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Post by Koda, Master Crunchyroller on Jun 18, 2012 20:00:40 GMT -5
Agreed, I think even as a female game developer, I would want to create characters that I can relate more to. For some women part of that is being sexy, but it probably won't be as over the top as some of the characters out there. Not my cup of tea, I'm more of the "not here to be hot, but here to crush your skull" kind of character, but that's my choice for my creations. I'm on my way to be a game developer(All right,start the college!) and i will be sure to chekc the girls here about female character because i have a game in mind for one.And the ones here looks really clever!*cheap pop* so feedback would be good. One thing i think about going too far is for example..DoA goes TOO FAR for sexualization(for god sake they spend more time on breasts mechanics than game mechanics) Nah, not with DoA. With the DoA volleyball games, though? Yeah those games spent too much time on boobs than gameplay. But the DoA fighting games? Honestly some of the best gameplay in a fighting game series period, imo. Fast, hard hitting, and it is the only fighting game franchise where the stage actually matters, beyond having the threat of a ring out like some stages in other series have.
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Post by Koda, Master Crunchyroller on Jun 18, 2012 20:02:05 GMT -5
One that i'm looking VERY forward to see how things turn out,is the protagonist of ACIII Liberations. She is a ladie,she kicks ass,she wasnt sexualized so far,if there is a character that can fight the "sexism" of videogames is her. And then you realize they stuck her on a handheld that isn't exactly flying off shelves right now. It is as if they are pre-building the game with a scapegoat reason for if it fails financially. "Oh, well it was because it had a female protagonist, that's why."
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malys
AC Slater
Avenging my fallen brethren...
Posts: 169
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Post by malys on Jun 18, 2012 20:03:26 GMT -5
I'll be honest, I'm working on a game right now, with a female protagonist, and she really is a bit average "one of us" in looks, as I envision her. You are working on a gfame?I hope you dont mind if in the future (or even right now)i could ask tips on how to work,etc from you? It's like a dream to me,and help would be appreciated,i had no idea this forum had another one in the game industry ;D ..alright,i'm still not in the game industyr,but SOON...soon. Absolutely, no problem. I'm developing independently though, I have a regular 9 to 5 that is not in game development, and I'm working on my first game. I'm setting up a game development website, so if you want PM me or something and I'll let you know when it's up, and where you can contact me.
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Dub H
Crow T. Robot
Captain Pixel: the Game Master
I ❤ Aniki
Posts: 47,955
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Post by Dub H on Jun 18, 2012 20:04:00 GMT -5
One that i'm looking VERY forward to see how things turn out,is the protagonist of ACIII Liberations. She is a ladie,she kicks ass,she wasnt sexualized so far,if there is a character that can fight the "sexism" of videogames is her. And then you realize they stuck her on a handheld that isn't exactly flying off shelves right now. It is as if they are pre-building the game with a scapegoat reason for if it fails financially. "Oh, well it was because it had a female protagonist, that's why." Danm dont even kid about it it looks they are making so perfectly,i dont want anything to screw it up.
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Post by Koda, Master Crunchyroller on Jun 18, 2012 20:07:50 GMT -5
Pretty much. Though to be fair, Tifa was probably a bad example, because she was only sexualized so we could actually tell she was a chick because of how badly defined the character models for FFVII were. That's the sole reason why they made her knockers so big. That doesn't really add up. Aerith and Yuffie and Elena and Scarlet and so on were fine. I think she had big boobs because they wanted her to have big boobs. They aren't even that big, really, outside of the CG. Her regular combat model and her official art makes her look like a realistically busty woman. Which is fine! Some women have big boobs! And in the case of FF7, the women have a variety of body types. Tifa is absolutely a sexualized character. She is clearly meant to be "hot". Long flowing hair, miniskirt, tight white top, tiny waist. But that's okay. She is not defined by her body. The game doesn't relentlessly objectify her. She is a strong and developed character who happens to have sex appeal. That's absolutely fine. Though whoever is responsible for that ridiculous CG scene of her when the Weapons arise deserves a slap. To be fair, Aerith was clearly a woman from her long dress and Yuffie was the requisite, "Young, cute, small chested female cast member".
