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Post by Gillberg: 0-175 on Mar 19, 2007 6:27:04 GMT -5
Whilst I have no problem with MMA, if you want to see wrestling that's serious and not flashy, why not watch something like ROH? It's wrestling, kayfabed but very realistic. Anyways, good video. Still not enough to make me switch though. I've been a wrestling fan almost since I've been born, and I'm not about to change just because of a slump. Because, somehow, when I watch wrestling I want someone to be there with a presence, and not just random people, like how I feel with ROH. I like the Taker like gimmicks, the HHH gimmicks, the realistic/mature gimmicks. I like wrestling for the gimmicks. When I watch MMA, I kinda feel like everyone has a gimmick. They are all bad ass. They aren't just "there" like how I feel with ROH and many have a "look" to them, unlike many in ROH/indies. Then again, there are those guys who are nameless fodder in Pride and UFC as well. But if I want to watch something for the fighting/sport, I'll choose MMA. It used to be wrestling, because honestly, the fakeness in wrestling can look more brutal than any Hollywood movie. Wrestling can be top-notch brutal if done right. But then comes that whole having to get into a guy's character deal there as well. It's complicated. Also, I don't usually watch online videos/DVDs. I prefer watching TV live or else I don't watch anything at all.
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Post by Gillberg: 0-175 on Mar 19, 2007 6:00:41 GMT -5
I've been watching wrestling for the majority of my life, but I think this video finally makes me take that leap from Vince's side-show for kids (HAM SAMMICH) and stay exclusive to MMA, which I have started to enjoy more with the new burst of interest (and to be fair, Couture, Ortiz and Liddell are better than the earlier UFC guys). The video in question: video.google.com/videoplay?docid=2810170922897779466&q=prideScrew pro-wrestling, I think it's time I moved on to something that feels legit. Pro-wrestling late 90s had that feeling to me, but I still want that legit bad-ass athlete feel to what I watch, not this cartoony shit that is on TV.
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Post by Gillberg: 0-175 on Mar 20, 2007 17:26:35 GMT -5
I bet somewhere Ric Flair, Dusty Rhodes and Harley Race are crying that a man who was with NWA all of what, two years, is the most wanted man in NWA...HISTORY!
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Post by Gillberg: 0-175 on Mar 20, 2007 19:13:07 GMT -5
Sorry, but I think that last one is ugly.
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Post by Gillberg: 0-175 on Mar 20, 2007 17:05:39 GMT -5
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Post by Gillberg: 0-175 on Mar 22, 2007 18:05:21 GMT -5
All I can say is that a Lynn/Chavo feud for the X title would be Godly.
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Post by Gillberg: 0-175 on Mar 29, 2007 17:24:10 GMT -5
Sting as done well in TNA. Solid promos and matches. Taking bumps and getting in shape. I couldn't believe I saw Sting getting Black Hole Slammed onto a pile of tacks! I mean, IT'S STING! When did he become hardcore? I think it had something to do with Vampiro. Or maybe he slept with that fat chick in your sig. That would make me want to inflict pain on myself until the memory of doing her is gone. One vote is not enough. I say VKM, Roode and the Naturals.
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Post by Gillberg: 0-175 on Mar 25, 2007 18:49:36 GMT -5
I wish he'd write on top of being a manager. While most of his stuff would be dark and brooding, I think he'd mix a lot of psychology into it -- manipulation and things that make for great villains.
Of course, I wouldn't have him write an entire show. Too much of that stuff would do nothing for the business but make all the 13 year old angsty teens get hard ons.
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Raven
Mar 29, 2007 17:36:08 GMT -5
Post by Gillberg: 0-175 on Mar 29, 2007 17:36:08 GMT -5
Raven is the mentor to this stable of Kaz(Frankie Kazarian), Martyr(Matt Bently) and Havok(Johnny Devine) and they have gone sort of goth and Raven beats them with canes to turn them into him basically. Team 3D is in a feud with LAX where they are faces and Lax are heels. Except the funny part is everyone hates Brother Ray so Team 3D gets boos and Lax is cheered. Also at lockdown they face off for the tag titles in an Electric cage match. The electric cage match sounds really really dumb But of course when it's done in Japan it's a 5 star match.
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Post by Gillberg: 0-175 on Feb 12, 2007 12:50:35 GMT -5
I like TNA. And I am really trying hard to love it. But for everything that's good theres usually something bad about it. Giving examples and actual things (not like "RUSSO BAD" "SHELLY GOOD") explain what you love and hate about the TNA product.
