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Post by Kevin Hamilton on Nov 2, 2009 23:25:16 GMT -5
the hell?
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Brother Coyote
Samurai Cop
Has Clarity of Vision Is an engine of will
Posts: 2,124
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Post by Brother Coyote on Nov 2, 2009 23:32:57 GMT -5
You know, a lot of the time I can just wave away bad movies or books, Twilight however is like in your face belligerently terrible. It's so bad I find myself having to go to extremes to forget people are actually waiting with baited breath for this monster turd.
I'm sitting here listening to Waltzing Matilda just to calm down. I've had to turn to the Dubliners to cleanse my mental palette.
It's the KNOWING that bothers me so much. KNOWING not only how terrible these books are, not only in subject matter or perspective but in the vein of crappy writing.
I've read bad books, and poorly written books but Twilight is glorified Mary Sue championed, wish fulfillment fan fiction. It's literally porn for lonely 30 year old Ann Rice fans and 12 year old girls.
I find Twlight's existence distasteful and its mainstream popularity disheartening. In a world where Mark Twain is pulled from library shelves and replaced by Twilight and Harry Potter we're surely digging our own graves.
When Steven King who'd never done anything but write some of the best books and movies in the last twenty years decides YOU'RE the person he needs to come out and blast for being a shitty writer you may as well embrace it and roll in your giant undeserved pile of money to make yourself feel better.
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Jay Peas 42
El Dandy
Totally flips out ALL the time.
Is looking forward to a Nation of Domination Kwannza Special.
Posts: 8,329
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Post by Jay Peas 42 on Nov 2, 2009 23:33:41 GMT -5
In all fairness, Buffy, of which Twilight is just a bad fanfic of, had some pretty horrible werewolf sfx. First you had Wolf A, which actually looked like a werewolf and a guy in a werewolf suit at the same time. Then you had wolf B, which looked like a guy in a demon dog suit, which I sure seemed cooler, but didn't actually look like a werewolf. If given a choice, I want my Werewolves to look more like a suit from the Janos Prohaska Collection than a man trying to walk on four legs, although that time Oz mauled Mr. Hyde was pretty sweet, "Time's up." Basically, werewolves are very hard to animate due to the hundreds of thousands of hairs that have to be independently animated on the creature. I mean, how many good wolves are there? Lupin? The Warg-Riders? That's why Red 13 got like five seconds in Advent Children, whereas the Turks got half the film. That's why all early CGI was Dinosaurs and Gungans, no hair. Unless you have a high powered CGI team, werewolves are still pretty difficult.
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Post by Kevin Hamilton on Nov 2, 2009 23:36:31 GMT -5
In all fairness, Buffy, of which Twilight is just a bad fanfic of, had some pretty horrible werewolf sfx. First you had Wolf A, which actually looked like a werewolf and a guy in a werewolf suit at the same time. Then you had wolf B, which looked like a guy in a demon dog suit, which I sure seemed cooler, but didn't actually look like a werewolf. If given a choice, I want my Werewolves to look more like a suit from the Janos Prohaska Collection than a man trying to walk on four legs, although that time Oz mauled Mr. Hyde was pretty sweet, "Time's up." Basically, werewolves are very hard to animate due to the hundreds of thousands of hairs that have to be independently animated on the creature. I mean, how many good wolves are there? Lupin? The Warg-Riders? That's why Red 13 got like five seconds in Advent Children, whereas the Turks got half the film. That's why all early CGI was Dinosaurs and Gungans, no hair. Unless you have a high powered CGI team, werewolves are still pretty difficult. Fair enough, that's a good point.
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Post by Cry Me a Wiggle on Nov 2, 2009 23:44:57 GMT -5
If I knew drinking blood would turn girls on, I wouldn't have stopped when I did.
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Post by Chuckie Finster on Nov 2, 2009 23:50:12 GMT -5
I can't wait until the fourth movie for two reason.
1) It's the last movie and it'll be all over.
2) To see how the "rough sex" and "rough birth" is portrayed.