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erisi236
Fry's dog Seymour
... enjoys the rich, smooth taste of Camels.
Not good! Not good! Not good!
Posts: 21,904
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Post by erisi236 on Jun 18, 2012 20:13:25 GMT -5
Tifa seems like she got "flanderized", like they made her look different just based on the limitations of the time. and then they just rolled with it and went overboard as they thought that the one thing that stood out was the only thing that stood out.
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Post by Michael Coello on Jun 18, 2012 20:15:00 GMT -5
How is this spot on!? It's clearly incredibly biased. Whatever. Misogyny might be wrong but so is misandry which that article is full of. It's complete and utter garbage written by someone trying to make others feel bad about themselves for being who they are. Mainstream journalism is awful and this is just another reason why. Misandry runs wild in the mainstream. Are you serious? Oh my god. You are. You're really serious. This would be adorable if it wasn't so pathetic. You actually believe that asking for female equality means that they hate men? You believe that discrimination against men is more serious and widespread than that against women? What planet are you living on? Just... Wow. It's an article that says that men don't want this issue of sexism removed cause they feel threatened and actually compared these offensive games to goat porn. How is it wrong to call that wrong? And as for the money being based on "research", besides Google there's the various other professional advanced search engines that are available to anyone for this. Plus, in the digital age, physical media isn't needed. Hell, if she really wanted to get money for it, put it on Blip.
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Post by Cyno on Jun 18, 2012 20:15:19 GMT -5
I think the real damning thing against Tifa's bewbs are FFVII's CGI cutscenes. They were ridiculous there.
Amazingly, I think they were more "normal" in Advent Children and subsequent FF7 spinoffs.
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Dub H
Crow T. Robot
Captain Pixel: the Game Master
I ❤ Aniki
Posts: 47,955
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Post by Dub H on Jun 18, 2012 20:15:42 GMT -5
You are working on a gfame?I hope you dont mind if in the future (or even right now)i could ask tips on how to work,etc from you? It's like a dream to me,and help would be appreciated,i had no idea this forum had another one in the game industry ;D ..alright,i'm still not in the game industyr,but SOON...soon. Absolutely, no problem. I'm developing independently though, I have a regular 9 to 5 that is not in game development, and I'm working on my first game. I'm setting up a game development website, so if you want PM me or something and I'll let you know when it's up, and where you can contact me. Alright thanks!Sent a PM about that,since i dont want to go off-topic Also,at first,Tifa was barely fanservice,she was a big block with two point stuf in the chest,so back then,yeh,not really that issue.But modern say,like the picture he posted,i could see it.
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Post by lockedontarget on Jun 18, 2012 20:23:33 GMT -5
Are you serious? Oh my god. You are. You're really serious. This would be adorable if it wasn't so pathetic. You actually believe that asking for female equality means that they hate men? You believe that discrimination against men is more serious and widespread than that against women? What planet are you living on? Just... Wow. It's an article that says that men don't want this issue of sexism removed cause they feel threatened and actually compared these offensive games to goat porn. How is it wrong to call that wrong? And as for the money being based on "research", besides Google there's the various other professional advanced search engines that are available to anyone for this. Plus, in the digital age, physical media isn't needed. Hell, if she really wanted to get money for it, put it on Blip. I think you are confusing statements about a certain group of men as statements about men in general. He is bashing the misogynist idiots that are telling someone she should get raped for daring to make a study about sexism in video games. Are you seriously bitching because someone is using kickstarter to fund a series of documentaries? These things cost money, and there is nothing wrong with putting your idea out there and seeing if people want to help finance it. She has not demanded anything, and her actual goal was reasonable and realistic. You're kind of being a silly goose about this.
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FinalGwen
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Particularly fond of muffins.
