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Post by Hulkshi Tanahashi on Feb 4, 2007 21:52:13 GMT -5
I'm not going to get into Vince Russo debate Version 7.23434345. But people act as though he contributed nothing to wrestling. Does everyone forget how flipping lame WWF was in the early 90s? Does everyone forget how WWE has been for the most part, average the last 5 years? Yes, Russo booked Arqutte as champion, Goldberg as heel, Judy Bagwell as tag champion etc, etc. But WWE has booked HHH humping a mannequin, Terrorists strangling the Undertaker and Randy Orton crashing Eddie Guerrero's lowrider a month after he died. Every booker/promtion has had it's share of stupid, moronic storylines. Why Russo seems to get dumped on 5000 times more than anyone else in beyond me. Plus, he was one of the driving forces behind the Attitude Era.
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Post by Can you afford to pay me, Gah on Feb 4, 2007 21:58:33 GMT -5
You have to admit he did make some good points. That he's job is to get people talking and to watch the show. But how he did it wasn't good.
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Post by Lenny: Smooth like Keith Stone on Feb 4, 2007 22:04:17 GMT -5
Russo explains having stuff like matches between Oklahoma and Madusa because "straight wrestling does not bring in eyeballs to the product, he needs to write entertainment that caters to the masses" or something. Statements like that bother me, because who in their right mind found that to be entertaining. I think that a "wrestling match" between an out of shape Jim Ross impersonator and a woman is not very good television, and apparently millions of people agreed with me.
Also, he took way too much credit for the "This Is Your Life" segment. It was not the segment itself that made that segment the success that it was. It was the Rock and Mick Foley's delivery and execution of that skit that made it so great. If you took two guys of average charisma and personality and placed them in the "this is your life" skit, it would not have been anything that spectacular.
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Post by DSR on Feb 4, 2007 22:05:36 GMT -5
I'm not going to get into Vince Russo debate Version 7.23434345. But people act as though he contributed nothing to wrestling. Does everyone forget how flipping lame WWF was in the early 90s? Does everyone forget how WWE has been for the most part, average the last 5 years? Yes, Russo booked Arqutte as champion, Goldberg as heel, Judy Bagwell as tag champion etc, etc. But WWE has booked HHH humping a mannequin, Terrorists strangling the Undertaker and Randy Orton crashing Eddie Guerrero's lowrider a month after he died. Every booker/promtion has had it's share of stupid, moronic storylines. Why Russo seems to get dumped on 5000 times more than anyone else in beyond me. If you really look at it, there's been crap and good stuff in every "era" of wrestling. Hell, the attitude era had a Japanese guy threatening to chop off a porn star's penis. Not exactly what I think of (or want to think of) when it comes to wrestling, but it did happen. Likewise, the early 90s might've sucked ratings-wise, but we head guys like Randy Savage, Mr. Perfect, Shawn Michaels, Razor Ramon, Bret Hart, etc. all delivering fine performances. And you say Russo gets dumped on so much for what he's done, and you gone about the lame things WWE has done in the past few years. Well, last I remember, no one was clamoring for more Lowriders crashing into things. And everyone (and I mean EVERYONE) hated the Katie Vick angle. So, it's not like WWE gets a free pass for the garbage they've put on tv. It's just that we don't know as much about the current "creative team" in WWE, whereas we kinda know more about Vince Russo and what he's written.
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Post by Jason Todd Grisham on Feb 4, 2007 22:08:46 GMT -5
Russo explains having stuff like matches between Oklahoma and Madusa because "straight wrestling does not bring in eyeballs to the product, he needs to write entertainment that caters to the masses" or something. Statements like that bother me, because who in their right mind found that to be entertaining. Excuse me? I found that very entertaining. Just not in the way he probably intended.
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Post by DSR on Feb 4, 2007 22:12:48 GMT -5
Russo explains having stuff like matches between Oklahoma and Madusa because "straight wrestling does not bring in eyeballs to the product, he needs to write entertainment that caters to the masses" or something. Yeah, Vince Russo knows what brings eyeballs to the product. Hey, someone remind me how many eyeballs were watching Nitro LIVE this past Monday? Oh wait-
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Post by invaderdave on Feb 4, 2007 22:15:26 GMT -5
I fear for TNA because Lance Storm is boycotting it.
