WWE Roundtable Discussion[Monday Night Wars]

[Near Fantastica]

I've always hated Dok Hendrix.

[thestinger]

I think Bischoff said a 'twelve year old green belt.' And he's right.

In addition to being the most unprofessional ass in the history of the business, Michaels has zero credible offensive moves.

He's got a talent for selling and that's it. I laugh whenever the folks drinking WWE kool aid say he's one of the 'best ever.'

[Arthur Digby Stamp]

I remember watching this series on 24/7, and wishing that Michael Hayes had been replaced with someone on the WCW side of the fence like Dusty Rhodes.

[kswolf]

All right, what's the deal with Jim Herd stealing Jim Ross' washer and dryer? Has anybody ever heard this anecdote?

[briant1]

Hayes comes across as a tool. Eric I think handled himself well.

[skillz]

Good clips. Hayes is clearly bitter and was quite annoying in those clips. Other than that, very interesting stuff.

Ever since WCW went under, I always feel Bischoff doesn't get the respect he deserves as far as what he did for WCW, which is compounded by the WWE twisting history on a regular basis.

I'm also glad Bischoff set Lawler straight on stealing WWF stars. Hollywood Hogan, Kevin Nash, and Scott Hall were not red and yellow Hogan, Diesel, and Razor Ramon. The only similarity was Hall's fake Cuban accent. They took WWF characters, tweaked them, and made those characters 100 times "cooler" to the fans. Same thing the WWF did with Austin, Foley, Taker, and all the others they "stole" from WCW. I honestly can't stand that argument. It's so stupid.

And kudos for knocking Shawn's finisher. It's amazing how people knock the People's Elbow, leg drop, FU, etc, but praise a weak looking kick that everyone has to sell like a gun shot. Come on.

[The Wrestling Rambler]

Hayes was just rude. Simply just wanted to say things for the sake of saying them.
Who invited him?

It was nice to see a WWE produced program of the Monday Night Wars, finally, not potraying Eric as the bad guy in it all for once.

[Next Level was WRONG]

Truly fascinating stuff.

[HMARK Center]

Hell, I give Eric points for not going the easy route and saying "Vince and his people argued back in '95-'97 that there was 'enough room under the wrestling tent' for WCW, WWF, and anyone else. Did he say that to Verne Gagne and Jim Crockett in the 1980's? Did he say that to all the other territories he crushed with an iron fist?"

Really, that was Vince at his most hypocritical. Vince had always been ruthless (like him or not), but the minute the tables were turned, he became a victim.

That said, for all the talk of those days being a "dream time" to be a wrestling fan, I always say it, but when I take the rose colored glasses off, that era is nowhere near as good as I like to remember it. Granted, there certainly was some AMAZING stuff, and things that had simply never been done before in wrestling, which was great.

But a lot of stuff in WWF in those days, for me and for my personal tastes, was awful. WCW was always uneven, with shoddy main events only being saved by the woefully underused undercard.

Again, it was the fact that mainstream wrestling suddenly started doing new things (i.e. hardcore matches, peddling sex, and also good stuff like more personal promos and more realistic characters) that allows a lot of people to remember things so fondly.

[skillz]

hitmanmark said:

Hell, I give Eric points for not going the easy route and saying "Vince and his people argued back in '95-'97 that there was 'enough room under the wrestling tent' for WCW, WWF, and anyone else. Did he say that to Verne Gagne and Jim Crockett in the 1980's? Did he say that to all the other territories he crushed with an iron fist?"

Really, that was Vince at his most hypocritical. Vince had always been ruthless (like him or not), but the minute the tables were turned, he became a victim.

That said, for all the talk of those days being a "dream time" to be a wrestling fan, I always say it, but when I take the rose colored glasses off, that era is nowhere near as good as I like to remember it. Granted, there certainly was some AMAZING stuff, and things that had simply never been done before in wrestling, which was great.

