it just didn't work. |
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Post by Rolent Tex on Apr 26, 2022 15:49:58 GMT -5
How about that Ryback fellow during his main event run?
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Post by XaviersSS2015hair on Apr 26, 2022 16:14:19 GMT -5
Brown Strowman any time he wrestled for the universal title. I am convinced that Vince booked Braun to choke as a way to curb his ego, and it just didn't work. I'm convinced Braun was never meant to be a top guy. Braun was supposed to be just another giant they fed to Roman since this was the era of, MAKE ROMAN LOOK STRONG!!! As fans universally rejected Roman. But the hatred for Roman was so strong that they started cheering Braun because they were happy just seeing Roman get beaten up. I was at Payback 2017 and fans were red hot for everything Braun did and shit all over everything Roman did. I believe Braun was elevated to main eventer and perennial contender simply based on the face reactions he was getting in the Roman feud. They were basically forced to turn Braun and use him. Combined with the fact Braun looks like something Vince McMahon came up with in a wet dream he had. |
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Post by A Platypus Rave on Apr 26, 2022 16:33:27 GMT -5
I am convinced that Vince booked Braun to choke as a way to curb his ego, and it just didn't work. I'm convinced Braun was never meant to be a top guy. Braun was supposed to be just another giant they fed to Roman since this was the era of, MAKE ROMAN LOOK STRONG!!! As fans universally rejected Roman. But the hatred for Roman was so strong that they started cheering Braun because they were happy just seeing Roman get beaten up. I was at Payback 2017 and fans were red hot for everything Braun did and shit all over everything Roman did. I believe Braun was elevated to main eventer and perennial contender simply based on the face reactions he was getting in the Roman feud. They were basically forced to turn Braun and use him. Combined with the fact Braun looks like something Vince McMahon came up with in a wet dream he had. Braun was absolutely meant to be the next big monster heel... but they debuted him against Roman at the point the crowd was probably the most hostile towards him (and he just gave an all time best heel promo the week before) ... combined with just how COMICALLY long the beating was there was no way the crowd weren't going to be totally behind Strowman as the face of the feud. |
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Post by XaviersSS2015hair on Apr 26, 2022 19:01:50 GMT -5
I'm convinced Braun was never meant to be a top guy. Braun was supposed to be just another giant they fed to Roman since this was the era of, MAKE ROMAN LOOK STRONG!!! As fans universally rejected Roman. But the hatred for Roman was so strong that they started cheering Braun because they were happy just seeing Roman get beaten up. I was at Payback 2017 and fans were red hot for everything Braun did and shit all over everything Roman did. I believe Braun was elevated to main eventer and perennial contender simply based on the face reactions he was getting in the Roman feud. They were basically forced to turn Braun and use him. Combined with the fact Braun looks like something Vince McMahon came up with in a wet dream he had. Braun was absolutely meant to be the next big monster heel... but they debuted him against Roman at the point the crowd was probably the most hostile towards him (and he just gave an all time best heel promo the week before) ... combined with just how COMICALLY long the beating was there was no way the crowd weren't going to be totally behind Strowman as the face of the feud. What was Braun even doing before the Roman feud? I remember he was a Wyatt, then he wasn't and then I don't remember anything about him until the Roman feud. |
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Post by A Platypus Rave on Apr 26, 2022 19:09:27 GMT -5
Braun was absolutely meant to be the next big monster heel... but they debuted him against Roman at the point the crowd was probably the most hostile towards him (and he just gave an all time best heel promo the week before) ... combined with just how COMICALLY long the beating was there was no way the crowd weren't going to be totally behind Strowman as the face of the feud. What was Braun even doing before the Roman feud? I remember he was a Wyatt, then he wasn't and then I don't remember anything about him until the Roman feud. I think he was just crushing nobodies. |
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CMWaters
Ozymandius
Rolled a Seven, Beat the Ads.