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Post by Jedi-El of Tomorrow on Nov 2, 2009 23:56:56 GMT -5
In all fairness, Buffy, of which Twilight is just a bad fanfic of, had some pretty horrible werewolf sfx. First you had Wolf A, which actually looked like a werewolf and a guy in a werewolf suit at the same time. Then you had wolf B, which looked like a guy in a demon dog suit, which I sure seemed cooler, but didn't actually look like a werewolf. If given a choice, I want my Werewolves to look more like a suit from the Janos Prohaska Collection than a man trying to walk on four legs, although that time Oz mauled Mr. Hyde was pretty sweet, "Time's up." Basically, werewolves are very hard to animate due to the hundreds of thousands of hairs that have to be independently animated on the creature. I mean, how many good wolves are there? Lupin? The Warg-Riders? That's why Red 13 got like five seconds in Advent Children, whereas the Turks got half the film. That's why all early CGI was Dinosaurs and Gungans, no hair. Unless you have a high powered CGI team, werewolves are still pretty difficult. Which is why you get a makeup artist like Rick Baker. Just look at An American Werewolf in London, the wolf effects in that still kick the shit out of wolf effects now, and it's almost 30 years later. There's a reason he's been nominated for 11 Academy Awards. And to be fair to Buffy, a television show doesn't have nearly the budget that a big movie does. Also Buffy could negate the effects with good writing, good plot, good characters and acting.
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Post by Kevin Hamilton on Nov 3, 2009 0:00:34 GMT -5
In all fairness, Buffy, of which Twilight is just a bad fanfic of, had some pretty horrible werewolf sfx. First you had Wolf A, which actually looked like a werewolf and a guy in a werewolf suit at the same time. Then you had wolf B, which looked like a guy in a demon dog suit, which I sure seemed cooler, but didn't actually look like a werewolf. If given a choice, I want my Werewolves to look more like a suit from the Janos Prohaska Collection than a man trying to walk on four legs, although that time Oz mauled Mr. Hyde was pretty sweet, "Time's up." Basically, werewolves are very hard to animate due to the hundreds of thousands of hairs that have to be independently animated on the creature. I mean, how many good wolves are there? Lupin? The Warg-Riders? That's why Red 13 got like five seconds in Advent Children, whereas the Turks got half the film. That's why all early CGI was Dinosaurs and Gungans, no hair. Unless you have a high powered CGI team, werewolves are still pretty difficult. Which is why you get a makeup artist like Rick Baker. Just look at An American Werewolf in London, the wolf effects in that still kick the s*** out of wolf effects now, and it's almost 30 years later. There's a reason he's been nominated for 11 Academy Awards. And to be fair to Buffy, a television show doesn't have nearly the budget that a big movie does. Also Buffy could negate the effects with good writing, good plot, good characters and acting. Also a good point. I'm diplomatic.
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Jay Peas 42
El Dandy
Totally flips out ALL the time.
Is looking forward to a Nation of Domination Kwannza Special.
Posts: 8,329
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Post by Jay Peas 42 on Nov 3, 2009 0:08:33 GMT -5
Oh, practical effects with Werewolves would work much better than CGI. I mean, real hair is much easier to work with. However, there's only so much you can do with it. You want a werewolf to lumber, you can do that. You want crazy Matrix Fight Scenes, forget about it. Now, they might do just that, and pull the old switcheroo for action scenes.
Buffy did do well with limited resources, but the point was, Buffy's werewolves where among the worst sfx of the show, and If Buffy did it poorly, what hope do these far inferior films have? Werewolves aren't about sending an order for one Werewolf to ILM, they take a lot of work and money to make right, and I doubt anyone watching Twilight is going to care much for the werewolf sfx.
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Post by The Charismatic Enabeler on Nov 3, 2009 0:19:47 GMT -5
Man, when is this fad ending?
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Post by knightrider01 on Nov 3, 2009 0:25:08 GMT -5
Which is why you get a makeup artist like Rick Baker. Just look at An American Werewolf in London, the wolf effects in that still kick the s*** out of wolf effects now, and it's almost 30 years later. There's a reason he's been nominated for 11 Academy Awards. And to be fair to Buffy, a television show doesn't have nearly the budget that a big movie does. Also Buffy could negate the effects with good writing, good plot, good characters and acting. Also a good point. I'm diplomatic. Also you can forgive it because Angel killed one...with a pen.
