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Post by eJm on Apr 18, 2024 4:20:52 GMT -5
I had a long term friend accused of horrible things. I felt like I knew him pretty well and refused take sides before any undeniable facts came out. Trial date came. Woman confessed on the stand that she made the whole thing up. I'm glad I didn't turn my back on him like pretty much everyone else did. Whatever happened to "innocent until proven guilty"? He paid the person currently suing him and a slew of other people for their silence with company money according to an investigation run by an organisation he was a major shareholder in, one that would have loved to have been able to give him a pass. He also paid out millions to settle a rape case where the victim had been open and consistent about what happened to her for a long, long time. I think we're past the point where Vince deserves the benefit of the doubt, people gave him that for decades and a lot of people got hurt at a result. Yeah, we're not talking about an individual case. We're talking about stuff we know about and the company basically bailed him out for and he just, just settled a case that's been around for decades. There's less benefit of the doubt and more " you have to prove to me that this case is the exception". The Rock has said a lot of things recently that have soured a lot of people's view of him... and we really can't go too much further into what it is on this board. There's also the "I can't lose ever." clause in his movie contracts... which is absurd, especially when he signs on to play bad guys. Not to mention Variety's expose last year about his attempt to basically run the DC film division. Not something you want coming out if you want to keep your image.
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Zone Was Wrong
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Currently living off the high that AEW brings every Wednesday and Friday
Posts: 16,200
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Post by Zone Was Wrong on Apr 18, 2024 4:38:04 GMT -5
I know people are going to be mad at the Rock and Cena for still keeping in touch with Vince but they’ve known the man for 30 and 20 years. That relationship isn’t going to end over night and tbh it would be hard for many people to just give up relationships like that. I've flat out cut full blooded relatives out of my life for way less than what Vince has done. I'm 37 years old and knew them my entire life. If people are pieces of shits, you cut them them out. They worked back stage and got to know the man for years and years. They know what kind of person he is and then this stuff comes out. They just don't care.
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Post by OGBoardPoster2005 on Apr 18, 2024 8:00:43 GMT -5
I know people are going to be mad at the Rock and Cena for still keeping in touch with Vince but they’ve known the man for 30 and 20 years. That relationship isn’t going to end over night and tbh it would be hard for many people to just give up relationships like that. I've flat out cut full blooded relatives out of my life for way less than what Vince has done. I'm 37 years old and knew them my entire life. If people are pieces of shits, you cut them them out. They worked back stage and got to know the man for years and years. They know what kind of person he is and then this stuff comes out. They just don't care. Cool, thats you bro. Not everyone does that or can. Emotions vary from person to person. Rock dropping Vince, a family associate of 40 years out of accusations is not exactly as easy as you make it sound like and someone like Cena who prior to WWE was an Indy wrestler struggling to find stable work in light of WCW and ECW folding, only to find work and a friend with Vince isn't going to just either. Business and personal relations here. I've seen shady things in my time done and people still try to justify their actions. Why? Because of the level of relationships. I have scummy relatives too, thats personal experience alone, but those aren't to the levels of what Vince was to those guys. But I forget all of you on here have a clean record and never have done anything to anyone ever. If I audited this board for misconduct at some stage of their life, we'd have less than half of the board still.
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Post by "Gizzark" Mike Wronglevenay on Apr 18, 2024 8:20:52 GMT -5
I've flat out cut full blooded relatives out of my life for way less than what Vince has done. I'm 37 years old and knew them my entire life. If people are pieces of shits, you cut them them out. They worked back stage and got to know the man for years and years. They know what kind of person he is and then this stuff comes out. They just don't care. Cool, thats you bro. Not everyone does that or can. Emotions vary from person to person. Rock dropping Vince, a family associate of 40 years out of accusations is not exactly as easy as you make it sound like and someone like Cena who prior to WWE was an Indy wrestler struggling to find stable work in light of WCW and ECW folding, only to find work and a friend with Vince isn't going to just either. Business and personal relations here. I've seen shady things in my time done and people still try to justify their actions. Why? Because of the level of relationships. I have scummy relatives too, thats personal experience alone, but those aren't to the levels of what Vince was to those guys. But I forget all of you on here have a clean record and never have done anything to anyone ever. If I audited this board for misconduct at some stage of their life, we'd have less than half of the board still. For the record, I agree with you, or at least see where you're coming from, but this response is super defensive and attacking the board at large is a pretty terrible call all around
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Post by eJm on Apr 18, 2024 8:22:43 GMT -5
But I forget all of you on here have a clean record and never have done anything to anyone ever. If I audited this board for misconduct at some stage of their life, we'd have less than half of the board still. I'm saying this as a mod, that sort of attitude to people in general is not going to keep you here for long. You can make your point without trying to generalize.
