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Post by dlg3000 on Feb 13, 2012 11:45:54 GMT -5
CM Punk says that he is the "Best in the World". But which wrestlers, past or present, do you believe is or was truly the best in the world and why?
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Post by Chardee MacDennis on Feb 13, 2012 11:48:16 GMT -5
Flair had a very long run as Best in the World.
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metylerca
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Post by metylerca on Feb 13, 2012 12:37:14 GMT -5
From a straight-up wrestling standpoint? Either Nigel(well not anymore.), Bryan Danielson, Chris Jericho, El Generico, and CM Punk all have very good arguments.
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Post by moneyman20 on Feb 13, 2012 12:39:18 GMT -5
Ric Flair.
Matches, feuds, promos, wrestling ability, drawing power, staying power. What more do you need?
Then again, you could put Randy Savage in there for the exact same reasons.
It's between those two for me.
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Post by Gopher Mod on Feb 13, 2012 12:42:53 GMT -5
Flair had a very long run as Best in the World. I would say from 1981 to 1993 at least. From there, though, I don't know exactly who would've held the moniker.
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Post by mjolnir on Feb 13, 2012 14:05:35 GMT -5
The problem with a heel using the gimmick of claiming to be the Best in the World is...alot of the times the fans foolishly buy into it these days.
Example, Bryan Danielson.
In ROH Bryan won the ROH title and what alot of revisionists like to pretend never happened was there was a big backlash against his winning the belt. Alot of fans moaned and groaned as while Bryan was a good wrestler, one of the better ones ROH had at the time, his mic work up until then had been less than stellar. Also his in-ring personality hadn't even started to show through and he had been in the business for a number of years.
So what does booking/Bryan do?
Bryan starts coming out proclaiming, arrogantly, he's the best in the world. He's better than everyone in ROH at the time, and that had been in ROH. This was meant to get him heat. It was meant for the fans to be pissed this vanilla wrestler was professing himself the best after having just won the world title.
What happens?
Of course the ROHbots buy into it and start believing he is and cheering him for it!
Same basic concept happened with Nigel. Nigel was a heel, he was bashed for his still developing ring abilities and the fans had bought into Bryan as the Best in the World. So what does Nigel do to get heat? He starts professing himself as the Best in the World....then people bought into it too.
To show you a stark contrast to this, Ric Flair used to proclaim he was the best in the world. While he had his fans, even in the days of strict kayfabe, it worked as a heat magnet. Here was this guy who, by the booking, came across as a guy that had okay skills and stole every victory he got. He got by the skin of his teeth and because he had some tough bruiser buddies in Ole and Arn. People were livid when he'd say he was better than Harley, Windham, Steamboat, Sting and so on.
Anyways, who do I think was the actual best in the world?
That's a tough choice and my answer could change on a dime, depending on my mood but Randy Savage is an easy contender for this title.
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Post by Bone Daddy on Feb 13, 2012 14:09:22 GMT -5
Since wrestling is "supposed to be real" No one can argue with the win lose record of a guy like Goldberg or The Undertaker
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Post by YAKMAN is ICHIBAN on Feb 13, 2012 14:24:33 GMT -5
Shawn Michaels was definitely on top of the world for a good portion of his career, especially in his second run.
Kawada, Misawa, Kobashi, Mutoh, all easily up there.