Bald and busy
Posts: 63,089
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Post by CMWaters on Apr 26, 2022 21:01:57 GMT -5
Braun was absolutely meant to be the next big monster heel... but they debuted him against Roman at the point the crowd was probably the most hostile towards him (and he just gave an all time best heel promo the week before) ... combined with just how COMICALLY long the beating was there was no way the crowd weren't going to be totally behind Strowman as the face of the feud. What was Braun even doing before the Roman feud? I remember he was a Wyatt, then he wasn't and then I don't remember anything about him until the Roman feud. Well, he did set the path of a certain chinless wonder for a bit... |
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Post by Some Baritone guy IS REDEEMED! on Apr 28, 2022 6:34:34 GMT -5
Christopher Daniels. Even when he was leading The Prophecy, the title went to Xavier, the worst champion ROH has ever had. And how many times did he get kneecapped in TNA? The point in that storyline was how bad of a champion Xavier was though. Christopher Daniels, who was against everything ROH stood for, installed a clearly unworthy champion who was the opposite of what ROH was meant to be. Meanwhile he had the champion playing second fiddle to him, making him and his agenda above the world title and the world champion. The rest of his ROH career however... |
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Post by bogussting on Apr 30, 2022 0:34:33 GMT -5
This is the biggest problem with Cornette's ROH booking. So many times someone would get hot, but then the chase would get so prolonged after coming up short so many times that the prospect of a new potential main eventer getting crowned arrived with a "just get it over with" feeling. That's one of the great unheralded things that Delirious' booking immediately corrected. Was Cornette booking during Lex Luger's title chases in 1988, 1990 and 1993? It would explain why he used to defend the chokejobs: "Package wasn't ready yet." Now, Cornette says Luger never wanted to be the top guy. But he also kind of shits on the WWF for making Luger look like an assclown and a "plate full of piss." |
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Post by Some Baritone guy IS REDEEMED! on Apr 30, 2022 15:36:34 GMT -5
How about Tyler Black in ROH? The dude was a choke artist of the highest order. I mean he was the Vincent Van Gogh of choking.
His first title opportunity was against Nigel McGuinness, in a match he won by winning a 4 corners match earlier in the night. He gives a valiant effort giving Nigel McGuinness all that he can handle and more, but in the end McGuinness pulls it out and retains, but he certainly gives enough that you're left thinking that on a night where he hadn't already wrestled he might have been able to beat Nigel.
Five months later, he gets another shot this time in a 4 way elimination match also featuring Bryan Danielson, and Claudio Castagnoli. Black outlasts them to once again come face to face with Nigel McGuinness. In spite of a valiant effort he again comes up just short. But still you get the impression that in a fair 1 on 1 match, he could beat Nigel.
And in the new year he gets his chance, and does indeed beat Nigel!
... In a non title match. He gets a rematch for the title the following night, but again fails to win due to a Locker room clearing brawl at the 30 minute mark, interference on both sides from the likes of Jimmy Jacobs, Austin Aries, and Jerry Lynn, and then the match ending about 10 minutes early in a time limit draw. I don't think it was ever explained why the match ended so early, although the error was acknowledged. It was never made into a big storyline deal though, leading me to believe that it was a botch and a full 60 minutes was the plan, but somebody f***ed up.
But he does get another shot about a month later in another 4 way elimination match also featuring Jimmy Jacobs and Jerry Lynn. He outlasts Lynn, before getting eliminated via countout. Nigel retained and basically booted Black out of the title picture for as long as he had the belt given that was his 4th failed attempt at the gold during McGuinness' reign.
Fortunately for Tyler, Nigel's title loss would not be long in the coming as he would soon be dethroned by Jerry Lynn. This would lead Tyler Black to a 1 fall 4 way title match also involving Aries and Danielson. Lynn pins Danielson to retain the title. Same old story which is now really starting to wear thin: Tyler Black comes close but again comes up short.
Six days later Tyler Black faces Jerry Lynn one on one and pins him clean as a sheet!
... In a non title match. But don't worry the following night he does the same thing in the title match this time!
... It's just too bad it was a three way elimination match and Austin Aries pinned him cleanly shortly thereafter to win the title. To emphasize the point: Tyler Black got two title opportunities in the span of a week, and lost both times fair and square.
It was around this time the fans began to lose sympathy for Tyler Black. He'd stopped being a great wrestler who was failing through no fault of his own and just due to hard luck, and into a guy who has been given countless opportunities, and make goods on the times he was screwed out of title and just wasn't good enough to get the job done.
A little over a month later he gets another shot at the belt, this time in a 4 corners match involving McGuinness and Lynn. Once again he loses, albeit due to outside interference when he was just about to take it. That doesn't change the fact that this was his FIFTH TITLE OPPORTUNITY SINCE THE BEGINNING OF 2009 AND HE STILL HASN'T GOTTEN THE JOB DONE!