My Top 5 things about TNA: 1) The main eventers can be shuffled around endlessly. Who is Cage going to feud with after Angle? Joe? Rhino? Sting? Abyss? They have so many cemented main eventers in TNA and I love it whereas you need to pull a pin out of a haystack to find a credible world contender on RAW or ECW.
2) Sting vs. Abyss. I love this angle. Sting, the good guy, trying to get Abyss to think as his own man. What I hate is the background behind Abyss, and the fact that eventually he will go face and demask after this feud. I think the end should be that Abyss doesn't learn anything and stays with Mitchell the entire time. Abyss shouldn't get the Kane treatment.
3) Established characters. Christopher Daniels has an amazing character. Raven has a great character. Hell, even people without gimmicks like Joe and AJ seem to be great characters. None of them seem forced down our throats. And mind you a lot of these guys are fairly new. In other promotions it takes years to establish a character. Somehow it takes a few months in TNA.
4) Joe. Seriously, build the company around this man. Not only is he legit, he is legit looking and a bad muther shut your mouth. I'm not a workrate whore, and I prefer entertainment to straight up wrestling bouts, but what I see from Joe makes WWE seem like a circus compared to TNA. Stiff kicks, aerobatics and the muscle buster beat out a downed opponent (for minutes mind you) taking an elbow...and then losing because of it.
5) X-Division. No doubt. I don't need to explain this. TNA seems to have a great balance between their two seperate styles in which that you don't feel that one is drastically different than the other, meaning that neither diminishes the value of the other division, in terms of legitimacy.
Worst 5 Things about TNA 1) Screw job finishes. You only have an hour show, and it never really feels like it starts or finishes when you have so many undesisive matches.
2) Poor cuts. I hate when they cut out an entrance, or cut right to the ring where someone is magically there after a backstage promo. To me, it gives it a very cheap feel and makes the progression of the show out of wack. There are few transitions, and it makes it feel like an amateur's first movie.
3) Too many wacky skits. Eric Young having sex. VKM against VKM. These would all bode well on a 2 hour show, but you don't have that yet. Save the Russo creativity until it's needed. Right now you need to showcase the best of the brand in the hour you have, not take 40 minutes out of the show to develop useless feuds with guys who never wrestle on TV in crappy blow off matches at the PPV.
4) Too big a roster. Yeah, I said it. With the one hour they get, the roster is too big. They can cut the roster in half and you wouldn't notice the difference. Yet they cut costs elsewhere? Why the hell are Shark Boy and Smiley still employed? And Backland!?!?
5) The X-Division. Need I say more? Nash has turned it into a joke. The guys vying for the title went from silent but deadly athletes to guys with joke gimmicks. Sure, it's ok to establish them. Look at AJ and Daniels, Lynn and Senshi. They are legit guys who can go for the title. But Shelly, Starr and the Nashettes? They are nothing more than jokes now. They need to bring the X Division back up to the legitimacy it just recently lost, by having longer (and more) X Division matches and the Ultimate X again.
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Post by Gillberg: 0-175 on Feb 13, 2007 13:40:52 GMT -5
You're obviously asking the wrong people. Mostly everyone who posted here said that they've already previously watched TNA, and that it will return to the same old on Thursday. The show was to introduce new viewers to the show.
I think it did an ok job, could have been better (I was waiting for the Joe/daniels/AJ match, and hoping for the KoTM where Raven won), but it was more than enough of a wrestling fix for the average fan. They introduced their characters, and the show had to have a lot of promo time in it. You're trying to introduce an entire company in 2 hours, while showcasing some of the best matches they have. Of course you're gonna get promos.
I've been noticing that people in the IWC will bitch for the sake of bitching. TNA Films did piss me off, a lot, but I thought the show was a good way to devert RAW fans and have them tune in next time to increase their audience.
I also thought the stuff with Eric Young and the dogs was clever. Yeah, it was a pot shot, but it was also funny and served it's purpose to devert RAW fans even more by saying that the WWE channel cares more about dog shows than the wrestling fans.