Anyway, I kinda saw the whole Russo sucking thing from about a mile away, even when people were praising his dumb ass.
Can I say he's ruining TNA yet without people yelling at me for it?
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Post by DSR on Feb 4, 2007 22:16:48 GMT -5
I fear for TNA because Lance Storm is boycotting it. Anyway, I kinda saw the whole Russo sucking thing from about a mile away, even when people were praising his dumb ass. Can I say he's ruining TNA yet without people yelling at me for it? What does it matter, people already yell at you. DAVE, THAT'S NEVER GONNA HEAL IF YOU DON'T STOP PICKING!!!
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Post by invaderdave on Feb 4, 2007 22:18:12 GMT -5
I fear for TNA because Lance Storm is boycotting it. Anyway, I kinda saw the whole Russo sucking thing from about a mile away, even when people were praising his dumb ass. Can I say he's ruining TNA yet without people yelling at me for it? What does it matter, people already yell at you. DAVE, THAT'S NEVER GONNA HEAL IF YOU DON'T STOP PICKING!!! BUT IT'S FUN! Anyhoo....oh no wait, I've got nothing to add anymore. Everytime I respond I'll just state that Russo is terrible.
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Post by Lenny: Smooth like Keith Stone on Feb 4, 2007 22:20:03 GMT -5
I dont think I can link to it directly because of some mild dirty language, but seek out part 8 of this shoot interview and watch that. He talks specifically about David Arquette, booking himself to win the WCW title, and how wrestling fans are always gonna watch wrestling no matter how bad it is.
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Post by Lenny: Smooth like Keith Stone on Feb 4, 2007 22:39:58 GMT -5
I've been watching all the interview segments in sequence. Very interesting stuff.
In Part 10, he talks about his first stint in TNA back when it was the weekly PPV and he was on it. He said that it didnt work out because it wasn't what he thought it was gonna be. He mentions how shows like the Sopranos and Sex and the City were on HBO and not regular TV, so they were allowed to get away with edgier language, nudity, etc. He said that he thought that with TNA being the "PPV wrestling show", there would have been more nudity and obscene language on the show. He wanted it to be the "Sopranos" of wrestling shows. Again different strokes I guess, but I don't think there should be nudity on wrestling shows.
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sabu
Don Corleone
Posts: 1,605
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Post by sabu on Feb 5, 2007 14:45:20 GMT -5
Russo is in as much denial as the Ultimate warrior. Vince R. has done a tremendous amount of damage to pro wrestling
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Post by davephlegmball on Feb 5, 2007 14:49:23 GMT -5
Russo is nothing but a parasite.
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Post by #Classic Hi-Definition X on Feb 5, 2007 15:13:54 GMT -5
There's probably some truth in that statement. Look at how many people complain about WWE programming every week and yet still watch it.
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Post by Banned Member on Feb 5, 2007 15:38:57 GMT -5
What gets my goat is this whole attitude that the wrestling isn't entertaining and doesn't matter. Look, all I want is a good, solid match with a reasonable angle that gives me a REASON to watch the match. Am I in the minority? Because I feel like I should be ashamed or something. No your not I'm with ya!
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Post by Kerry Von Erich is my hero on Feb 5, 2007 16:15:20 GMT -5
Oklahoma WAS a funny character! I should start an Oklahoma fan club here at the WC board... "What's his name? Juvi? JUVI! JUVI! JUVI!" I loved Oklahoma...until he started wrestling. i liked when he started wrestling and when he would announce during his own matches
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hollywood
King Koopa
the bullet dodger
The Green Arrow has approved this post.
Posts: 11,122
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Post by hollywood on Feb 5, 2007 16:23:58 GMT -5
Russo's entire strategy is about shocking people to grab their attention, but he never stops to think about presenting a good story to keep their attention. He's better suited at a carnival than on TV.
