FinalGwen
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Particularly fond of muffins.
Posts: 16,536
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Post by FinalGwen on Aug 19, 2013 2:57:10 GMT -5
2010. Nexus VS Cena is the hottest thing going. Randy Orton randomly wins the title despite not being interesting for a long time, and proceeds to do nothing with it other than fill time. 2013. Bryan VS Cena is the hottest thing going. Randy Orton randomly wins the title despite not being interesting for a long time, and... Well, let's see if history repeats itself.
Everyone ready for some ponderous heel promos?
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Post by botchingitup on Aug 19, 2013 2:57:23 GMT -5
2011 is why. Everything I'm reading about Daniel Bryan in this thread was being said about CM Punk. "Oh man, this is gonna be great, he's white hot right now and they're really going to 'make him' by putting him over Triple H AND Kevin Nash!" Of course, the result of that was that the short-order cook jobbed to Triple H, and then never even got to face Nash! A complete waste that undoubtedly slowed Punk's momentum Thing is, Punk was supposed to beat Nash when the feud was starting up. Nash ended up getting tied up and out of it because he's Nash. From there, they'd already built the conflict between Punk and Trips so poorly and with so much vitriol in his direction in the story that Punk winning would've looked pretty bad, almost heelish. Instead they opted for a weird-ass finish with a ton of run-ins and it was not a clean victory at all for Trips at all. By the same logic, Bryan never was going to pin Cena clean because Punk didn't get to - but he just did ultimately. History repeats itself a lot, no question, and I'm not saying this angle is emphatically going to be good. But tonight the way they played everything makes me think it may not be completely hopeless.
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Post by HollywoodArmbar on Aug 19, 2013 3:03:16 GMT -5
I'll wait and see.
If it leads to Bryan feuding with Orton/HHH and eventually overcoming them, fine. If those five minutes are his only sniff of the gold, then what an absolute waste.
I am a bit deflated with the result. Orton bores me, and I'm a huge Bryan fan. But hopefully it's all part of the bigger picture, to borrow a phrase from Wade Barrett.
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Post by rybackrulez on Aug 19, 2013 3:10:37 GMT -5
Bryan chasing corporate viper orton
Fighting against the mcmahon-helmsley facgime
Seems like easy money. Bryan has the rematch clause, but hunter keeps screwing him out of the shot
They just rebooted a hot feud in orton/bryan and hhh evil boss has wheels
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Totorob101
Hank Scorpio
Glob Glob Glob
Posts: 5,818
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Post by Totorob101 on Aug 19, 2013 3:17:42 GMT -5
Honestly i think thats it for Bryan at the main even level. Itll be Cena, Orton, Hunter for months on end, probably with Cena getting the title back and then defending it against hunter at Mania. There is no space for Bryan and i really do think its because Bryan does not have the look that they want. Iv lost faith pretty much with the company. Ill stil watch but i wont have faith they will give other guys a chance other then the usual names when it comes to the WWE title.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Aug 19, 2013 3:26:19 GMT -5
So, something I'm wondering here... What happens if Orton gets strike three? Do they vacate the title or go with an immediate title switch on Raw, or what? Immediate instinct would be a title switch to keep some narrative structure to it but, y'know, might be kind of hard to get a guy to go along with something and put up his all if he knows he's getting fired immediately after it's finished. I mean, he'd probably get rehired immediately after the required year wait'd done with anyway but still.
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Post by CATCH_US IS the Conversation on Aug 19, 2013 3:29:18 GMT -5
So, something I'm wondering here... What happens if Orton gets strike three? Do they vacate the title or go with an immediate title switch on Raw, or what? Immediate instinct would be a title switch to keep some narrative structure to it but, y'know, might be kind of hard to get a guy to go along with something and put up his all if he knows he's getting fired immediately after it's finished. I mean, he'd probably get rehired immediately after the required year wait'd done with anyway but still. Well they can put the belt on someone who's like HHH but much younger. A certain Chosen One, perhaps?
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FinalGwen
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Particularly fond of muffins.
Posts: 16,536
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Post by FinalGwen on Aug 19, 2013 3:37:34 GMT -5
So, something I'm wondering here... What happens if Orton gets strike three? Do they vacate the title or go with an immediate title switch on Raw, or what? Immediate instinct would be a title switch to keep some narrative structure to it but, y'know, might be kind of hard to get a guy to go along with something and put up his all if he knows he's getting fired immediately after it's finished. I mean, he'd probably get rehired immediately after the required year wait'd done with anyway but still. Well they can put the belt on someone who's like HHH but much younger. A certain Chosen One, perhaps? Yes please. The matches would be a lot better, too.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Aug 19, 2013 3:39:45 GMT -5
Bryan chasing corporate viper orton Fighting against the mcmahon-helmsley facgime Seems like easy money. Bryan has the rematch clause, but hunter keeps screwing him out of the shot They just rebooted a hot feud in orton/bryan and hhh evil boss has wheels Yes. IF they do this, I'll be throwing money at the TV.