Posts: 16,456
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Post by FinalGwen on Jun 18, 2012 20:30:03 GMT -5
Are you serious? Oh my god. You are. You're really serious. This would be adorable if it wasn't so pathetic. You actually believe that asking for female equality means that they hate men? You believe that discrimination against men is more serious and widespread than that against women? What planet are you living on? Just... Wow. It's an article that says that men don't want this issue of sexism removed cause they feel threatened and actually compared these offensive games to goat porn. How is it wrong to call that wrong? Brooker is saying how at the slightest mention that there is something sexist about the games industry (which there is), gamers get incredibly defensive and pretend nothing's wrong, and that people are just trying to make them feel bad for some reason. So that poster immediately said that Brooker (and the media at large) are biased against men, and they should shut up and stop trying to make them 'feel bad'. Do you not see, that's EXACTLY what Brooker was talking about! We can't call it wrong, because we've managed to get an example of it in this very thread! And anyone who seriously talks about Misandry being a societal problem has some real problems.
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Post by lockedontarget on Jun 18, 2012 20:33:03 GMT -5
Well it's not like misandry doesn't exist.
But to suggest it is even close to as big a problem in our culture as misogyny is insane.
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Post by Red Impact on Jun 18, 2012 20:36:01 GMT -5
There are a few female characters that got to avoid the overt sexualization. Jade from Beyond Good and Evil comes to mind. Of course, there is one character that really smashes that stereotype {Spoiler} Not only a woman, but also murders pigeons.
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Post by Cyno on Jun 18, 2012 21:00:18 GMT -5
Shale <3
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Post by Michael Coello on Jun 18, 2012 21:11:05 GMT -5
It's an article that says that men don't want this issue of sexism removed cause they feel threatened and actually compared these offensive games to goat porn. How is it wrong to call that wrong? And as for the money being based on "research", besides Google there's the various other professional advanced search engines that are available to anyone for this. Plus, in the digital age, physical media isn't needed. Hell, if she really wanted to get money for it, put it on Blip. I think you are confusing statements about a certain group of men as statements about men in general. He is bashing the misogynist idiots that are telling someone she should get raped for daring to make a study about sexism in video games. Are you seriously bitching because someone is using kickstarter to fund a series of documentaries? These things cost money, and there is nothing wrong with putting your idea out there and seeing if people want to help finance it. She has not demanded anything, and her actual goal was reasonable and realistic. You're kind of being a silly goose about this. Documentaries may cost money, but not for the ones she's trying to do. It's basically just to point out tropes and ideas from games through the years. There are no simulations, no reenactments, no costly research or anything. People could do this from their computer with a 20 buck AA battery digital camera. People have also done stuff like this, Extra Credits for one, and the monetary basis was over the talent used having personal issues, not using them, which she already has accounted for from her own video. Others have, too, with less attention and not asking for the price of a used car for doing it. It's not silly to ask the details over something like this, because even if it's not a lot of money, it's a lot considering she doesn't even need a dime of it if she had any kind of business savvy at all. Plus, she's not getting her original sum anyway. She's got way more than she needs due to the controversy, for something that didn't even need her "modest sum" in the first place! This is just a waste of resources, and calling it for what it is does not constitute misogyny on my part. If it was a dude doing the same thing over male tropes, it'd be the same problem. He's asking for money he doesn't need. Worst of all, I can't even complain about it cause then I'm being sexist. Game developers get short changed over a hundred bucks for campaigns cause "they can raise that much", but this person gets money for an internet video (let's not kid ourselves, that's all it is), the whole thing is just asinine. If you want to do the video, do it! She wanted to get paid for it, use Blip or any site like it.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Jun 18, 2012 21:30:37 GMT -5
It's an article that says that men don't want this issue of sexism removed cause they feel threatened and actually compared these offensive games to goat porn. How is it wrong to call that wrong? Brooker is saying how at the slightest mention that there is something sexist about the games industry (which there is), gamers get incredibly defensive and pretend nothing's wrong, and that people are just trying to make them feel bad for some reason. So that poster immediately said that Brooker (and the media at large) are biased against men, and they should shut up and stop trying to make them 'feel bad'. Do you not see, that's EXACTLY what Brooker was talking about! We can't call it wrong, because we've managed to get an example of it in this very thread! And anyone who seriously talks about Misandry being a societal problem has some real problems.Because it isn't? That's just ignorant.