I like how Russo insists that he brought the WW(F)E to prominence during the Attitude era. I mean, there's no way talented guys like Mick Foley, Hunter Hearst Helsmley, the Rock, or "Stone Cold" Steve Austin had anything to do with it.
The man is convinced he's some sort of martyr. He left the E because Vince didn't appreciate his talents when he clearly deserved all the credit for the promotion's success. In WCW, World Champion: David Arquette and Viagra on a Poll Matches were all actually AWESOME ideas, but people just didn't understand.
His interview with RD alone practically proved how full of himself he was. He spent the entire time insisting RD was wrong, and critics were wrong, and fans were wrong, and anyone else who complained about him was wrong. "Yoo jus' dun undah-stand, RD...see, yoo hafta undah-stand...what yoo gotta undah-stand RD..."
When he wasn't justifying his re-goddamn-diculous gimmicks (General Rection?) and angles, he was constantly blaming his failures on "da politics." I swear it's like "da politics" were a single evil force he was constantly at war with. WTF are "da politics" anyway!?
In the whole Russo debate, I've been with Cornette. Now I'm also with Lance Storm. No doubt when TNA collapses, Russo will have a list of excuses for that too.
[/Russo rant]
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Boku AKA Da Green Guy
El Dandy
WC's Resident Pirate Otaku and Official Scapegoat
Always and Forever, Hurricane.
Posts: 8,371
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Post by Boku AKA Da Green Guy on Feb 5, 2007 16:29:15 GMT -5
Russo's entire strategy is about shocking people to grab their attention, but he never stops to think about presenting a good story to keep their attention. He's better suited at a carnival than on TV. I like how Russo insists that he brought the WW(F)E to prominence during the Attitude era. I mean, there's no way talented guys like Mick Foley, Hunter Hearst Helsmley, the Rock, or "Stone Cold" Steve Austin had anything to do with it. The man is convinced he's some sort of martyr. He left the E because Vince didn't appreciate his talents when he clearly deserved all the credit for the promotion's success. In WCW, World Champion: David Arquette and Viagra on a Poll Matches were all actually AWESOME ideas, but people just didn't understand. His interview with RD alone practically proved how full of himself he was. He spent the entire time insisting RD was wrong, and critics were wrong, and fans were wrong, and anyone else who complained about him was wrong. "Yoo jus' dun undah-stand, RD...see, yoo hafta undah-stand...what yoo gotta undah-stand RD..." When he wasn't justifying his re-goddamn-diculous gimmicks (General Rection?) and angles, he was constantly blaming his failures on "da politics." I swear it's like "da politics" were a single evil force he was constantly at war with. WTF are "da politics" anyway!? In the whole Russo debate, I've been with Cornette. Now I'm also with Lance Storm. No doubt when TNA collapses, Russo will have a list of excuses for that too. [/Russo rant] Bravo.
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Chainsaw
T
A very BAD man.
It is what it is
Posts: 90,480
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Post by Chainsaw on Feb 5, 2007 16:30:55 GMT -5
"What's his name? Juvi? JUVI! JUVI! JUVI!" I loved Oklahoma...until he started wrestling. i liked when he started wrestling and when he would announce during his own matches They stole that from King calling his own matches.
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Post by Lenny: Smooth like Keith Stone on Feb 5, 2007 16:41:07 GMT -5
In these shoot interview videos, Vince Russo explains why he stood behind the idea of crash TV. He made it out like everyone at home is sitting there with their clickers in hand, just waiting to change the channel. He specifically said that this is why TV matches cannot be too long. He said that as soon as the wrestlers hit a rest hold, we've lost 90% of the audience that we may never get back. I just flat out disagree with that. He isn't considering that most of the people watching the show are NOT just casual channel surfers... most of the people watching are wrestling fans who are voluntarily watching the show because they want to see it. These are people who are not itching to find something better to watch -- like when I turn on a wrestling show, I fully intend to watch it until it's over. Sure there are some people who are going to be casually flipping through the channels, and they might get bored if a wrestler hits a 2 minute chinlock. But you know what... these same viewers are likely to switch the channel when they see two guys fighting over a bottle of Viagra on a pole. They will flip the channel not because they are bored, but rather because they think what they are watching is stupid.
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