ghost
Don Corleone
Posts: 1,743
|
Post by ghost on Feb 5, 2024 18:48:24 GMT -5
Bret is 100% right about doing moves "for real" just to get a reaction. Hard chops being applauded almost baffled me.
|
|
bob
Salacious Crumb
The "other" Bob. FOC COURSE!
started the Madness Wars, Proudly the #1 Nana Hater on FAN
Posts: 78,358
|
Post by bob on Feb 5, 2024 18:49:57 GMT -5
Bret hates Goldberg almost as much as I hate Nana
|
|
|
Post by Mayonnaise on Feb 5, 2024 19:39:48 GMT -5
Yeah, not like he has a history of shit comments about womens' wrestlers greatness based on their looks and trying to sleep with them. So yeah, screw that and him. I'll say it again, Rhea ain't looking to f*** ya Bret. But you didn't reference Bret making tacky comments about women wrestlers in the past. You entered a conversation about a woman wrestler, where nothing disrespectful had been said, and made a tacky comment. Because it's a known issue with him. A running joke at times. Sorry I didn't go into great lengths about how Bret Hart tries to f*** everything he finds attractive like he has about himself.
|
|
Johnny B. Decent
Patti Mayonnaise
Had one once
Everybody's Favorite Arizonian.
Posts: 31,073
|
Post by Johnny B. Decent on Feb 5, 2024 22:23:37 GMT -5
Bret hates Goldberg almost as much as I hate Nana Goddamn, Bob, Goldberg ended Bret's career, what did Prince Nana do so bad to you?
|
|
|
Post by LiamMcDuggle on Feb 5, 2024 22:40:28 GMT -5
Dude, just say you hate Gunther, we all already know it, he knows it, and most of us don't care. Also, Rhea ain't gonna f*** ya. he's previously said he like Walter's work. I think he just hates the chops
|
|
Mozenrath
FANatic
Foppery and Whim
Speedy Speed Boy
Posts: 121,069
|
Post by Mozenrath on Feb 5, 2024 22:41:48 GMT -5
Offhand Gunther beat Ciampa with a chop once and I'm pretty sure there was a main roster match where he also won with one. Helps he basically treats it like a Heart Punch.
|
|
Venti
Unicron
Posts: 2,995
|
Post by Venti on Feb 5, 2024 23:57:35 GMT -5
I personally don't mind the chops but they make me nervous that they could screw up someone bad considering that's where the heart is.
I just figure these guys know what they're doing though.
Also Bret just isn't into chops. I remember Flair saying Bret would ask "do we have to do the chops?"
|
|
Pierre
Dalek
Acknowledged by Lexis King on 4/9/24
Posts: 52,198
Member is Online
|
Post by Pierre on Feb 6, 2024 0:48:03 GMT -5
It kind of tickles me how seemingly all of Bret's generation of wrestlers just HAAAAAATES that dive onto a bunch of guys spot. I wonder what spot the current crop of wrestlers will hate 20 years from now. I hate it too, honestly. But one of my favorite Bret stories is the one he told about being backstage at WM 29 while Brock and HHH were going over their match and wanting to go up to them to tell them how much their ideas sucked.
|
|
|
Post by theironyuppie on Feb 6, 2024 4:35:47 GMT -5
It's cool that Bret respects Rhea's ability to inhabit her character. Even in something like an interview she did with Sam Roberts, she feels continuous with her on-screen persona:
|
|
Ryushinku
King Koopa
Posts: 12,099
Member is Online
|
Post by Ryushinku on Feb 6, 2024 5:26:18 GMT -5
I personally don't mind the chops but they make me nervous that they could screw up someone bad considering that's where the heart is. You've unlocked a random memory for me, I recall Madusa saying similar. Mentioned the Damar Hamlin incident in the NFL, she was concerned about the increased risk to the heart from so many hard and heavy chops in a bout.
|
|
|
Post by callmekc on Feb 6, 2024 7:15:41 GMT -5
I personally don't mind the chops but they make me nervous that they could screw up someone bad considering that's where the heart is. I mean... Kinda? They're hitting the other side of the body and hitting a fleshy bit (pectoral muscle) and spreading out the force in the same way you do when bumping is it risk free? No. But very little in wrestling is and the risks are far lower than shit like German Suplexes. Plus if you're 'correctly' applying a lot of submission holds you can inflict pain, be it intentional or accidental. Also Bret just isn't into chops. I remember Flair saying Bret would ask "do we have to do the chops?" Bret is functionally Jim Cornette with better PR. Hatred of what he thinks is the wrong way to wrestle, kinda gross opinions about women, haven't changed their mind in decades. I don't disagree with Bret, and in general I want wrestling that is safe for the performers. I've found myself coming more aligned with William Regal's mindset of being 'snug' and hitting people hard in safe places.
|
|
|
Post by The Barber on Feb 6, 2024 7:36:50 GMT -5
I've always said that 'strong-style' or 'stiff' wrestling is one of the dumbest things to enter this business. Why in the hell are you actually hurting your opponent? I thought it was supposed to look like it hurt, not actually do it.
