thecrusherwi
El Dandy
the Financially Responsible Man
Brawl For All
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Post by thecrusherwi on Jan 25, 2023 10:14:57 GMT -5
Granted compared to the previous year Unforgiven and No Mercy both absolutely cratered. Backlash 2001 also did terribly compared to 2000 and they were so desperate for people to buy that show, they put all the belts into the main event. I will give you it was an up and down year PPV wise. Backlash 2001 was such a depressing show at the time. WCW was gone, ECW was gone, The Rock was gone, and the main event was a heel Steve Austin fighting in a Tag Team Match with Undertaker and Kane who had spent the prior few months tussling with Rikishi and Haku and Kane battling for the Hardcore Title. It had a palpable feeling even in the moment that we are moving into a new, lesser era of wrestling. |
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Post by bogussting on Jan 25, 2023 10:33:41 GMT -5
There were several wrestling booms over the years. That was just one of them. And, business wise, given the current television rights fees situation, technically, right now is a great time for the business of wrestling. Whether you might prefer a different style, or different wrestlers, etc. is beside the point. Bottom line, WWE is more profitable now than any wrestling company in history. Also right now, in general, some of the smaller companies out there have been doing better business lately than at any point since the territory days. Plus all of these companies have new avenues to bring in money, like streaming services, etc. It's not strictly ticket sales, or traditional "television." Yeah, I guess that 1996-2001 boom did end in 2001. But that was just one boom. This about sums it up. |
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fw91
Patti Mayonnaise
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Post by fw91 on Jan 25, 2023 11:27:42 GMT -5
Yeah, after the invasion
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agent817
Fry's dog Seymour
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Post by agent817 on Jan 25, 2023 12:35:02 GMT -5
The weird thing was that I first got into it in 1998 and it had little to do with the popularity that boomed. However, even though I still followed it on a regular basis, for me, the interest started to fade in late-2000 when other interests in movies and music started to overshadow my interest in wrestling. It was like that in early-2001 as well. Not like I didn't continue to watch but with other interests that I had, it seemed the popularity started to wane as well.
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Post by Jindrak Mark on Jan 25, 2023 12:35:59 GMT -5
Granted compared to the previous year Unforgiven and No Mercy both absolutely cratered. Backlash 2001 also did terribly compared to 2000 and they were so desperate for people to buy that show, they put all the belts into the main event. I will give you it was an up and down year PPV wise. To be fair, Backlash/Unforgiven/No Mercy 2000 were all special cases due to Austin. It would've been pretty much impossible to beat those. Backlash was his one-off return to help Rock fend off HHH and the McMahons, Unforgiven was his full-time return and No Mercy was his first match in a year. And I just remembered that he was originally on the poster for Fully Loaded. I guess that was originally supposed to be his return but he ended up not being physically ready in time so they had to hold off for a couple months. I wonder if he did manage to return then does that mean Austin/Rikishi happens at Summerslam 2000 or does the butterfly effect of him returning early also mean someone else is booked to be the person who ran him over. As far I know Rikishi was a last minute decision and not some kind of long-term plan. |
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Post by eJm on Jan 25, 2023 12:39:17 GMT -5
Backlash 2001 also did terribly compared to 2000 and they were so desperate for people to buy that show, they put all the belts into the main event. I will give you it was an up and down year PPV wise. Backlash 2001 was such a depressing show at the time. WCW was gone, ECW was gone, The Rock was gone, and the main event was a heel Steve Austin fighting in a Tag Team Match with Undertaker and Kane who had spent the prior few months tussling with Rikishi and Haku and Kane battling for the Hardcore Title. It had a palpable feeling even in the moment that we are moving into a new, lesser era of wrestling. If I started watching consistently before 2001, I'd also look at a headline match with Austin, HHH, Kane and Undertaker and think I was just watching any of the other PPVs in 98, 99 or 2000 because they've fought each other so many times in many variations before that point. And even with the difference of Austin being a heel, the audience wasn't exactly reacting to him like a heel at times so...*shrug* |
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Post by Jedi-El of Tomorrow on Jan 25, 2023 14:26:01 GMT -5
