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Post by peaches1 on Oct 31, 2022 14:44:18 GMT -5
I mean look how popular Captain America is. The trick of Captain America is that he's usually standing up against the internal problems of the United States, though. And even when Cap is fighting some kind of foreign based adversary part there's always the element of the story where America's own institutions are either compromised or in cahoots with the villains.
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Post by Dr. Bolty, Disaster Enby on Oct 31, 2022 14:47:38 GMT -5
The trick of Captain America is that he's usually standing up against the internal problems of the United States, though. And even when Cap is fighting some kind of foreign based adversary part there's always the element of the story where America's own institutions are either compromised or in cahoots with the villains. Yeah. And to bring it back to the topic: I just don't think pro wrestling is set up to tell stories like this.
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Burst
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Post by Burst on Oct 31, 2022 15:05:43 GMT -5
I feel like you can have patriotism, it just needs to not be somebody's entire gimmick, and if you're going to make it the focus of an angle you've got to pick your battles carefully and tastefully. Doesn't even necessarily have to be US patriotism either; guarantee if you somehow managed to book Vladimir Kozlov/Oleg Prudius (can't remember what his current ring name is) vs Ilja Dragunov, that'd probably be the biggest babyface pop Oleg's gotten his entire career.
To keep on with that example, I feel like for it to work, you kinda have to let things be as implicit as you can get away with, because the most explicit you get, the more exploitative or insensitive it's going to end up being. So like, sure, let Ilja cut a heel promo about Oleg being a WWE wash-out blah blah blah, but nothing actually referencing current events, and just let the babyface shut him up as babyfaces do.
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Cranjis McBasketball
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Knew what the hell that thing was supposed to be
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Post by Cranjis McBasketball on Oct 31, 2022 18:42:09 GMT -5
Long title reigns. Look at how some are losing patience with Roman? He’s clearly super over with live crowds. It’s just 25 years of conditioning that the title should change every 6 weeks that has the online community upset.
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Post by buckethead on Oct 31, 2022 19:32:46 GMT -5
Angles where a woman has to go on a date or do something even worse if their friend/partner loses. That one angle with Dusty, Tully, and Babydoll still blows my mind.
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Mozenrath
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Post by Mozenrath on Oct 31, 2022 20:57:19 GMT -5
Long title reigns. Look at how some are losing patience with Roman? He’s clearly super over with live crowds. It’s just 25 years of conditioning that the title should change every 6 weeks that has the online community upset. They're addressing some of the problems, but I think that, in addition to the phantom of "crash TV" quick title changes still showing their head, it wouldn't be an issue if they built other people up as effectively. They fixed so many problems with Roman and his credibility as a character, but I get the critique people have that it doesn't have to be all or nothing, exactly. I'm less bored of him with Sami in the mix, at least, that has breathed new life in.
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El Pollo Guerrera
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Post by El Pollo Guerrera on Oct 31, 2022 20:59:24 GMT -5
When Umaga happened, wasn't there a statement or release or something where he said 'this is a tribute to my heritage'?
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Ozman
Samurai Cop
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Post by Ozman on Nov 1, 2022 19:01:27 GMT -5
Hacksaw Jim Duggan. The idea of an overly patriotic babyface wouldn’t work in modern wrestling. Jack Swagger and Zeb Colter were the closest to that gimmick in modern wrestling, and they were heels.
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Sephiroth
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Post by Sephiroth on Nov 1, 2022 19:52:58 GMT -5
I can't imagine the gimmick of a Ugandan cannibal tribesman being played straight would work at all now. Honestly, I don't know how Umaga worked in the mid 2000's. The wild untamed land of untamed savages known as *checks notes*... American Samoa? It was played to perfection, from his look to his move set to how he was booked. The fact the mid and was relatively lackluster at the time also made it easier for even such a character to make a big impact. These days the Samoan savage has given way to the Samoan gangsta. Three minute warning, the Samoan swat team, the cusps at varying times in their careers, and Jacob Fatu are all examples.
