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Post by kingoftheindies on Jun 11, 2023 10:41:58 GMT -5
Talking of TNA that stupid roster address by Dixie might not have diretly hurt business but I'm pretty sure it hurt the perception of the company with both wrestlers and fans long-term which would hurt their business. If we're talking about Dixie and TNA moments that hurt business, we gotta talk about #ItHappens. Meant to be the culmination of Dixie Carter's own turn at the already incredibly worn-out "evil boss" angle, it basically involved Bully Ray's promise to powerbomb then 50-something year old Dixie, who had never had a wrestling match or any training whatsoever, through a table. Besides all of the glaringly obvious problems with that, Spike TV had already given TNA a strict no male-on-female violence edict. Anyway, #ItHappened, Dixie got injured, and TNA was off Spike TV by the end of the year. TNA/Impact would bounce around from network to network, effectively reduced from #2 wrestling company in America to an also-ran, while much of their talent would go to WWE, ROH, NWA, overseas, and eventually, to the next #2 All Elite Wrestling. Impact has since found it's footing, and even has some of the best wrestling television in the country, but they're a far cry away from the company that was once WCW's spiritual successor as the alternative to the Fed. To add more to it, TNA had taped a few weeks in advance and Spike had found out about the powerbomb spot and told Dixie under no uncertain terms, that TNA would not be airing that angle and better come up with something else. TNA didn't listen because Dixie thought they could get away with it
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Post by Milkman Norm on Jun 11, 2023 12:00:12 GMT -5
Crockett going with the blood stop finish at GAB 88, their first unopposed ppv, to build up the houses in the mid-atlantic rather than have Luger win the title to kick off a period of national expansion lead to the family selling the promotion to Turner by the end of the year.
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Post by The Dark Order Inferno on Jun 11, 2023 12:51:19 GMT -5
WCW's rapid decline was the result of their booking to sent Hulk Hogan home happy, rather than the audiences. In 1998 it became clear that fans were not getting any happy endings that stick, there'd always be some screwiness right around the corner to protect Hulk, while on the other channel, the WWF were giving people wish fulfilment featuring guys the WCW audience loved that were shafted there like Austin and Foley.
The WWF would go on to repeat that mistake in the 2000s with the booking designed to benefit Hunter.
I'll vote for the network angle in ECW. ECW NEEDED TV to survive, nevermind grow, and it doesn't matter whether TNN were being dicks or not, or wanted the WWF, ECW needed to play nice to ensure they didn't end up radioactive to other broadcasters. Naturally we got 'TNN, we *bleep pigs' from ECW because of course we did.
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Post by EvenBaldobombHasAJob on Jun 11, 2023 14:04:43 GMT -5
WCW's rapid decline was the result of their booking to sent Hulk Hogan home happy, rather than the audiences. In 1998 it became clear that fans were not getting any happy endings that stick, there'd always be some screwiness right around the corner to protect Hulk, while on the other channel, the WWF were giving people wish fulfilment featuring guys the WCW audience loved that were shafted there like Austin and Foley. The WWF would go on to repeat that mistake in the 2000s with the booking designed to benefit Hunter. I'll vote for the network angle in ECW. ECW NEEDED TV to survive, nevermind grow, and it doesn't matter whether TNN were being dicks or not, or wanted the WWF, ECW needed to play nice to ensure they didn't end up radioactive to other broadcasters. Naturally we got 'TNN, we *bleep pigs' from ECW because of course we did. As much as Eric Bischoff is cast as the bad guy in the ECW story, he was absolutely right about Paul Heyman. Paul refused to even entertain the idea of playing ball with the network that was keeping the lights on about anything. He was acting like he held all the keys when he was in no position to negotiate at all.
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Post by Aceorton on Jun 11, 2023 14:40:08 GMT -5
Eric Bischoff not having a head-on feud with Vince McMahon in WWE right out of the gate in 2002 was such a blown opportunity. You could almost feel the money vaporizing when the two of them hugged.
It still astounds me that Flair showed up the night after the InVasion ended, Hogan, Hall and Nash arrived in February, Bischoff in July, Scott Steiner in November and Goldberg the following March. The InVasion could have been so much better if they'd just waited till all those guys could come in and be a part of it.
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Post by JasonVoorhees1988 on Jun 11, 2023 14:43:56 GMT -5
Eric Bischoff not having a head-on feud with Vince McMahon in WWE right out of the gate in 2002 was such a blown opportunity. You could almost feel the money vaporizing when the two of them hugged. It still astounds me that Flair showed up the night after the InVasion ended, Hogan, Hall and Nash arrived in February, Bischoff in July, Scott Steiner in November and Goldberg the following March. The InVasion could have been so much better if they'd just waited till all those guys could come in and be a part of it. The Invasion could have been a years long story. You even could include the ECW guys as wildcards.