Backlash 2001 was such a depressing show at the time. WCW was gone, ECW was gone, The Rock was gone, and the main event was a heel Steve Austin fighting in a Tag Team Match with Undertaker and Kane who had spent the prior few months tussling with Rikishi and Haku and Kane battling for the Hardcore Title. It had a palpable feeling even in the moment that we are moving into a new, lesser era of wrestling. If I started watching consistently before 2001, I'd also look at a headline match with Austin, HHH, Kane and Undertaker and think I was just watching any of the other PPVs in 98, 99 or 2000 because they've fought each other so many times in many variations before that point. And even with the difference of Austin being a heel, the audience wasn't exactly reacting to him like a heel at times so...*shrug* Should have been the Hardyz instead of Brothers of Destruction. Fans were desperate for the Hardyz to main event, the angle that led to this match began with Austin and Triple H destroying Lita, only makes sense to give the Hardyz a shot. But we got Taker and Kane in that spot. |
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Post by eJm on Jan 25, 2023 14:27:30 GMT -5
If I started watching consistently before 2001, I'd also look at a headline match with Austin, HHH, Kane and Undertaker and think I was just watching any of the other PPVs in 98, 99 or 2000 because they've fought each other so many times in many variations before that point. And even with the difference of Austin being a heel, the audience wasn't exactly reacting to him like a heel at times so...*shrug* Should have been the Hardyz instead of Brothers of Destruction. Fans were desperate for the Hardyz to main event, the angle that led to this match began with Austin and Triple H destroying Lita, only makes sense to give the Hardyz a shot. But we got Taker and Kane in that spot. The crowd were dying for them after WrestleMania. The fact that both them and Edge and Christian were basically relegated to the backseat of the people everyone had seen on top for literal years felt insane to me. |
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Renslayer
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Post by Renslayer on Jan 25, 2023 14:34:32 GMT -5
Should have been the Hardyz instead of Brothers of Destruction. Fans were desperate for the Hardyz to main event, the angle that led to this match began with Austin and Triple H destroying Lita, only makes sense to give the Hardyz a shot. But we got Taker and Kane in that spot. The crowd were dying for them after WrestleMania. The fact that both them and Edge and Christian were basically relegated to the backseat of the people everyone had seen on top for literal years felt insane to me. This a good ass point, and now that I think about it, why didn't they get the main that month? I'm sure it's because of politics and the invasion, but even still, a month with the hardy's before transitioning to jericho x benoit and then undertaker in the summer would be perfect. |
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chazraps
Wade Wilson
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Post by chazraps on Jan 25, 2023 14:45:43 GMT -5
You say that but Survivor Series that year did big business compared to almost any other edition of the show. Granted compared to the previous year Unforgiven and No Mercy both absolutely cratered. But those were also in the immediate aftermath of 9/11 where everything cratered stateside across entertainment. |
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Post by Jaws the Shark on Jan 25, 2023 14:53:39 GMT -5
I think from a business standpoint it was more in 2002. The cultural boom came earlier. By 2001, it kind of felt like it was over. The Wrestling Fad as a thing that non-wrestling fans latched on to for a while because it was the "it" thing seemed like it died in late 1999 or early 2000. The ratings plateaued in the summer of 2000 I think, and then started to gradually decline that autumn. I suppose it depends on what you consider to be the end of the boom, the end of the era during which the boom occurred, or when things started to turn downward. |
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thecrusherwi
El Dandy
the Financially Responsible Man
Brawl For All
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Post by thecrusherwi on Jan 25, 2023 16:30:40 GMT -5
I think from a business standpoint it was more in 2002. The cultural boom came earlier. By 2001, it kind of felt like it was over. The Wrestling Fad as a thing that non-wrestling fans latched on to for a while because it was the "it" thing seemed like it died in late 1999 or early 2000. The ratings plateaued in the summer of 2000 I think, and then started to gradually decline that autumn. I suppose it depends on what you consider to be the end of the boom, the end of the era during which the boom occurred, or when things started to turn downward. Yeah it’s difficult to define. I know in my own social circles as a middle and high school kid, the peak was definitely late 1997-early 1998 to spring 1999. By 1999-2000, the shows were great, but the only people watching them were those of us wrestling fans who had been watching since well before wrestling became a fad and a handful of people who stuck around after the fad ended. But by spring of 2001, even those newer fans had stopped watching. I tried to have a party for Wrestlemania 17 and no one wanted to come but the regulars. It wasn’t cool anymore. It was just our small group that would’ve been renting tapes in 1994 or 1995 before it got cool. |
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Post by ThankGodForSidJustice on Jan 25, 2023 16:34:25 GMT -5
I would say late 01 into 02 is when I would pinpoint where it ended. Just didn't seem like there was any buzz around it anymore. Like at school from 98 to 2000 it was something that popular with a lot of kids as far as t shirts and being talked about. However it felt like starting in around 2001 not nearly as much.