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Post by OGBoardPoster2005 on Apr 18, 2024 9:07:19 GMT -5
But I forget all of you on here have a clean record and never have done anything to anyone ever. If I audited this board for misconduct at some stage of their life, we'd have less than half of the board still. I'm saying this as a mod, that sort of attitude to people in general is not going to keep you here for long. You can make your point without trying to generalize. I just state my opinion my man. As far as I'm concerned its a grey-scale world and some of us are darker than others. This here is just a screen and keyboard we hide behind, its not real life. I've been on here for 19 years, I've seen its share of bad here as well as the good. I ain't calling us crooks but if you look into people theres things under the ice you'll find that doesn't rise to the surface. But I ain't here to arrest anyone. My attitude is just my honesty, I don't live in a superficial world of Faces and Heels, I just see it for what it is. I never said names, I just made a statement, I'll even admit as a teen I wasn't always appropriate with people, and at 33 almost I understand that now, but this board hasn't always been full of saints. Someone like you, whose been around only 14 months less than me, should know that. Just fascinates me when this board tries to tell others how to think and conduct themselves. But I'll step away from this thread, you and I can talk over DMs if you got anything further to write. At least allow me that before you decide I need a ban. Especially when I've never stepped out of bound on this board in almost 20 years posting. Feel free to delete your comment and mine and let this thread proceed and I'll stay out of it.
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Post by eJm on Apr 18, 2024 9:25:59 GMT -5
I'm saying this as a mod, that sort of attitude to people in general is not going to keep you here for long. You can make your point without trying to generalize. I just state my opinion my man. As far as I'm concerned its a grey-scale world and some of us are darker than others. This here is just a screen and keyboard we hide behind, its not real life. I've been on here for 19 years, I've seen its share of bad here as well as the good. I ain't calling us crooks but if you look into people theres things under the ice you'll find that doesn't rise to the surface. But I ain't here to arrest anyone. My attitude is just my honesty, I don't live in a superficial world of Faces and Heels, I just see it for what it is. I never said names, I just made a statement, I'll even admit as a teen I wasn't always appropriate with people, and at 33 almost I understand that now, but this board hasn't always been full of saints. Someone like you, whose been around only 14 months less than me, should know that. Just fascinates me when this board tries to tell others how to think and conduct themselves. But I'll step away from this thread, you and I can talk over DMs if you got anything further to write. At least allow me that before you decide I need a ban. Especially when I've never stepped out of bound on this board in almost 20 years posting. Feel free to delete your comment and mine and let this thread proceed and I'll stay out of it. Like…if you’ve been here that long, you at least know what flies here and what doesn’t so not understanding what else you needed to say outside of “Ok, cool”. I’ll let you decide whether to keep your comment or not but having been here about as long as you have, just stating the obvious.