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Post by lockedontarget on Jun 18, 2012 21:50:33 GMT -5
I think you are confusing statements about a certain group of men as statements about men in general. He is bashing the misogynist idiots that are telling someone she should get raped for daring to make a study about sexism in video games. Are you seriously bitching because someone is using kickstarter to fund a series of documentaries? These things cost money, and there is nothing wrong with putting your idea out there and seeing if people want to help finance it. She has not demanded anything, and her actual goal was reasonable and realistic. You're kind of being a silly goose about this. Documentaries may cost money, but not for the ones she's trying to do. It's basically just to point out tropes and ideas from games through the years. There are no simulations, no reenactments, no costly research or anything. People could do this from their computer with a 20 buck AA battery digital camera. People have also done stuff like this, Extra Credits for one, and the monetary basis was over the talent used having personal issues, not using them, which she already has accounted for from her own video. Others have, too, with less attention and not asking for the price of a used car for doing it. It's not silly to ask the details over something like this, because even if it's not a lot of money, it's a lot considering she doesn't even need a dime of it if she had any kind of business savvy at all. Plus, she's not getting her original sum anyway. She's got way more than she needs due to the controversy, for something that didn't even need her "modest sum" in the first place! This is just a waste of resources, and calling it for what it is does not constitute misogyny on my part. If it was a dude doing the same thing over male tropes, it'd be the same problem. He's asking for money he doesn't need. Worst of all, I can't even complain about it cause then I'm being sexist. Game developers get short changed over a hundred bucks for campaigns cause "they can raise that much", but this person gets money for an internet video (let's not kid ourselves, that's all it is), the whole thing is just asinine. If you want to do the video, do it! She wanted to get paid for it, use Blip or any site like it. You do realize that the series itself will probably require a bunch of money spent on video games alone, right? If the intention is to actually study the medium herself, and likely capture video from them, and so on. And just because some people can throw together a cheap internet video does not mean a different video series can't have costs. Are you honestly suggesting that documentaries can't cost money to produce? On top of that, she's doing a DVD print run, as well. That costs money. There's a reason why ROH doesn't have all of their shows in stock. Oh yeah, I guess it's not just an Internet video after all. For someone who has no actual knowledge of the exact budget needed for the production she wants to do, you sure are quick to assign a cost to it. A few grand is not unrealistic for a documentary if it is going to attempt to be professional. And she is getting more money because people are willing to pay her. That's how kickstarter works. Clearly there is demand for what she is producing. You are awfully hostile towards someone for daring to try and get funding for a personal project. You don't care about it, then don't donate! But to go and bitch about it because other people like what she is about and want to see this funded and are speaking with their wallets and cry "wasting resources" is just silly as hell. It doesn't make you sexist, but you really don't have a valid reason to be outraged about this at all.
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Post by Cyno on Jun 18, 2012 21:50:46 GMT -5
Misandry exists, but more often than not it's a copout word used by misogynists whenever someone challenges their views. It's also not nearly as widespread or ingrained concept as misogyny. Not even close.
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FinalGwen
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Particularly fond of muffins.
Posts: 16,456
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Post by FinalGwen on Jun 18, 2012 21:52:29 GMT -5
Pray tell, then, what devastating effects has misandry caused to society at large? Are men struggling to attain equal rights to women around the world? Are men systematically paid less than women? Are most companies controlled by women, with men unable to get a look in? Somehow, I doubt you can point to anything significant.
Who knows, there might be a few individual cases of people calling themselves misandrist being nasty to someone, but it is NOT a societal problem on the level of misogyny.
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Post by lockedontarget on Jun 18, 2012 21:55:53 GMT -5
Yeah but you said it wasn't a societal problem in general. It is. Not nearly on the level as misogyny, but it's still a problem. Though generally in completely different ways.
Just like how there is racism against white people. It is not nearly as serious a problem as racism against minorities, but it exists.
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