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Post by Gillberg: 0-175 on Feb 25, 2007 3:16:11 GMT -5
There you go. You've seen pictures, not videos. Seriously, watch some You Tube videos of it with an open mind and then come back and make your point. It's vague to be saying it's the worse thing ever if youve only seen PICTURES. Do you judge a movei by seeing pictures of it. No, that's ridiculous. Same here. Sometimes you should....the last two movies I've seen (The Number 23, Ghost Rider) looked better. Off that tangent, I guess I'm just mad at people who moan and cry about how much WrestleCrap is in WWECW such as Nacho Libre but can love the same kind of thing when it's done somewhere else. I assure you if half the stuff in CHIKARA and HUSTLE were in WWE people would want them inducted in a heartbeat. If Nacho Libre was in HUSTLE, people wouldn't crap all over it like they do with it being in ECW. I just feel like theres some kind of double standard when it comes to this stuff. I would take an induction from CHIKARA like those Mario guys over an induction on WWECW, it seems far more worthy to induct and claim as 'Crap than the entire promotion of WWECW, especially when it's not all bad. In case you can't tell, I was going to post this in another thread, but I wanted to address it to everyone who watches this stuff.
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Post by Gillberg: 0-175 on Feb 25, 2007 2:58:17 GMT -5
It's when you put the "s" word in. It's ("s"word)ty that gets censored to crapty.
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Post by Gillberg: 0-175 on Feb 25, 2007 2:49:22 GMT -5
Eh, I don't watch Wrestling as a comedy. I mean I like some comedic sketches in it, but the pictures I've seen from those products don't interest me in the least. It seems like some low-class Adult Swim in-house cartoon, like Assy McGee or Tom Goes to the Mayor. It's not my type of humor.
To each his own, but I still think that those promotions rank right up there in stupidity as Mae Young giving birth to a hand. To think that that was supposed to be taken seriously is stretching it.
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Post by Gillberg: 0-175 on Feb 25, 2007 2:36:41 GMT -5
Ok, I'm not a WWE mark. And I'm not an indy mark. I watch what I want and like what I like. And sometimes it means not watching any wrestling for years on end.
Anyway...I have a question for you guys. I know everyone shits down the throat of WWE and TNA for their crappy sense of humor (WWE moreso than TNA), yet some of you guys around here love that one promotion in Japan where everyone is a Ninja Turtle rip off or a horse. And you like that CP Bunny and Colt Banana or whatever it is. How could you complain about WWE and TNA having shitty humor (like McMahon vs Trump and Big Fat Oily Guy) and then go about watching grown men in horse costumes that do things that try just as bad as what the national guys put out.
Just a random thought. I know I'll get flamed to high hell for this, but it does annoy me. Especially if people consider WWECW wrestlcrap but those guys aren't. To me, those guys should be the definition of WrestleCrap.
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Post by Gillberg: 0-175 on Feb 1, 2007 11:47:30 GMT -5
Don't forget the fact that WWE would need to get the permission and pay all the legends for it. I don't think their current legend contract thing would involve such a big project. Besides, you would always miss big players as people who hold grudges wouldn't sign. Like Warrior and Owen's wife. And Sting wouldn't sign. Nor could any other signed talent.
It's a good idea, and it could be done. But in reality there are most likely monetary issues keeping this game from happening. I sure as hell would like to play a "Monday Night Wars" game, and be able to create a gimmick for my guy per federation basis, along with gimmick type (like EWR) and heel/face allegiance.
But again, it won't happen cause of the money. You can't skimp a game like this and all like 20 signed to WWE Legend deals aren't enough to flesh out the game.
I'd rather them just research old storylines and put those into the game, and stop having them be so "randomly generated" which always results in starting a new game with a new guy and going through the same crap. They need to find a better way to distribute the storylines to the player so that there is much more replayability to the storymode in that you don't go through the bulk of it in one round of storymode.
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Post by Gillberg: 0-175 on Feb 1, 2007 13:45:43 GMT -5
This match was brutal. It's my all-time favorite. I was like 11 when it happened and it was f***ing surreal. I remember thinking that the match was over after the first bump through the table (And I think what MAY have helped was that he kinda elbow-dropped it. At least it looks that way, maybe he thought that it would kind of be the same effect of elbow-dropping someone from that height?) and put him on the stretcher. But shit, when it went on I couldn't believe it. That chokeslam too, the cell gave in on it, and I vividly remember Taker telling Foley to stay down. I thought it was just Taker playing his character (I didn't know how things worked and how they communicated until I heard Ken Shamrock tell Ryan Shamrock to slap him after she miscued) and Christ it was just surreal. Best match I've seen. Bar none.