The year is then set to cap off with Tyler Black Vs. Austin Aries. The culmination of Tyler's year long title hunt. Seemingly this is his moment to get the job done and finally fulfill his destiny...
And instead it's a 60 minute match featuring 20 minutes of stalling, Aries trying to get DQ'd and/or counted out, a totally disinterested and hostile crowd who was bored out of their mind this whole match, and finally a time limit draw. Meaning, yep you guessed it: Tyler Black choked yet again after an entire year of build to him finally taking it. Yes, Aries cheated his ass off, and yes Tyler survived it all, but when you have 6 title matches in one year and the best you can manage is a draw, it's very hard to take you seriously as a main eventer.
Even the moment where he finally won the damn belt wasn't really satisfying because they had to pretty much totally alter the ruleset in his favor in order to help him win. See Aries had been wrestling as a super sneaky heel for the better part of 2009, and a large portion of his style was stalling and trolling the crowd and his opponents. The natural remedy for this, especially given the previous match, would be make the match one in which the title would change hands on DQ or Countout, and remove the time limit, removing all avenues for Aries to retain the belt beyond a decisive win over Black, making it a level playing field where the better man would be champion.
Instead, Jim Cornette decided that the match would be scored by three ringside judges. This meant that the judges would score the bout if the match went to a draw, double DQ, double countout, double pin, double knockout, or if either party got DQ'd or counted out. Effectively, the only outcome in which they wouldn't score the bout, was if it ended by pinfall or submission. This meant that Aries was effectively forced to wrestle Tyler's kind of match, because his stalling methodical approach might not win over the judges. Sure enough Black scores the win, since the ruleset more or less forced Aries into a mad sprint for the belt.
In the end it felt less like the conquering hero overcoming his hated nemesis to finally climb the one mountain he could never reach the peak of, and more like management desperately doing everything in their power to get the belt on their poster boy, who would never run out of chances no matter how many times he failed to get the job done.
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Post by Susan "Poison" Candy on Apr 30, 2022 15:53:16 GMT -5
Unfortunately, Lex Luger. Repeatedly came close in ‘88 but no. Came close again in ‘90 but no. Finally won it in ‘91 but only after Flair left. The Lex Express ran out of gas and he was made to look like a doofus by celebrating a count out win like he’d won the big one. Then he finally wins the WCW title from Hogan in a big moment on Nitro…and lost it back in the same week. Did they ever say why they went along with that big celebration at the end of Summerslam when he won by count out as if he won the title? |
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Post by Starshine on Apr 30, 2022 19:34:03 GMT -5
Christopher Daniels. Even when he was leading The Prophecy, the title went to Xavier, the worst champion ROH has ever had. And how many times did he get kneecapped in TNA? The point in that storyline was how bad of a champion Xavier was though. Christopher Daniels, who was against everything ROH stood for, installed a clearly unworthy champion who was the opposite of what ROH was meant to be. Meanwhile he had the champion playing second fiddle to him, making him and his agenda above the world title and the world champion. The rest of his ROH career however... To be fair Xavier got better, and had some genuinely good matches with Paul London and John Walters. I just think the overall stink of that title reign was too hard to overcome, and unless he suddenly became a top tier world class wrestler, that albatross was always going to hang around his neck. |
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Post by noobeast on Apr 30, 2022 19:56:57 GMT -5
.....Nailz?
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Post by jimmyjackezekiel on Apr 30, 2022 20:18:51 GMT -5
Scott Hall, Monty Brown, Raven, Rhyno, Samoa Joe....
Pretty much everyone who got beat by Slapnuts in early TNA.
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Post by "Playboy" Don Douglas on Apr 30, 2022 20:30:49 GMT -5
WWF Vader. This was him in WCW: This was him in WWF: I know it would have gotten him fired, and despite how stiff he was, Vader was a sensitive and I don’t think would have deliberately hurt someone. But part of me wishes Vader had roughed him up a bit. Nothing serious, nothing that would cause him to miss the show the next night. Just enough to maybe make him think twice about being such a prick. |
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Nosnorb
El Dandy
Nachos and Fraggle Rock are TIMELESS.
Posts: 7,713
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Post by Nosnorb on May 29, 2022 21:55:18 GMT -5
Guess we can add Ruby Soho to the list after tonight.
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