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Post by taylorandborland on Nov 3, 2009 0:28:31 GMT -5
LOL @ Twilight.
People bend over backwards not to make feminists mad these days. now here comes a book series about a girl who's ready to die to be for a metro vampire who treats her like shit. I haven't seen any public boycotts or nothing.
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Post by The Charismatic Enabeler on Nov 3, 2009 0:31:27 GMT -5
LOL @ Twilight. People bend over backwards not to make feminists mad these days. now here comes a book series about a girl who's ready to die to be for a metro vampire who treats her like s***. I haven't seen any public boycotts or nothing. Not to mention that I hear the girl in question can't even seem to walk down stairs without a mans help.
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Post by Michael Coello on Nov 3, 2009 0:34:18 GMT -5
LOL @ Twilight. People bend over backwards not to make feminists mad these days. now here comes a book series about a girl who's ready to die to be for a metro vampire who treats her like s***. I haven't seen any public boycotts or nothing. So, it's a really crappy version of 'Mad Love'?
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Post by taylorandborland on Nov 3, 2009 0:40:28 GMT -5
LOL @ Twilight. People bend over backwards not to make feminists mad these days. now here comes a book series about a girl who's ready to die to be for a metro vampire who treats her like s***. I haven't seen any public boycotts or nothing. Not to mention that I hear the girl in question can't even seem to walk down stairs without a mans help. Her co-dependent ass has got issues. This dude gets away with stalking her while she sleeps, nearly getting her killed and eaten, damn near eating her himself, leaving her in a forest to die... And after it's all said and done, she has a mental breakdown when HE dumps HER. I'm starting to think the lady who wrote this garbage meant for it to be more like a cautionary tale
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Post by HMARK Center on Nov 3, 2009 0:58:35 GMT -5
You know, a lot of the time I can just wave away bad movies or books, Twilight however is like in your face belligerently terrible. It's so bad I find myself having to go to extremes to forget people are actually waiting with baited breath for this monster turd. I'm sitting here listening to Waltzing Matilda just to calm down. I've had to turn to the Dubliners to cleanse my mental palette. It's the KNOWING that bothers me so much. KNOWING not only how terrible these books are, not only in subject matter or perspective but in the vein of crappy writing. I've read bad books, and poorly written books but Twilight is glorified Mary Sue championed, wish fulfillment fan fiction. It's literally porn for lonely 30 year old Ann Rice fans and 12 year old girls. I find Twlight's existence distasteful and its mainstream popularity disheartening. In a world where Mark Twain is pulled from library shelves and replaced by Twilight and Harry Potter we're surely digging our own graves. When Steven King who'd never done anything but write some of the best books and movies in the last twenty years decides YOU'RE the person he needs to come out and blast for being a s***ty writer you may as well embrace it and roll in your giant undeserved pile of money to make yourself feel better. Outside of the Harry Potter knock (I really have nothing at all against the Potter books, the stories are pretty good fun), I agree with this whole-heartedly. I realized a bunch of years back how silly it was to just hate on something because it became popular. It just felt pointless, especially since that many things that become popular actually have reasons for becoming so, be it catchy songs, decent dialog in a movie, a fun book to read, etc. But these books/movies really almost offend me, and it REALLY offends me how many young girls I know (I teach elementary school aged kids, mind you) are completely into this thing. The themes of stalking, commandeering boyfriends, helpless females, etc., I absolutely hate my little cousin, for example, receiving these messages. Not to mention the whole "girl meets boy, IMMEDIATELY falls completely in love with him to the point of wanting to die for him"...lovely message, "if a guy is hot and mysterious, THEN YOU ARE MEANT TO BE!" Of course, it would all be much more forgivable if the quality of writing was any good. I attempted to read the first book as a favor to a girl I was seeing awhile back, and almost threw the thing across the room after the first few chapters. I don't want kids, who are still learning how to perfect their reading and writing styles, being subjected to this. Then I learned later how, in the later books, she takes a character who was