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Post by Gillberg: 0-175 on Jan 26, 2007 23:16:22 GMT -5
Yeah, but you got to admit, he needed to job to Orton. That would have put his legend killer gimmick so much more over than it already is.
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Post by Gillberg: 0-175 on Jan 30, 2007 18:17:15 GMT -5
...ATTACK ON SMARKS! You all fell for JR's smarkbait.
Do you read his blog? He explained the Skittles incident on one of his blogs. And what does he do next week? He goes after the smarks who caught him on it by doing it again.
You could tell that he was intentionally doing it. He even shared a laugh with King afterwards, which was fully audible. He was ribbing himself, and the smarks who bitched about his shilling of Skittles.
Nothing more. I still can't believe no one picked up on that, and you're all attacking him (or at least acting like it was something important) about it.
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Post by Gillberg: 0-175 on Jan 30, 2007 18:12:49 GMT -5
I hate to say it, but you all sound like "The Rise and Fall of ECW" marks. It really doesn't sound like any of you have any knowledge of ECW other than that video. Probably a lot of you do, and I have to give it to the ECW of old to make people feel this way. It's an incredible bond that this promotion had with people. But it still doesn't make you all sound nothing more than sheep...(just think about that next time you complain, at least try to make it sound less sheepish, but that's just if you wanna win me over, and I don't think many care)
Anyway, I was pissed at first with the direction they took ECW into. But some of it was to be expected.
1) Vince couldn't build his company around the old fan base. Sure, the letters "E-C-W" in that order are a license to print money....if you are catering to all of two million people. Let's just take away the "smarks" for a second. How many of Vince's audience knew about ECW before he revived it. Most of his fan base (except the two million I mentioned) are new fans. I've seen it all around, GameFAQs, etc. Many started watching AFTER the Alliance, with all the old casuals leaving after that storyline. If RAW gets a 4.2 rating, that means that AT LEAST 2.2 million of them are people who have never had exposure to ECW. Let's not forget that the TV show bombed, and that only the East Coast saw the show, if they could be up at 3 AM, or tape traders/"smarks". So you eliminate another fraction of WWE fans that have had exposure to what "a supreme wrestling show" is.
By this, is he supposed to "treat" his loyal fans to a show that caters to them? Is he supposed to reward these select few (probably 35% of his fan base) to a show and accept low ratings? Yeah, I wish he would be content with the 1.2 people watching the show, and reward us loyal fans with one good show, but he isn't. He isn't wrong for it.
He (tried) to change the brand to fit the formula that bought in all the 4.2s. Excuse him for trying to get the ratings he gets with RAW on another show to make him more money.
2) He only used the ECW name to generate interest. And you all Goddamn know it! I was surprised and excited too to hear that ECW would be coming back. And I was gullible enough to believe that we'd be getting shows on par to the original ONS. But we didn't. After the success of the DVD, and the PPV, Vince knew ECW was a money maker. Of course, to believe that he wanted it to be bought back as anything but a money maker is complete crap.
Maybe he started off with good intentions, letting Heyman try to recreate what made him so much money, but control it so it wouldn't go under again. Through all the politicking, and his own interest (because, believe me, "garbage wrestling" is not what he likes, he only resorted to it in WWE to beat WCW), he took the magic away from ECW. And in his mind I KNOW that he thinks that if ECW went under once and failed to launch a national platform, something would have to be done to make it compatible with the rest of the audience.
3) Vince tried to make it compatible to his audience I see a lot of complaints about ECW using Holly, Test and Lashley. I also see people saying that the ECW originals could work circles around these guys. Guess what? It doesn't matter when the name of the game is to make a dollar. As I said before, more than half of his audience doesn't know what a Sandman is. More than half of his audience doesn't like a 20 minute technical bout, or a 5 minute hardcore match. More than half of his audience cheers for Lashley, and cheered the hell outta Holly when he went for Lesnar.
I could probably go on and on, and I should, but I will end it here. My disgust for the product has ended, and it's just sitting there in the back of my mind. At one point I was this brand's biggest supporter. But now after I saw it, I'm not even a WWE fan anymore. Maybe people like us all suffer from "old people syndrome", where anything new stinks. Maybe all us fans are just at that age. You can go on about ROH and stuff, but then again, I prefer heavy metal of the late 80s-early 90s to mostly anything today, but I still have some new bands I like too.
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