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Post by celticjobber on Aug 19, 2013 3:58:09 GMT -5
The ending was way too predictable, but atleast it makes sense.
I'm glad they didn't change it to swerve everyone who figured out Trips was turning heel and aligning with Orton.
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BigBadZ
Grimlock
The Rumors Are All True
Posts: 13,923
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Post by BigBadZ on Aug 19, 2013 4:08:28 GMT -5
So, something I'm wondering here... What happens if Orton gets strike three? Do they vacate the title or go with an immediate title switch on Raw, or what? Immediate instinct would be a title switch to keep some narrative structure to it but, y'know, might be kind of hard to get a guy to go along with something and put up his all if he knows he's getting fired immediately after it's finished. I mean, he'd probably get rehired immediately after the required year wait'd done with anyway but still. Well they can put the belt on someone who's like HHH but much younger. A certain Chosen One, perhaps? '99 DX Triple H?
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Futureraven: Beelzebruv
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
The Ultimate Arbiter of Right And Wrong
Spent half my life here, God help me
Posts: 15,461
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Post by Futureraven: Beelzebruv on Aug 19, 2013 4:49:48 GMT -5
Honestly i think thats it for Bryan at the main even level. Itll be Cena, Orton, Hunter for months on end, probably with Cena getting the title back and then defending it against hunter at Mania. There is no space for Bryan and i really do think its because Bryan does not have the look that they want. Iv lost faith pretty much with the company. Ill stil watch but i wont have faith they will give other guys a chance other then the usual names when it comes to the WWE title. Hasn't that been the whole point of the angle? That he doesn't have the corporate look, so management are trying to thwart him while the people and Cena get behind him? They did a similar one with Punk that, while it didn't go as well as it could have, established him as a top guy. Years ago they did the same with Benoit, another workhorse noone EVER thought they'd give the belt to, they did. But Bryan has the advantages of far more charisma, and an actual storyline to go into in the main event, rather than 'He has the belt, now what?'. Just to address another point people have been making, about wasting the first reign. Not everyone needs that moment. HHH himself, he was established by his 3rd reign Flair needed a couple of reigns to be cemented. Bret Hart meandered through his first, his second was far better. The Rock's big babyface moment was Backlash 2000, almost a year and a half after his first title reign where the people were screwed out of what they wanted, he turned heel and made people wait for him to be a face, that worked pretty well.
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Post by Larryhausen on Aug 19, 2013 5:04:46 GMT -5
Honestly i think thats it for Bryan at the main even level. Itll be Cena, Orton, Hunter for months on end, probably with Cena getting the title back and then defending it against hunter at Mania. There is no space for Bryan and i really do think its because Bryan does not have the look that they want. Iv lost faith pretty much with the company. Ill stil watch but i wont have faith they will give other guys a chance other then the usual names when it comes to the WWE title. Hasn't that been the whole point of the angle? That he doesn't have the corporate look, so management are trying to thwart him while the people and Cena get behind him? They did a similar one with Punk that, while it didn't go as well as it could have, established him as a top guy. Years ago they did the same with Benoit, another workhorse noone EVER thought they'd give the belt to, they did. But Bryan has the advantages of far more charisma, and an actual storyline to go into in the main event, rather than 'He has the belt, now what?'. Just to address another point people have been making, about wasting the first reign. Not everyone needs that moment. HHH himself, he was established by his 3rd reign Flair needed a couple of reigns to be cemented. Bret Hart meandered through his first, his second was far better. The Rock's big babyface moment was Backlash 2000, almost a year and a half after his first title reign where the people were screwed out of what they wanted, he turned heel and made people wait for him to be a face, that worked pretty well. All good points, but TRIPLE H BAD!!!!!!! I'm sorry, I'm not one to harp on other people's opinions, but seriously, some people act like Trips pedigreed their mothers. This angle JUST started tonight. And given how solid the booking has been lately, I don't think it's going to end badly for Bryan. Especially since two of Hunter's best friends are big supporters of his. And, if you look at it, Bryan's entire WWE career up to this point makes absolute sense. All in all, the match and the aftermath were 100% perfect.
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Chip
Hank Scorpio
Slam Jam Death.
Posts: 5,185
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Post by Chip on Aug 19, 2013 5:05:32 GMT -5
There is no space for Bryan and i really do think its because Bryan does not have the look that they want. Have you not been watching the show the past few months? He was the first guy to beat The Shield, he made Randy Orton tap out AND beat Cena clean for the title in the span of like two months. How this shows you anything other then WWE being completely behind Bryan I'll never know. Even if you discard all of that, Cena is out for surgery for a bit, that leaves Bryan as the top babyface in the entire company. Not even Punk got to be top face.
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Bo Rida
Fry's dog Seymour
Pulled one over on everyone. Got away with it, this time.