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Post by mcmahonfan85 on Feb 13, 2012 22:02:39 GMT -5
The problem with a heel using the gimmick of claiming to be the Best in the World is...alot of the times the fans foolishly buy into it these days. Example, Bryan Danielson. In ROH Bryan won the ROH title and what alot of revisionists like to pretend never happened was there was a big backlash against his winning the belt. Alot of fans moaned and groaned as while Bryan was a good wrestler, one of the better ones ROH had at the time, his mic work up until then had been less than stellar. Also his in-ring personality hadn't even started to show through and he had been in the business for a number of years. So what does booking/Bryan do? Bryan starts coming out proclaiming, arrogantly, he's the best in the world. He's better than everyone in ROH at the time, and that had been in ROH. This was meant to get him heat. It was meant for the fans to be pissed this vanilla wrestler was professing himself the best after having just won the world title. What happens? Of course the ROHbots buy into it and start believing he is and cheering him for it! well its hard not to believe when the guy proclaiming he's goes out and backs it up in the ring, proving he's the best in the company. and if a guy is the top wrestler in your promotion of choice, are you not going to support him (or her)? not that many people bought it. pretty much every saw it for what it was: Nigel stealing Danielson's gimmick as a way to egg him on. the whole feud in 2008 was basically a rehash of the Danielson/Joe feud from 2006, with Danielson taking the Joe roll (former champ trying to reclaim the title and prove he's the best) and Nigel taking the Danielson roll (current champ trying to weasel out of defending the title against him because he's afraid he'll loose). also in the 2006 Joe/Danielson feud, much like Nigel stole "I have until five!" in 2008, Danielson on a few occasions did the Ole Kick.
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Post by ZackRayne on Feb 14, 2012 1:13:59 GMT -5
KENTA and Austin Aries hands down currently. EVER? Randy Savage, Chris Benoit?
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Post by dabossftw on Feb 14, 2012 2:55:57 GMT -5
I think at one point, somewhere between 1990 and 1993, The Great Muta was the best in the world. Completely my opinion, of course, but I'm sure I'm not the only person who shares the thought.
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Bub (BLM)
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Post by Bub (BLM) on Feb 14, 2012 3:48:18 GMT -5
Dusty Rhodes. The guy could put on amazing matches and cut some absolutely captivating promos.
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Post by flatsdomino on Feb 14, 2012 4:11:53 GMT -5
Before Flair, it was Harley Race. No question in my mind. But from 1981 to 1993, that title belonged to Ric Flair (with Savage as a close second)
Flair was never really THE guy after '93. It was pretty clear his prime was over, and I'd say Shawn Michaels took over that role - but Bret, Muta, Kobashi, Liger and Misawa are all arguable to be the ones who inherited the title.
Fittingly with the style those guys pioneered in the early-mid '90's, Benoit, Jericho, Malenko, Mysterio and Guerrero all had a run in the later part of the 90's and 2000. I know I'm using the "workrate" guys here and not the guys who "drew" (like Flair, Savage, HBK and Bret), but overall the late 90's weren't really much about the in-ring action anyway. The focus was on the antics and the storylines until about 2000, when the WWF got VERY focused on in-rin action; in large part thanks to the aqquisition of those guys and Kurt Angle. But while all the attention was on Hogan, Rodman and the NWO or Austin v. McMahon, those guys were breaking new, exciting ground and delivering the match of the night in spades. Benoit and Booker's best of 5 series is an example, and Eddie v. Rey at Halloween Havoc (on the short list of greatest WCW matches ever, for me) is another
In 2001, though, Stone Cold was unquestionably, for me, the total package. No doubt. Unfortunately his injuries and issues ended the best run of his career in '02. After that I'd say it was between Benoit and Jericho, who were on top of their game.
Since then, HBK on his second run, Danielson, Joe, Jericho on HIS second run, and Punk have been the guys who were the best at some point. Punk, right now, is in the rare position of being the best, most skilled in-ring performer, and being booked at the top. Which is awesome.
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Post by Cam on Feb 14, 2012 4:27:48 GMT -5
For me, to be the best in the world you have to have the complete package.
HBK, Flair, Jericho and Kurt Angle are four that immediately spring to mind as having everything.
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Post by flatsdomino on Feb 14, 2012 4:56:14 GMT -5
For me, to be the best in the world you have to have the complete package. HBK, Flair, Jericho and Kurt Angle are four that immediately spring to mind as having everything. Kurt Angle, you're so right. I'm gonna chalk up leaving him out to it being 3 in the morning here. I agree with this list, but I'd add Harley Race, Savage, Benoit, Guerrero, and Austin.