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Post by OGBoardPoster2005 on Apr 18, 2024 9:30:45 GMT -5
I just state my opinion my man. As far as I'm concerned its a grey-scale world and some of us are darker than others. This here is just a screen and keyboard we hide behind, its not real life. I've been on here for 19 years, I've seen its share of bad here as well as the good. I ain't calling us crooks but if you look into people theres things under the ice you'll find that doesn't rise to the surface. But I ain't here to arrest anyone. My attitude is just my honesty, I don't live in a superficial world of Faces and Heels, I just see it for what it is. I never said names, I just made a statement, I'll even admit as a teen I wasn't always appropriate with people, and at 33 almost I understand that now, but this board hasn't always been full of saints. Someone like you, whose been around only 14 months less than me, should know that. Just fascinates me when this board tries to tell others how to think and conduct themselves. But I'll step away from this thread, you and I can talk over DMs if you got anything further to write. At least allow me that before you decide I need a ban. Especially when I've never stepped out of bound on this board in almost 20 years posting. Feel free to delete your comment and mine and let this thread proceed and I'll stay out of it. Like…if you’ve been here that long, you at least know what flies here and what doesn’t so not understanding what else you needed to say outside of “Ok, cool”. I’ll let you decide whether to keep your comment or not but having been here about as long as you have, just stating the obvious. I got an understanding, just don't feel like my response warranted it. But I also get the mods here are trained to try to avoid hostility between board posters and general disrespect to other posters, which I assume is where my comment fell under. That said, no disrespect was intended as much as I was making an observation. But theres nothing further. Back on topic...anyone know how long WWE's deal with Saudi Arabia runs? In all the Vince talk in recent weeks of starting his own promotion, thats the only place I can see him running but I don't know if theres an exclusive window for WWE there or what the story is.
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Post by ChitownKnight on Apr 18, 2024 9:33:57 GMT -5
Like…if you’ve been here that long, you at least know what flies here and what doesn’t so not understanding what else you needed to say outside of “Ok, cool”. I’ll let you decide whether to keep your comment or not but having been here about as long as you have, just stating the obvious. I got an understanding, just don't feel like my response warranted it. But I also get the mods here are trained to try to avoid hostility between board posters and general disrespect to other posters, which I assume is where my comment fell under. That said, no disrespect was intended as much as I was making an observation. But theres nothing further. Back on topic...anyone know how long WWE's deal with Saudi Arabia runs? In all the Vince talk in recent weeks of starting his own promotion, thats the only place I can see him running but I don't know if theres an exclusive window for WWE there or what the story is. I think the Saudi deal is until 2028, but I feel like wwe is gonna renew it because of all the money they make. I don’t think they need Vince
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Post by Mayonnaise on Apr 18, 2024 9:53:54 GMT -5
Cutting someone out like Vince has been for Rock and Cena is not easy. I'm going through a similar situation right now where I have an uncle in prison for something heinous but I cannot bring myself to cut him out of my life because of how much he has lost, deservedly so too. I hate what he did and he's currently not speaking to me because I told him that and that he earned his place in prison but I want him to know that when he gets out there will be someone there to try and help him piece his life back together if he wants to makes the changes necessary.
I get that not everyone is like that and don't blame people that can do that, I honestly wish I was one at times. Trying to maintain that relationship is difficult to put it mildly. When you have decades of a relationship, where a guy is like a father figure to you, not being there when they are at their lowest isn't something you can always do.
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Post by eJm on Apr 18, 2024 10:08:33 GMT -5
Cutting someone out like Vince has been for Rock and Cena is not easy. I'm going through a similar situation right now where I have an uncle in prison for something heinous but I cannot bring myself to cut him out of my life because of how much he has lost, deservedly so too. I hate what he did and he's currently not speaking to me because I told him that and that he earned his place in prison but I want him to know that when he gets out there will be someone there to try and help him piece his life back together if he wants to makes the changes necessary. I get that not everyone is like that and don't blame people that can do that, I honestly wish I was one at times. Trying to maintain that relationship is difficult to put it mildly. When you have decades of a relationship, where a guy is like a father figure to you, not being there when they are at their lowest isn't something you can always do. The other thing to add, and less about your own situation and more to do with the topic (even though I do understand what you mean), Vince's entire corporate strategy is having a cult of personality. He's the boss whose like the boys, hangs out with them, supports them with endeavors and takes advantage of that for his own means in a way he can put the blame on someone else. It's why half the roster have said they helped him in the business when, like, most people wouldn't say that about their boss. But most bosses aren't giving out an image of supporting the "boys will be boys" mentality in extremes Vince has. Like, look at how many times you heard in shoot interviews of ex talent "Vince liked me, it was Jim Ross/Johnny Ace/Paul Heyman etc who had it out for me and cost me my job"? Countless. Because, whilst it's easier for us to look outside and see, logically, that Vince did the deed or approved on the firing, the image you convey is someone who wants the best for you when he doesn't. Grooming might be an extreme word but it's hard for me to think of any word that lines up to what he's done. That doesn't mean if he has a new company, people will flock to it but it also doesn't mean that they won't.