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dpg
Samurai Cop
Posts: 2,476
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Post by dpg on Jun 11, 2023 14:50:20 GMT -5
WCW's rapid decline was the result of their booking to sent Hulk Hogan home happy, rather than the audiences. In 1998 it became clear that fans were not getting any happy endings that stick, there'd always be some screwiness right around the corner to protect Hulk, while on the other channel, the WWF were giving people wish fulfilment featuring guys the WCW audience loved that were shafted there like Austin and Foley. The WWF would go on to repeat that mistake in the 2000s with the booking designed to benefit Hunter. I'll vote for the network angle in ECW. ECW NEEDED TV to survive, nevermind grow, and it doesn't matter whether TNN were being dicks or not, or wanted the WWF, ECW needed to play nice to ensure they didn't end up radioactive to other broadcasters. Naturally we got 'TNN, we *bleep pigs' from ECW because of course we did. As much as Eric Bischoff is cast as the bad guy in the ECW story, he was absolutely right about Paul Heyman. Paul refused to even entertain the idea of playing ball with the network that was keeping the lights on about anything. He was acting like he held all the keys when he was in no position to negotiate at all. It was easier and more satisfying to go after TNN than conform and face the wrath of the ECW fans.
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bob
Salacious Crumb
The "other" Bob. FOC COURSE!
started the Madness Wars, Proudly the #1 Nana Hater on FAN
Posts: 78,364
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Post by bob on Jun 11, 2023 14:55:43 GMT -5
the "fast count" Sting had over Hogan at Starrcade 1997
this should've been the natural end of the nWo as the top thing in WCW
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Jun 11, 2023 16:41:56 GMT -5
WCW's rapid decline was the result of their booking to sent Hulk Hogan home happy, rather than the audiences. In 1998 it became clear that fans were not getting any happy endings that stick, there'd always be some screwiness right around the corner to protect Hulk, while on the other channel, the WWF were giving people wish fulfilment featuring guys the WCW audience loved that were shafted there like Austin and Foley. The WWF would go on to repeat that mistake in the 2000s with the booking designed to benefit Hunter. I'll vote for the network angle in ECW. ECW NEEDED TV to survive, nevermind grow, and it doesn't matter whether TNN were being dicks or not, or wanted the WWF, ECW needed to play nice to ensure they didn't end up radioactive to other broadcasters. Naturally we got 'TNN, we *bleep pigs' from ECW because of course we did. As much as Eric Bischoff is cast as the bad guy in the ECW story, he was absolutely right about Paul Heyman. Paul refused to even entertain the idea of playing ball with the network that was keeping the lights on about anything. He was acting like he held all the keys when he was in no position to negotiate at all.
Yeah, I'm real tired of the "oh, poor Paul... Bischoff poached all of his talent because he had networking backing!" narrative.
Bischoff is a carny in his own right, but talent got paid and got paid on time in WCW, which is more than can be said for Paul Heyman employees. Dollars to donuts that guys who went through ECW and WCW both would tell you that they'd rather get paid triple and on time in the lower to midcard in WCW than get brain damage in an ECW main event where you might get stiffed.
Heyman COULD have tried harder on the TNN deal, but didn't want to, possibly because he knew he'd have a landing zone in WWE/F anyway.
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Post by johncasey on Jun 11, 2023 17:08:32 GMT -5
If we're talking about Dixie and TNA moments that hurt business, we gotta talk about #ItHappens. Meant to be the culmination of Dixie Carter's own turn at the already incredibly worn-out "evil boss" angle, it basically involved Bully Ray's promise to powerbomb then 50-something year old Dixie, who had never had a wrestling match or any training whatsoever, through a table. Besides all of the glaringly obvious problems with that, Spike TV had already given TNA a strict no male-on-female violence edict. Anyway, #ItHappened, Dixie got injured, and TNA was off Spike TV by the end of the year. TNA/Impact would bounce around from network to network, effectively reduced from #2 wrestling company in America to an also-ran, while much of their talent would go to WWE, ROH, NWA, overseas, and eventually, to the next #2 All Elite Wrestling. Impact has since found it's footing, and even has some of the best wrestling television in the country, but they're a far cry away from the company that was once WCW's spiritual successor as the alternative to the Fed. To add more to it, TNA had taped a few weeks in advance and Spike had found out about the powerbomb spot and told Dixie under no uncertain terms, that TNA would not be airing that angle and better come up with something else. TNA didn't listen because Dixie thought they could get away with it If Spike TV didn't want to show that kind of thing, then why did they air it considering it was a taped show. I thought they got rid of TNA because they found out that Vince Russo was back quietly.