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Post by crabnebula on Feb 14, 2012 5:36:19 GMT -5
Flair and HBK were showmen who were given the spotlight or made sure they had it, so I don't know if they can count. that's just personal opinion.
Bruno was extremely dominant, and loved. was he the best ever, though
Race was a pure badass and there wasn't one like him at that level until Austin came around Dusty played his cards right, always, and had the power to push himself...
Hogan you can't even count. The best? no. the biggest, probably
Savage was like Flair or Michaels, just without any support from the front office or the mindset to scheme
The Rock was the best at getting hit by a lightning bolt of character transformation, but he came around at the very right moment and got swept up like a fad. A fad that is still fondly remembered making him considered by our generation as a contender for the best title, but he left the sport so quickly that there's a lot of unanswered questions about his staying power. as hard to believe as that sounds
Hart had the pedigree and the talent, but something always missing in him. Benoit had a powerful quality, but struggled with all kinds of hurdles before ultimately burning out
Angle was the best athlete and a modern throwback to the great wrestlers of the past. talking about Gotch and Lewis, etc but if you factor in the more showman element of the modern era, I'd say his hokey antics and being too much of the comedy decade in wrestling prevents him from taking the title. Feuds with Brock and others can be argued to make up for that, but if he'd been in a more believable era or "sport" oriented promotion or time period he could have won over a lot more fans as the best ever. Instead people remember the milk truck type stuff and the goofy mug of his getting mocked by other superstars. Austin suffers from this too, but only on the back end of his ascension. Austin was a badass best in the world on the way up. Angle had to crawl to it after many embarrassments. You could say that makes him more of a best, since he had to go through that. Only people still mock Angle and laugh at him in TNA after all his great matches and performances and serious turns in character in both WWF/E and TNA.
Punk is really good. Jericho has had a great career. but you can't just label yourself the best in the world or the best ever. You can get people to buy it, no doubt. The best catchphrase of all time was Flair's "To beat the man".... yet singing your own praises does not make historical fact. a lot of people will say I'm wrong on all three men
maybe the best ever was Eddie... he just might get my vote. nudging out Race and Austin. He had the drive and the fire and only was hampered by politics and bad booking and prejudice in both WCW and WWF/E (oh, and obviously the tragic end to his career and life leaves this as not so easy to claim straight out. that he was THE best)
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Post by BatPunk on Feb 14, 2012 6:06:12 GMT -5
Currently, I believe it's Punk and Bryan. They both tell stories in the ring better than everyone else. Their mic work is really unmatched at this point. They really bring the audience into their stories and rarely do they disappoint. Also add Shingo from Dragon Gate. I cant remember a match where I haven't thoroughly enjoyed. I dont understand Japanese, so I dont know about his mic work, but his matches are fantastic to watch and if he's not considered one of the best, he soon will be. All time - Savage, HBK, Eddie Guerrero, Angle, Flair. All just brilliant. At one point I would have said Samoa Joe, but TNA has kind of ruined his legacy
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Post by The Sam on Feb 14, 2012 8:00:03 GMT -5
60's - Ray Stevens 70's - Nick Bockwinkel 80's - Ric Flair 90's - Shawn Michaels 00's - Chris Jericho
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Post by austinariesfan88 on Feb 14, 2012 10:29:59 GMT -5
Austin Aries imo. The guy is the total package he can mat wrestler, fly, strike, had great mic skills and charisma. He has been great in both his roles as an intense serious face and as the cocky, smarmy heel. During ROH he was having great matches with every guy he stepped in the ring with either as a singles competitor or as a tag team. He knows how to tell a story in a match and make a star out oh his opponent (Tyler Black). In 2012 I think he is the best in the world.
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Post by Krimzon on Feb 14, 2012 10:34:59 GMT -5
"Hardwork" Bobby Walker.
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