actually likable, the werewolf kid, and turns him into a dick, because he began to seem like he would be a better boyfriend for her horrifically written female protagonist. GET A LIFE, MARY SUE.And, last but not least, let's not ignore the adults who actually not only enjoy the thing, but LOVE it to near obsession. I've actually asked them "So, you don't mind the image of a helpless/hapless female lead who falls for a borderline-abusive boyfriend and can't live without him, you don't mind the flat-out poor quality of the writing", etc., and many of them actually own up to the writing being poor, the story being awful, the characters being wooden, etc., yet say "be nice, it's to me what Star Wars is to guys." To which I usually say "Yeah, but Star Wars actually carried positive messages of growth and accepting responsibilities, and was steeped in the storytelling traditions as discussed in the works of Joseph Campbell...yet 99% of the world will completely own up to the fact that the prequels were poorly written and sucked ass, and thus not like them." Again, I feel like a jerk for ranting and raving about something popular, but I haven't seen something this popular, with such a TERRIBLE message, and with such flat-out poor quality, come down the road in ages. In a world where girls and women already receive so many mixed messages regarding how they should value themselves as people and approach their own self esteem, this series comes off as one of the last things society needs to be embracing.
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Post by The Charismatic Enabeler on Nov 3, 2009 1:01:25 GMT -5
I heard she's gonna write the same story from another characters perspective. Am I alone in thinking when you do that you're saying "I'm a total hack and only have one story in me"?
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Post by Jedi-El of Tomorrow on Nov 3, 2009 1:15:34 GMT -5
And, last but not least, let's not ignore the adults who actually not only enjoy the thing, but LOVE it to near obsession. I've actually asked them "So, you don't mind the image of a helpless/hapless female lead who falls for a borderline-abusive boyfriend and can't live without him, you don't mind the flat-out poor quality of the writing", etc., and many of them actually own up to the writing being poor, the story being awful, the characters being wooden, etc., yet say "be nice, it's to me what Star Wars is to guys." To which I usually say "Yeah, but Star Wars actually carried positive messages of growth and accepting responsibilities, and was steeped in the storytelling traditions as discussed in the works of Joseph Campbell...yet 99% of the world will completely own up to the fact that the prequels were poorly written and sucked ass, and thus not like them." What Star Wars is to guys? I guess they just ignore the massive cultural impact Star Wars had on everyone. It's the biggest movie franchise of all time, Star Wars was for everyone. How the hell can someone compare Twilight to Star Wars? Also ignore that Star Wars was huge for both genders? Like you said Star Wars carried positive messages of growth and accepting responsibility. It also carried the message that someone can be redeemed. Star Wars is still popular over 30 years after the first movie was released. Twilight hasn't even been around for a decade. Star Wars has engaging interesting characters, Luke, Darth Vader, Han, Chewie, Yoda, Leia, Obi-Wan, R2 and 3PO. Twilight not so much. Star Wars has a legit kick ass female in Leia. It's ridiculous for those people to compare Twilight to something that had the huge impact Star Wars has. And to ignore the fact that Star Wars is loved by both genders and all generations.
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Post by The Charismatic Enabeler on Nov 3, 2009 1:18:43 GMT -5
LOL at emo vampires being compared to Star Wars. Star Wars is part of life. Twilight is a fad that will be hanging with Beanie Babies and the Macerana any minute now.
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Grendel
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
But ... why is all the rum gone?
Posts: 17,593
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Post by Grendel on Nov 3, 2009 1:19:32 GMT -5
I saw the trailer for this the other day; I'm no Twilight hater, but the wolf CGI made me crack up, that was really quite bad. When I went to see Transformers: Revenge of the Fallen, I was in a theatre with a few people for the noon show on Friday. The second trailer they showed was for New Moon (the first one was Gamer), and when I saw that wolf transformation backflip thingy, I wasn't the only one who was laughing, but I was probably the only one who was laughing who had just snorted Pepsi through his nose.
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