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Post by kingoftheindies on Jun 11, 2023 17:33:16 GMT -5
To add more to it, TNA had taped a few weeks in advance and Spike had found out about the powerbomb spot and told Dixie under no uncertain terms, that TNA would not be airing that angle and better come up with something else. TNA didn't listen because Dixie thought they could get away with it If Spike TV didn't want to show that kind of thing, then why did they air it considering it was a taped show. I thought they got rid of TNA because they found out that Vince Russo was back quietly. Russo was the final straw, but there was a lot going on besides that. Including Dixie basically messing up the negotiations for renewal
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Post by Rolent Tex on Jun 12, 2023 5:01:32 GMT -5
The inVasion for sure. It did big time numbers but those still willing to give them a chance to see what they did with the WCW roster got to witness Vince not only rubbing salt in the wound but squeezing a whole ass lemon in there too. He basically let Undertaker and Kane make DDP and his buddy Kanyon look like the worlds biggest dorks. The hell was Taker going to do if Vince told his ass to play ball and make the feud look more competitive? Threaten to jump ship to WCW? Oh wait…
Plus not to mention that Vince thought it was a super bright idea to completely change the main event to one of his shows to WCW…announcers and all…and book Booker vs Buff Bagwell because one crowd gave Buff a big pop during his mention on Raw the night of the final Nitro. Vince spent years bashing WCW and expected his fans to eat it up like the delusional old man he is so he had to inject ECW into the storyline to try and salvage it. If he didn’t botch the landing then I’m sure he could have run both brands…since early on Raw and Smackdown had two distinct flavors anyways we could have had WCW Monday Nitro and WWF Smackdown. (I also heard for a long time this was the intended plan but the Networks told Vince to piss off because they’re paying for the WWF name and not WCW’s)
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The Foreigner™: OffSZN
ALF
They wanna talk? Well what they talkin bout? I see them runnin they mouth but they ain't talkin loud
Posts: 1,201
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Post by The Foreigner™: OffSZN on Jun 12, 2023 5:33:09 GMT -5
There's an official WWE video for that
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Post by James Fabiano on Jun 12, 2023 12:18:47 GMT -5
Crockett going with the blood stop finish at GAB 88, their first unopposed ppv, to build up the houses in the mid-atlantic rather than have Luger win the title to kick off a period of national expansion lead to the family selling the promotion to Turner by the end of the year. If we're mentioning Crockett, how about the Road Warriors NOT winning the tag team titles at Starrcade '87?
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chrom
Backup Wench
Master of the rare undecuple post
Posts: 84,718
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Post by chrom on Jun 12, 2023 13:01:59 GMT -5
Crockett going with the blood stop finish at GAB 88, their first unopposed ppv, to build up the houses in the mid-atlantic rather than have Luger win the title to kick off a period of national expansion lead to the family selling the promotion to Turner by the end of the year. If we're mentioning Crockett, how about the Road Warriors NOT winning the tag team titles at Starrcade '87? They really shot themselves in the foot multiple times going for a Dusty Finish.
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Post by "Playboy" Don Douglas on Jun 12, 2023 14:39:31 GMT -5
If we're mentioning Crockett, how about the Road Warriors NOT winning the tag team titles at Starrcade '87? They really shot themselves in the foot multiple times going for a Dusty Finish. The thing is, all those booking decisions hurt, as did lowballing Tully and Arn on their payoff and letting them walk to the WWF, but it’s been said by Cornette and David Crockett that the houses were starting to pick back up and some in the office were trying to talk Jimmy into holding off on the sale. The biggest problem there was they had spent a ridiculous amount of money on private planes that they would fly from Charlotte to Greensboro, as well as at least three territories (Florida, Central States, and UWF) that were going out of business regardless and opening a new office in Dallas because it would make them look more like a national company and figuring that the TV deals they picked up in the purchases would more than make up for it. Theyn there’s the mistake of having one guy who was used to working for a regional company handle all the accounting in the face of an attempted national expansion. By the time he got caught up on all the paperwork, they were about $2 million in the hole and that TV money wasn’t materializing the way they thought it would.
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Post by TOK Hehe'd Around & Found Out on Jun 12, 2023 15:39:06 GMT -5
To add more to it, TNA had taped a few weeks in advance and Spike had found out about the powerbomb spot and told Dixie under no uncertain terms, that TNA would not be airing that angle and better come up with something else. TNA didn't listen because Dixie thought they could get away with it If Spike TV didn't want to show that kind of thing, then why did they air it considering it was a taped show. I thought they got rid of TNA because they found out that Vince Russo was back quietly. Network execs don't review the shows on their network, especially niche programming like pro wrestling where they probably don't really care. They just assumed that the content creator who they've had a very long relationship with would do the bare minimum of listening to a direct instruction.
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