Could Tuxedo/Bra and Panties Matches be done today?

[OGBoardPoster2005]

I decided to include both because even though some of the audience sees one as a sexual deal, the other seems for laughs.

I can't recall the last time either were done in WWE or AEW/TNA (if ever in AEW case). My question is could you really do either these days?

I feel like it would have to be a situation where the Heel is a pretentious heel. In the case of a Tuxedo Match he is someone that takes themselves very serious and sees themself as a real wrestler, embarrassed to be in this sort of match, only to be humiliated in the process.

In the case of a female in a Bra and Panties (Or Evening Gown) match, I understand the stigma from the old ones as someone who unfortunately tried treating wrestling as a family activity as a 10 year old, only to get a lot of uncomfortable nights watching these and the Lingerie Pillow Fights.

Yet could the match type and stipulation still work in the same way a Tuxedo Match would? Cornette tells the story of a match with The Dirty White Girl and Tammy Sytch where Tammy had been spending weeks being this pretentious young college age snarky Heel, only for Dirty White Girl to chase her under the ring and come out with her clothes, resulting in Tammy having to be covered in a table cloth and taken out of the ring.

Would that work for any female wrestler currently without it being sexual sleaze as it was 20 years ago?

What do you think, is there a place for either of these matches in today's wrestling world?

[froggyfrog]

Tuxedo match could still work assuming one of the participants has a gimmick that fits with it and it’d have to be done as a joke as it always has been obv.

Bra and Panties match would have the offending company dragged over the coals and canceled so fast I can’t see that flying at all in 2024. To be fair the level of womens wrestling in the US is way way above where it was when those were being popularized. Basically everyone on the scene is a serious wrestler/athlete now

[OGBoardPoster2005]

Mar 21, 2024 15:04:19 GMT -5 froggyfrog said:

Tuxedo match could still work assuming one of the participants has a gimmick that fits with it and it’d have to be done as a joke as it always has been obv.

Bra and Panties match would have the offending company dragged over the coals and canceled so fast I can’t see that flying at all in 2024. To be fair the level of womens wrestling in the US is way way above where it was when those were being popularized. Basically everyone on the scene is a serious wrestler/athlete now

Could you not play the B&P stipulation off in the same way you do the Tuxedo? Instead of it being the traditional B&P match, its a Dress Match

Or because of it being females, it can't be seen in a comedic light?

On the flip side, I've always thought tuxedo matches, even if they are suppose to be "funny" (I don't find them to be), are just a weird concept in general in wrestling, but I can't imagine it reaching the perv levels the former tends to get.

[Zombie Mod is not a ghoul.]

bra & panties matches:
can they be done today? yes.
should they be done today? maybe to no.

you can have a heel doing everything they can to humiliate a face, including them forcing this stipulation on a match where either side wins (either continue the feud with the extra "I humiliated you in front of an audience of" or as a bit of revenge by the face).
but it has to be done with care and not just booked for the amusement of a couple of horny old goats backstage or to pop a rating, and have the express permission from both women doing the match stating that they're ok with doing it.

it's a stipulation that should be used incredibly rarely and when used, it's made clear it's not done as a prop up the ratings/cheap crowd pop/perv spot.

[OGBoardPoster2005]

Mar 21, 2024 16:08:18 GMT -5 Zombie Mod is not a ghoul. said:

bra & panties matches:
can they be done today? yes.
should they be done today? maybe to no.

you can have a heel doing everything they can to humiliate a face, including them forcing this stipulation on a match where either side wins (either continue the feud with the extra "I humiliated you in front of an audience of" or as a bit of revenge by the face).
but it has to be done with care and not just booked for the amusement of a couple of horny old goats backstage or to pop a rating, and have the express permission from both women doing the match stating that they're ok with doing it.

it's a stipulation that should be used incredibly rarely and when used, it's made clear it's not done as a prop up the ratings/cheap crowd pop/perv spot.

Thats how I look at it.

The issue with the originals was they happened way too often and felt like eye candy for the sake of. I feel that a once in a while stipulation used perhaps for the occasion you outlined would be the only route to go if done today.

I almost feel a stripping spot is best suited for a real match though. An example would be like Bret ripping Perfect's tights off at Summerslam 1991. Maybe a spot where a Heel is depantsed trying to hold onto the ropes on a sunset flip resulting in them letting go and being flipped.

[Ultimo Gallos]

I am sure some tiny indie in has done both or at least one of them.

When is the last time any big fed did a Loser wears a dress match? What late 90s maybe. Local indie did one in 2023. Was the final match in a long running feud. Of course the heel lost and had to put on the dress after teh match. Was more of a Homer Simpson Moomoo looking outfit.

So yea you could do bra & panties or tuxedo matches now.

[Bo Rida]

Yes. Conedy underdog woman gets to pick the stipulation against a serious wrestler and goes for bra and panties match to even things up. Especially if they don't announce the gimmick before hand and they come out wearing everything they own like Joey in Friends.

In theory a heel gm could use it too but the crowd would probably cheer so its playing with fire and best avoided. Plus at this point heel GMa need to stay dead.

[KAMALARAMBO: BOOMSHAKALAKA!!!]

Great topic! I’m surprised when MLW relaunched Court Bauer didn’t try to do a tuxedo match. At the time they were scraping the barrel and trying to get the rights to anything WWE let the trademark lapse on. I know they did their own Boiler Room Brawl match, but I think there was some less memorable stuff too.