|
|
|
Post by Mr Mario Mario on Feb 6, 2024 7:47:22 GMT -5
It kind of tickles me how seemingly all of Bret's generation of wrestlers just HAAAAAATES that dive onto a bunch of guys spot. I wonder what spot the current crop of wrestlers will hate 20 years from now. I hate it too, honestly. Same. I like modern wrestling but man this one spot really does get my goat just because of the whole standing around in a group is usually really obvious. Fortunately I don’t see it as much these days As for Goldberg. Man I love Bret and am not a fan of Bill but Bret is way too harsh on him in my opinion. Accidents happen and Bret wrestled several matches including a hardcore match after suffering the concussion
|
|
|
Post by Tea & Crumpets on Feb 6, 2024 9:36:31 GMT -5
I agree with MOOOOST of that. I don't mind physicality that leaves a mark given wrestlers work a reduced schedule now compared to Bret's day, on softer rings, with better aftercare/lifestyles. They're not wrecking themselves nearly as much (except the ones who take insane neck bumps).
I fully agree on pretty much everything else- people overuse strike exchange spots as a substitute for match psychology/structure/drama and half the time don't even throw good looking strikes, the other half the time they just legitimately clobber each other. People do way too much scripted and choreographed stuff that's very obviously scripted & co-operative and takes me out of it. I can't stand some of the more acrobatic stuff that's very obviously co-operative, or the amount of no-selling, standing around waiting for a guy to hit a move, bumping for stuff that barely grazes you because it's in the script instead of actually reacting to contact, synchronised stuff like two guys hitting the same move back and forth, et cetera. Stuff that people used to clown on Davey Richards and Eddie Edwards for doing is now getting to be the norm and I don't like it. People always point to things like Irish Whips and hurracanranas etc. as evidence it's always been like this but it's plain not- I can suspend disbelief on a rana because headscissors are a real thing and there's good contact on a rana. I can suspend disbelief on a well-executed Irish Whip because you yank someone hard by the arm after you've dazed them, they're going to move, yeah it's an exaggeration but I can tolerate it. I can't suspend disbelief on a 'going through the motions' Irish Whip.
I certainly can't suspend disbelief on a lot of modern wrestling. Even stuff that I used to love to see, like the RVD/Lynn exchanges, doesn't seem as well done to me, I'm so sick of the "I do this, you do this, I do this, you do this, Kung Fu pose-down", it's nearly always the same endpoint and so often just features very obviously preplanned exchanges. There's guys who can do it well and make it look organic, end without a karate kid pose, but way too many guys do it who really can't make it look good. I know this is very "Old Man Yells At Cloud" but I can't help it, I just plain can't get invested in a ton of modern wrestling because there's a lot less character work done to sell personalities especially in-ring and matches look too obviously like a choreographed dance or gymnastics routine, if I wanted that I'd watch dancing or gymnastics or acrobatics at the circus. Not EVERYBODY does it, but a lot do, so I have to agree with Bret.
Also LOL at his never-ending desire to take a dump on Goldberg.
|
|
Nr1Humanoid
Hank Scorpio
Is the #3 humanoid at best.
Posts: 5,482
|
Post by Nr1Humanoid on Feb 6, 2024 12:40:30 GMT -5
When was the last time someone asked Bret an original question not designed to hopefully have him say something negative?
|
|
asuka007
Fry's dog Seymour
Posts: 20,448
|
Post by asuka007 on Feb 6, 2024 13:18:22 GMT -5
I enjoy modern wrestling for what it is, but Bret isn't wrong. It's more like a dance now. You just have to appreciate it for what it is or move on, because just like everything else it's going to change. And the people that retired 20 years before Bret Hart would have said the same about his contemporaries. As will the ones that come 20 years after this generation retire and so on and so on. Karl Gotch complained about how Harley Race made wrestling “unrealistic” back in the day.
|
|
|
Post by celtics543 on Feb 6, 2024 14:12:10 GMT -5
Here's the issue, and why I agree with Bret, people know wrestling is pre-determined. No one thinks what they're watching is real, so if you're really hurting each other for fans who assume it's not real, then who's the mark?
|
|
Renslayer
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
every time i come around your city...
Posts: 16,573
|
Post by Renslayer on Feb 6, 2024 14:26:26 GMT -5
Bill Goldberg never gonna a have a moment of peace when the hitman's around
|
|
|
Post by IgnahtaSempria on Feb 6, 2024 20:20:56 GMT -5
On the one hand, I understand and kind of agree with Bret's take on stiff chops being unnecessary.
On the other hand, Bret used to take corner bumps chest-first, which he has stated multiple times over the years was more painful to him than doing the normal corner bump, simply because no one else was doing it. No one asked him to do that, no one forced him to do that, he did that on his own.
So Bret getting upset about guys working stiff when he went out of his way to take corner bumps the most painful way possible feels like a pot/kettle argument.
|
|
|
Post by EvenBaldobombHasAJob on Feb 6, 2024 20:42:43 GMT -5
There are 3 certainties in life; death, taxes and Bret Hart being shitty to Goldberg
|
|