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Allie Kitsune
Crow T. Robot
Always Feelin' Foxy.
Celestial Princess in Exile.
Posts: 46,149
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Post by Allie Kitsune on Apr 18, 2024 10:13:50 GMT -5
Cutting someone out like Vince has been for Rock and Cena is not easy. I'm going through a similar situation right now where I have an uncle in prison for something heinous but I cannot bring myself to cut him out of my life because of how much he has lost, deservedly so too. I hate what he did and he's currently not speaking to me because I told him that and that he earned his place in prison but I want him to know that when he gets out there will be someone there to try and help him piece his life back together if he wants to makes the changes necessary. I get that not everyone is like that and don't blame people that can do that, I honestly wish I was one at times. Trying to maintain that relationship is difficult to put it mildly. When you have decades of a relationship, where a guy is like a father figure to you, not being there when they are at their lowest isn't something you can always do. The other thing to add, and less about your own situation and more to do with the topic (even though I do understand what you mean), Vince's entire corporate strategy is having a cult of personality. He's the boss whose like the boys, hangs out with them, supports them with endeavors and takes advantage of that for his own means in a way he can put the blame on someone else. It's why half the roster have said they helped him in the business when, like, most people wouldn't say that about their boss. But most bosses aren't giving out an image of supporting the "boys will be boys" mentality in extremes Vince has. Like, look at how many times you heard in shoot interviews of ex talent "Vince liked me, it was Jim Ross/Johnny Ace/Paul Heyman etc who had it out for me and cost me my job"? Countless. Because, whilst it's easier for us to look outside and see, logically, that Vince did the deed or approved on the firing, the image you convey is someone who wants the best for you when he doesn't. Grooming might be an extreme word but it's hard for me to think of any word that lines up to what he's done. That doesn't mean if he has a new company, people will flock to it but it also doesn't mean that they won't. Big Boss figures like that almost always have a Hatchet Man to do the dirty work, so the Boss doesn't have to get his own hands dirty, and can say "Hey, it wasn't me, it was him". Never mind that of course, as the Boss, he has to approve the actions and has final say.
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Post by eJm on Apr 18, 2024 10:17:45 GMT -5
Big Boss figures like that almost always have a Hatchet Man to do the dirty work, so the Boss doesn't have to get his own hands dirty, and can say "Hey, it wasn't me, it was him". Never mind that of course, as the Boss, he has to approve the actions and has final say. Exactly, which was why it's weird when people like AJ Styles implied otherwise with Paul Heyman. You think he just fired a bunch of people and the boss couldn't do anything about it? That would get him fired faster than he would have with anyone else.
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nisidhe
Hank Scorpio
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Posts: 5,725
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Post by nisidhe on Apr 18, 2024 10:19:41 GMT -5
The Rock has said a lot of things recently that have soured a lot of people's view of him... and we really can't go too much further into what it is on this board. There's also the "I can't lose ever." clause in his movie contracts... which is absurd, especially when he signs on to play bad guys. I'd suggest he's now on the board at TKO because he's likely managed to piss off a lot of Hollywood bigwigs with his manipulations. Cena, on the other hand, hasn't thrown his weight around and has gained a reputation as someone willing to take the piss out of himself for the good of the project, such as at the Oscars. While news of his contact with Vince is troubling, I don't think he's done anything yet that will get him cancelled in Hollywood. Cena hasn't risen enough to take the kind of fall Dwayne has taken.
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Post by eJm on Apr 18, 2024 10:36:00 GMT -5
I'd suggest he's now on the board at TKO because he's likely managed to piss off a lot of Hollywood bigwigs with his manipulations. I mean, I wouldn't say that. Disney rolled out the red carpet for him at CinemaCon just last week and Netflix has enough of a relationship to promote his newest Christmas movie later this year so it's not like that's gone from him. And all it takes for an admin change for him to work for Warner Bros again.