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Post by A Platypus Rave on Nov 2, 2022 2:10:54 GMT -5
Honestly, I don't know how Umaga worked in the mid 2000's. The wild untamed land of untamed savages known as *checks notes*... American Samoa? It was played to perfection, from his look to his move set to how he was booked. The fact the mid and was relatively lackluster at the time also made it easier for even such a character to make a big impact. These days the Samoan savage has given way to the Samoan gangsta. Three minute warning, the Samoan swat team, the cusps at varying times in their careers, and Jacob Fatu are all examples. Also while he had the look of a savage it was one of those things they never said outright... though the commentators reacting in shock that he could speak was pretty dumb >_> (Especially since he would yell like For Samoa at least once a match >_>)
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Sephiroth
Wade Wilson
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Post by Sephiroth on Nov 2, 2022 9:32:52 GMT -5
Going to dispute: the evil foreign heel still works and always will, it just needs to be done right, and by the right performer. It does help if they have the right kind of face to work off. The last to do it right were Rusev and Lana; tensions with Russia were high (again) and the two of them played it to absolute perfection. Cena may not have been a Captain America good guy, but his image leaned just enough in that direction to me him an excellent foil. The gimmick could use some updating for our times, and Mohammed Hassan actually showed sone great potential that way before it all went belly up. For my part, I think an anti-US Latin American shtick has potential, LAX leaned a bit that way but didn’t go full bore with it. I could see an embittered Mexican, Cuban, Brazilian, Venezuelan, etc. who is put to do honor to the proud heritage of his country and to put an end to the USA’s meddling in their affairs-one superstar at a time.
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Allie Kitsune
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Post by Allie Kitsune on Nov 2, 2022 10:03:19 GMT -5
It was played to perfection, from his look to his move set to how he was booked. The fact the mid and was relatively lackluster at the time also made it easier for even such a character to make a big impact. These days the Samoan savage has given way to the Samoan gangsta. Three minute warning, the Samoan swat team, the cusps at varying times in their careers, and Jacob Fatu are all examples. Also while he had the look of a savage it was one of those things they never said outright... though the commentators reacting in shock that he could speak was pretty dumb >_> (Especially since he would yell like For Samoa at least once a match >_>) I always thought it was "Fa'a Samoa".
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Post by Denny Zen on Nov 2, 2022 10:20:12 GMT -5
The Ted DiBiase/Virgil angle is one of the most well-remembered of the late 1980s.
If it happened now, it would immediately go the way of Paula Deen's restaurant.
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Post by "Playboy" Don Douglas on Nov 2, 2022 10:31:53 GMT -5
The Ted DiBiase/Virgil angle is one of the most well-remembered of the late 1980s. If it happened now, it would immediately go the way of Paula Deen's restaurant. So, doing big business in Pigeon Forge, TN?
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fw91
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Post by fw91 on Nov 2, 2022 10:44:28 GMT -5
Baby face Big Bossman
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Post by Savage Gambino on Nov 2, 2022 13:15:00 GMT -5
Honestly, any angle making light of concussion/brain damage. Trying to pull off a Perry Saturn & Moppy-style gimmick now would probably just look like you were purposely trying to piss off Chris Nowinski and/or the 50 or so people who sued WWE for long-term brain damage.
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Post by Denny Zen on Nov 2, 2022 14:49:06 GMT -5
The Ted DiBiase/Virgil angle is one of the most well-remembered of the late 1980s. If it happened now, it would immediately go the way of Paula Deen's restaurant. So, doing big business in Pigeon Forge, TN? No. Fiercely criticized in the media to the point of having to go in a different direction (in Savannah, GA).
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Post by jimmyjackezekiel on Nov 2, 2022 15:13:35 GMT -5
Brutus "The Barber" Beefcake as a hairdresser-slash-stripper. But Shawn Michaels would've never get to turn heel nowadays if there was no barbershop window for the cowardly Marty Jannetty to escape through. "Are you blind?!"
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Post by jimmyjackezekiel on Nov 2, 2022 15:16:30 GMT -5
by that same token. Heel Mountie?
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Post by nickcave on Nov 2, 2022 15:50:23 GMT -5
I am 111% sure that if Vince was still in power, and given the same circumstances, he would still do the hillbilly family and Uncle Elmer's wedding next week if possible. I mean every ten years or so he would try some variation. The 90s had the Godwinns and the 00s had Jesse and Festus.
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