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Post by Jindrak Mark on Jan 25, 2023 16:35:44 GMT -5
I think from a business standpoint it was more in 2002. The cultural boom came earlier. By 2001, it kind of felt like it was over. The Wrestling Fad as a thing that non-wrestling fans latched on to for a while because it was the "it" thing seemed like it died in late 1999 or early 2000. The ratings plateaued in the summer of 2000 I think, and then started to gradually decline that autumn. I suppose it depends on what you consider to be the end of the boom, the end of the era during which the boom occurred, or when things started to turn downward. Moving from the USA Network to TNN in Sep 2000 I think is what started the drop. It wasn't like it was some obscure little channel but TNN was available in millions less households than USA at the time. |
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Post by SkullTrauma on Jan 25, 2023 16:43:51 GMT -5
Yeah, I guess that 1996-2001 boom did end in 2001. But that was just one boom. and there hasn't been one since. |
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Post by Triangle Lancer on Jan 25, 2023 18:26:52 GMT -5
I think people at the time underestimated just how many folks only watched wrestling for WCW (and ECW to a lesser extent). There were other reasons for why the boom ended but those two promotions dying definitely played a part. Even if the WWF kept firing on all cylinders creatively, wrestling lost a chunk of the audience it would struggle to ever get back. (I've told this story many times, but it fits here.) My in-laws (the wife's grandparents, specifically) were Southern and loved WCW. Ric Flair was the man, the Horsemen were it, they loved Dusty. Mamaw passed in November 1999, the Old Man 3 months later. Both hated the WWF because of the production (the bright lights and "it looks so fake". Never wholly knew if it was because I was a WWF fan or not...lol.) They never warmed to former WWF guys (i.e. Bret) coming in. Most old-fashioned fans of Southern wrestling fell away during late-2000 into 2001. You were NOT getting them back. |
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Post by Bob Schlapowitz on Jan 25, 2023 18:50:41 GMT -5
It started to end in 2001. By the end of 2002, not a single person that I know still watched.
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Post by simplydurhamcalling on Jan 26, 2023 7:11:13 GMT -5
Austin's heel turn as much as it provided some entertaining content in hindsight at the time it was not widely accepted/acclaimed at all. Then flip-flopping heel/face twice before the end of they year was just ridiculous, they should have stuck with the babyface turn in July which was well received.
The Invasion itself outside of the very beginning and end totally flopped.
The night after Survivor Series providing a reset on everything we had seen up to that point was also ridiculous and must have turned people away. Kurt Angle saves the WWF = heel wtf.
Then the bad booking continued into 2002 and that rubber stamped the end of the boom.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 26, 2023 9:41:05 GMT -5
The end of the biggest boom period absoloutley.
But we had that mini boom that was siginificant to the outside WWE bubble between end 2014/15 till about 18 which saw the indies juat explode and this helped by LU bringing a bold new take on televised wrestling and making stars out the wazoo of people no one had heard of before , NJPW just stormed the gates with WK9 to western fans , Impact was coming out of their LOLTNA phase for a bit with Broken Matt Hardy stuff , ROH was holding steady (untill the MSG show and well).
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ghost
Don Corleone
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Post by ghost on Jan 27, 2023 7:32:06 GMT -5
I think that’s a fair timeline. As others have said, I was in high school during the AE, and the peak was definitely 1999 in terms of non fans talking about it, and it spilled over into 2000, but seemed to stop entirely in 2001 after WM. From my own enjoyment, nothing felt the same after KOTR or so in 2001. I hated the Invasion angle (don’t care what business it did, it was awful). When Kurt Angle did the milk truck thing, it felt like a Fonzie moment as I was like “man that’s lame”, and it just carried over. I lasted until 2002 but the brand split and more specifically HHH by the end of that year killed any enjoyment I had. I’ve been a casual ever since.
So long story short, yes, 2001 was the end. You can argue at what point during that year but that year definitely seemed like it was the conclusion of wrestling’s mainstream popularity.
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