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nisidhe
Hank Scorpio
O Superman....O judge....O Mom and Dad....
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Post by nisidhe on Apr 18, 2024 11:06:17 GMT -5
I'd suggest he's now on the board at TKO because he's likely managed to piss off a lot of Hollywood bigwigs with his manipulations. I mean, I wouldn't say that. Disney rolled out the red carpet for him at CinemaCon just last week and Netflix has enough of a relationship to promote his newest Christmas movie later this year so it's not like that's gone from him. And all it takes for an admin change for him to work for Warner Bros again. He'll be considered from some projects in future, but I don't see him working another franchise film again after _Black Adam_, at least. Certainly, his ability to influence certain directions of the films he's in will be curtailed. Purse-strings might be tightened on his projects as well.
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Post by A Platypus Rave on Apr 18, 2024 12:42:18 GMT -5
The other thing to add, and less about your own situation and more to do with the topic (even though I do understand what you mean), Vince's entire corporate strategy is having a cult of personality. He's the boss whose like the boys, hangs out with them, supports them with endeavors and takes advantage of that for his own means in a way he can put the blame on someone else. It's why half the roster have said they helped him in the business when, like, most people wouldn't say that about their boss. But most bosses aren't giving out an image of supporting the "boys will be boys" mentality in extremes Vince has. Like, look at how many times you heard in shoot interviews of ex talent "Vince liked me, it was Jim Ross/Johnny Ace/Paul Heyman etc who had it out for me and cost me my job"? Countless. Because, whilst it's easier for us to look outside and see, logically, that Vince did the deed or approved on the firing, the image you convey is someone who wants the best for you when he doesn't. Grooming might be an extreme word but it's hard for me to think of any word that lines up to what he's done. That doesn't mean if he has a new company, people will flock to it but it also doesn't mean that they won't. Big Boss figures like that almost always have a Hatchet Man to do the dirty work, so the Boss doesn't have to get his own hands dirty, and can say "Hey, it wasn't me, it was him". Never mind that of course, as the Boss, he has to approve the actions and has final say. I remember Spike Dudley doing a shoot interview when the Dudley's were let go and referring to Johnny Ace as Johnny Axe... and basically said the same thing. He didn't hold any hatred towards Johnny as it wasn't his final say... and most of the men that disliked him was because he was the man that called you to let you know you were fired. (of course with this case much more reasons to dislike Ace have come out but again this was like 15 years ago or so.)
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Totorob101
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Post by Totorob101 on Apr 18, 2024 13:01:41 GMT -5
Rock and Cenas reputations are going to go downhill fast by standing by that man and I hope they wonder if it's worth it by doing so. Yes he did a lot for them and wrestling but his actions towards women Trump all of that and if neither man can see Vince is a bad man then they are bad people themselves who deserve to be torn to shreds for it.
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Post by ChitownKnight on Apr 18, 2024 13:12:07 GMT -5
Rock and Cenas reputations are going to go downhill fast by standing by that man and I hope they wonder if it's worth it by doing so. Yes he did a lot for them and wrestling but his actions towards women Trump all of that and if neither man can see Vince is a bad man then they are bad people themselves who deserve to be torn to shreds for it. The Rock is kind of an egomaniac, but Cena has met with thousands of make a wish kids and impacted several people positively so even if he talks to Vince (while I don’t agree with his decision), was as stated in this thread several times is a father figure to him and the guy who made him into a star, it doesn’t make him a bad person. Cena is mostly a good person who maybe made some questionable decisions
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Gunhaver
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Post by Gunhaver on Apr 18, 2024 15:34:24 GMT -5
The Rock has said a lot of things recently that have soured a lot of people's view of him... and we really can't go too much further into what it is on this board. There's also the "I can't lose ever." clause in his movie contracts... which is absurd, especially when he signs on to play bad guys. Not to mention Variety's expose last year about his attempt to basically run the DC film division. Not something you want coming out if you want to keep your image. I really, really want to see Rock run DC films. Not because I don't think it could get any worse than it already is--it can always get worse--but because it seems so outside his experience that the results would be completely bonkers.
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