But a lot of stuff in WWF in those days, for me and for my personal tastes, was awful. WCW was always uneven, with shoddy main events only being saved by the woefully underused undercard.

Again, it was the fact that mainstream wrestling suddenly started doing new things (i.e. hardcore matches, peddling sex, and also good stuff like more personal promos and more realistic characters) that allows a lot of people to remember things so fondly.

Agreed about the Attitude Era (I even hated it back then), but I at least respect WCW because pre-Russo, they got over with wrestling storytelling. Whether you liked the company or not, they didn't resort to parading half-naked women for no reason, or featuring simulated sex with transvestites, or excessive cursing, or throwing catchphrases centered around oral sex, or mindless shock TV, etc. I believe they only started doing that when Russo came in. From 1996-1998, they were the best wrestling company in the world, and the only wrestling company that I wasn't embarrassed to watch. So for that, I'll give props to Bischoff. I think he ultimately destroyed the weekly show format by giving away PPV matches for free every week, but on the whole, I was more entertained by his product, and you could clearly see some of his fingerprints on a lot of the stuff the WWF eventually did.

The WWF capitalized on a culture that was craving Jerry Springer and South Park. Once that fad died, so did the Attitude Era. Smart strategy, and a very profitable one, but it hurt more than it helped in the long run. Though unlike WCW, at least they are alive now.

[ICBM]

By far the best vid post in a while thanx dude

[Rube]

Hayes annoyed the crap out of me.

Props to Bischoff for telling the truth about how WWE ripped their "attitude" from WCW.

[Hiroshi Hase]

icbm said:

By far the best vid post in a while thanx dude

I'm glad everyone enjoyed this video, I thought as not everyone gets 24/7, that some would like to see this. I think this was the best Roundtable Discussion they've had so far.

[thestinger]

rube said:

Props to Bischoff for telling the truth about how WWE ripped their "attitude" from WCW.

That was my favorite part. It's called the 'attitude' era because the victors write the history books. What WWF did was "Nitro-ize" their show.

I loved Eric going, "All of sudden HHH is wearing jeans and a leather jacket and spraypainting things."

[HMARK Center]

The funny thing is, as crude and vulgar as South Park is, it really evolved as a show over time. South Park, in the years since the late 90's, has moved beyond simple shock value, and become a truly well written, funny show (along with a lot of shock comedy to spice it up, as well).

I'm never one to say things like "think of the children!" or "how crude/crass/whatever!", but I agree; the extents to which WWF went in those days to come off as edgy just ended up getting old to me after about 9 months (I started watching WWF again around the time of WM 14, stopped again (or at least started watching less) a month or so before WM 15). Once I got over being 13 and thinking "I can't believe they're doing this on the same show I used to watch when I was 8!", the shows tended to feel pretty lackluster, aside from some of the solid main event storylines (i.e. Rock vs. Mankind).

[The Line]

I agree with the Hayes stuff.
He seemed to disagree with Bischoff the person, and not Bischoff's points

[Mr. Mediocre]

These are great videos. Seriously enjoying watching them.

[General Zod]

I remember watching these as they came out. They were my favorite part of the WWE 24/7 package, and I wish they would do more.

I agree about Hayes. I always like P.S., but watching him antagonize Bisch was a bit like listening to Gerald Briscoe on the Monday Night Wars DVD. A bit sychopantic for my tastes, but I suppose even a Freebird has his price.

DiBiasie was so right, man...

[The Line]

kinda on topic, kinda off, but are there any roundtable disscussions about ECW?

And another question, what are some of the other roundtable discussions about?

I wish WWE would release some of their exclusive 24/7 stuff on DVD(like the monday night wars stuff and the ECW history)

[mcclanahan]

this is beautiful, I havn't watched it all yet but part 2 19 minutes 7 seconds in and part 3 2 minutes 46 seconds in, it's the same part, truer words have never been spoken of the original 3 in the nWo, with the exception of Scott Hall they couldn't work...even Bisch agrees with me