Anyway, I think a tuxedo match could definitely be done today. Like the OP mentioned it’s more comedy than anything to do with sex.

A bra and panties match would be tougher to imagine, especially in today’s climate. The general perception is women’s wrestling has moved on from those kind of matches. So I don’t know who would want to be the one who looks like they’re making the argument, “No it hasn’t!”

Even the widely rebuked feds like XPW I doubt would do a bra and panties match. They’d probably go for something scummier. Maybe a gravy bowl with shards of glass hidden in it match? Somewhere Rob Black is salivating and he has no idea why.

[Ultimo Gallos]

Mar 21, 2024 17:06:07 GMT -5 Bo Rida said:

Yes. Conedy underdog woman gets to pick the stipulation against a serious wrestler and goes for bra and panties match to even things up. Especially if they don't announce the gimmick before hand and they come out wearing everything they own like Joey in Friends.

In theory a heel gm could use it too but the crowd would probably cheer so its playing with fire and best avoided. Plus at this point heel GMa need to stay dead.

Reminds me of a intergender match from last year.

The Gulf Coast Wrestling Booked a Male Face vs a female heel. OK that can work.

It didn't Crowd cheered Stella Ren the entire match. She was in her 3rd match had no clue what to do. Her opponent Chase Matthews didnt know what to do eitehr and he has been in and out of the southern indie scene for the past 15 years.

Oddly there was one guy in the crowd yelling for Chase to "KICK THAT HUSSEYS ASS. LOOK SHE GOT IT ALL HANGING OUT KICK IT".

Pretty much you can book any type of match. Will it get over depends on the match type,what area it is held in and if the people in the match are talented enough to pivot if something goes sideways.

Comes down to knowing your crowd. If they like seeing say Hillbilly Joe,even if his best match might be 1/2 *,well you book him every show and keep that crowd happy.

[OGBoardPoster2005]

Mar 21, 2024 17:06:07 GMT -5 Bo Rida said:

Yes. Conedy underdog woman gets to pick the stipulation against a serious wrestler and goes for bra and panties match to even things up. Especially if they don't announce the gimmick before hand and they come out wearing everything they own like Joey in Friends.

In theory a heel gm could use it too but the crowd would probably cheer so its playing with fire and best avoided. Plus at this point heel GMa need to stay dead.

That would be good booking too.

A Maria type babyface or even just one that is small enough and can pull off being quirky and funny too would work for that part.

She can bumble into a feud with say Charlotte Flair or someone thats established. I'd put the Heel over because the Face can make the most fun of it and perhaps even get back at the Heel somehow.

Definitely wouldn't book Rhea/Becky in this sort of match against one another but you can definitely either find a serious heel or one that can be embarrassed the same sort of way Jim Cornette, Harvey Whippleman, and Paul E did in their matches.

Though it would be interesting to see it being taken very serious and turn into a stiff brutal brawl that ends with removing clothes as a final humiliation in defeat.

[This Player Hating Mothman]

I've never seen one of either that's actually very good so whatever social climate questions there are get undercut for me by "They're f***ing bad matches you guys"

[Urn Anderson]

They should do a match where the goal is to put a tuxedo or a bra and panties on your opponent.

["Cane Dewey" Johnson]

I think so. Anybody can wear a tuxedo. Anybody can wear bras and panties. So why not? But I also agree that these matches are never actually good.

[Mozenrath]

Mar 21, 2024 16:08:18 GMT -5 Zombie Mod is not a ghoul. said:

bra & panties matches:
can they be done today? yes.
should they be done today? maybe to no.

you can have a heel doing everything they can to humiliate a face, including them forcing this stipulation on a match where either side wins (either continue the feud with the extra "I humiliated you in front of an audience of" or as a bit of revenge by the face).
but it has to be done with care and not just booked for the amusement of a couple of horny old goats backstage or to pop a rating, and have the express permission from both women doing the match stating that they're ok with doing it.

it's a stipulation that should be used incredibly rarely and when used, it's made clear it's not done as a prop up the ratings/cheap crowd pop/perv spot.

Right, it's not impossible, but it really needs to have the right angle behind it and the right people involved to fly.

It is just a lot more charged than tuxedo matches due to history.

["Gizzark" Mike Wronglevenay]

Sure.

But *why*

[Cvslfc123]

I was today years old when I discovered WCW did the B&P match first.

I thought for sure it was one of the perverted ideas of the sex pest.

[MrElijah]

I got the solution!

Cody Rhodes & Becky Lynch vs. Rhea Ripley & Dominick Mysterio in a Tuxedo Street Fight Steel Cage Coal Miners Glove Loser Leaves Town Match.

[tafkaga]

Mar 21, 2024 22:34:02 GMT -5 Urn Anderson said:

They should do a match where the goal is to put a tuxedo or a bra and panties on your opponent.

"We're just one sock away from the World Heavyweight championship changing hands!" 

[XIII]

Probably not…with the irony being that most of what the ladies wear isn’t that far off from underwear size already.

[Allie Kitsune]

If the genders were reversed, probably.

You could probably do a tuxedo match with women (with their normal wrestling gear underneath), or a bra-and-panties match with men.

But not the old way.