Posts: 24,190
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Post by Bo Rida on Aug 19, 2013 5:41:56 GMT -5
I'm not a huge fan of the storyline but I suppose it's fine, in many ways it's booking 101 and like the post above says they clearly have faith in Bryan.
My issue is with Randy Orton winning the title, a guy who has said that he purposely makes matches boring as a heel, that may work with a live crowd (or may stop them buying tickets the next time) but as I've said it a million times before why would I pay to watch that? If you're the kind to put low ratings down to the WWE champion then historically they suggest many others feel the same way.
Then there's the issues of him and HHH sharing long droning promos that go nowhere, I was bored of Punk and Heyman doing the same thing and they're two of the all-time great speakers so I'm dreading what these two will come up with. Maybe that's just an inevitable consequence of three hour Raws.
If only Sheamus wasn't injured, he'd have made an ideal corporate champion and may have even managed to make that type of storyline feel a little more fresh as his turn could be explained by his increasingly negative crowd reactions, he has a more interesting history with Bryan too.
It may all work out in the long-term (although with WWE's track record over the past few years it's hard to have too much faith in them) but that doesn't mean the short-term won't be painful to watch.
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Post by "American Cream" Dusty Loads on Aug 19, 2013 5:44:14 GMT -5
I'm mad as hell, but in the way I'm supposed to be mad. Idk where the story is gonna go but I'm intrigued and I hate HHH and Randy Orton like I'm a little kid who doesn't know wrestling's a work. Also, Bryan pinned Cena clean as a whistle.
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Mochi Lone Wolf
Fry's dog Seymour
Development through Destruction.
Posts: 24,160
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Post by Mochi Lone Wolf on Aug 19, 2013 5:49:43 GMT -5
Bryan pinning Cena clean tells me that he's not going anywhere as far as being a prominent part of the company for a while. That's a major positive if nothing else.
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Post by Jedi-El of Tomorrow on Aug 19, 2013 6:11:16 GMT -5
My guess to where this is going. Tonight Cena gets taken out by The Shield, setting them up as Triple H and Vince's enforcers, they also get Wade to join. The Usos join the fight against Vince and Trips, because there needs to be a tag team against The Shield. Cena returns in time for Survivor Series, and it sets up Orton, The Shield and Trips or Wade vs D-Bry, Cena, The Usos, and The Undertaker (Shield did take him out). That match starts the setup for Cena vs Taker at Mania, D-Bry wins the match for his team, and continues some dissension in the ranks of the Corporation.
I'd say Vince and Triple H get pissed at Reigns and Rollins for losing the tag straps to The Usos, which leads to Reigns spearing the hell out of Wade, and Rollins going after Ambrose. So of course Reigns and Rollins go face.
Mania's set up as D-Bry vs Orton (with D-Bry getting his Mania moment), Cena vs Taker, and Rollins vs Ambrose for the US Title.
Okay, most of that isn't what I see happening, but what I want to happen.
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Post by muzzle on Aug 19, 2013 6:50:34 GMT -5
I'd be fine with Orton putting Cena out tomorrow, so that Cena comes back to feud with Orton over the title and eventually they square off at WrestleMania in the main event for the belt. Meanwhile, We build Bryan along the way and give the fans Bryan/Punk at Mania. Then they're still free to do Brock -v- Taker/Rock at Mania, too. Granted, WrestleMania is 8 months from now and a lot can change, but after tonight, I just can't see Bryan in anything but the WWE title program. What would even prompt Bryan & Punk to wrestle at Mania? "Hey' we're both good workers and the internet likes us a lot. Let's have a five star match because INTERNET." If Bryan's not in the title match, maybe a special grudge match with Triple H or a title-less Orton. As far as Cena/Orton for the belt at Mania - it should've happened YEARS ago. But, at least to me, that ship has sailed.
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Post by muzzle on Aug 19, 2013 6:54:13 GMT -5
2011 is why. Everything I'm reading about Daniel Bryan in this thread was being said about CM Punk. "Oh man, this is gonna be great, he's white hot right now and they're really going to 'make him' by putting him over Triple H AND Kevin Nash!" Of course, the result of that was that the short-order cook jobbed to Triple H, and then never even got to face Nash! A complete waste that undoubtedly slowed Punk's momentum Thing is, Punk was supposed to beat Nash when the feud was starting up. Nash ended up getting tied up and out of it because he's Nash. From there, they'd already built the conflict between Punk and Trips so poorly and with so much vitriol in his direction in the story that Punk winning would've looked pretty bad, almost heelish. Instead they opted for a weird-ass finish with a ton of run-ins and it was not a clean victory at all for Trips at all. By the same logic, Bryan never was going to pin Cena clean because Punk didn't get to - but he just did ultimately. History repeats itself a lot, no question, and I'm not saying this angle is emphatically going to be good. But tonight the way they played everything makes me think it may not be completely hopeless. Enough with this "Punk wasnt buried" burried bollocks. Yes he didn't get buried, but you know what did? THE WHOLE EFFING ANGLE. The whole momentum of Punk. f*** Triple H.
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