percymania
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Percymania will live forever! Oh yeah!
Posts: 17,296
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Post by percymania on Sept 2, 2013 23:41:22 GMT -5
Will FAN push me if I come out too?
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Post by CATCH_US IS the Conversation on Sept 2, 2013 23:43:33 GMT -5
Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't Darren Young's strong showing against CM Punk predate his coming out? They had been slowly building all summer. Plus, it's not like the fan turn has really changed their personalities at all. They're hitting all the same idiosyncrasies we've come to love, they're just facing heels now. Isn't that what we've been wanting from our logical fan-dictated heel-faces turns for a while now? It did. But that's because you can't just have Punk squashing midcarders because then it contradicts all of his talk about "change" and being "The Voice of the Voiceless". If Punk didn't put Darren over and make him look strong, he would just perpetuate the "status quo" of "only the main event matters" and "the midcard is meaningless", a status quo that Darren only managed to skirt around because of his coming out.
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FinalGwen
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Particularly fond of muffins.
Posts: 16,536
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Post by FinalGwen on Sept 2, 2013 23:44:01 GMT -5
So Titus and Young don't have talent and ability? Seriously? And by that measure, Brie Bella's in a Divas' title match at Night Of Champions because she's just that good? Roman Reigns' role in the Shield has nothing to do with his family connections? Triple H appears several times every show just because he's so goshdarn talented? Not taking away from their talent and ability, but it does seem a bit suspect that Darren Young now gets to be one of the featured regulars because of his coming out while the Major Bros. or JTG sit on the sidelines because they don't appeal to "certain kinds" of fans. It's no different from Sin Cara or Del Rio getting pushed to pull in the Latin demographic. And Zack Ryder got a push a while back because he got positive press with Youtube. And people were generally quite happy with that, rather than these never ending threads starting with points about how it's unfair that a gay guy is getting wins on TV and that's the best way to get a push. It's not like this is even the most successful the PTP have been. They got actual tag team title matches in the past, which they haven't got in this current run.
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Post by corndog on Sept 3, 2013 0:12:22 GMT -5
Gay or not, I've wanted the PTP to be tag team champions for a very long time. If WWE exploiting a superstar coming out as a means of pushing them, then so be it. Exactly, been a fan for a while myself, and I don't care why they are pushed, it just needed to happen. No idea why a long time(by WWE standards) tag team hasn't eventually won the belts, even the Usos had a run. Ironically enough, I see Titus becoming the breakout star of the two, he was very over tonight.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Sept 3, 2013 0:30:04 GMT -5
I don't think it's so much "We need to push him because he's gay" but more "We should push him because he's in the spotlight" Which he is. Though that's probably already faded. I don't think they've even mentioned that he's gay on the air have they? If they ever do, you can count on that being the exact moment it jumps the shark. Right now they're just going ahead and pushing a team that has some interest.
PTP shouldn't have been heels to begin with anyway. They were some of the least heelish heels of all time. On the occasions where they actually did something heelish it looked forced and almost out of place.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Sept 3, 2013 0:32:42 GMT -5
I expected WWE to do something with this and the fact that it hasn't been crass or tacky is a godsend.
PTP are a great team though - so while it didn't come about the usual way I'm glad its happening.
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Abdullah
Hank Scorpio
Thank you, Ishmeal Loves Bayley!
Posts: 6,421
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Post by Abdullah on Sept 3, 2013 9:04:19 GMT -5
If WWE wanted to book Hawkins or Ryder, they would. Darren Young isn't stopping that.
Prime Time Players are regularly plastered on WWE.com as well as the company's Youtube channel and were recently booked in a brief angle with CM Punk; They have almost always been featured whenever possible, way before Darren came out. It's disingenuous to pretend otherwise and it's a little sad that a couple of wins in cooldown matches could draw the dismay of so many.
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Post by CATCH_US IS the Conversation on Sept 3, 2013 9:12:06 GMT -5
If WWE wanted to book Hawkins or Ryder, they would. Darren Young isn't stopping that. Prime Time Players are regularly plastered on WWE.com as well as the company's Youtube channel and were recently booked in a brief angle with CM Punk; They have almost always been featured whenever possible, way before Darren came out. It's disingenuous to pretend otherwise and it's a little sad that a couple of wins in cooldown matches could draw the dismay of so many. Thing is that Ryder is currently playing a face character, and all the excess face turns make it less and less likely that the faces they already have in the undercard get a chance to step up. Ryder and Hawkins are just "generic heterosexual white guys", so they don't appeal to any "demographic" the way that Khali pulls in the Indian demo, or Sin Cara pulls in the Mexican demo, or how Darren Young will supposedly pull in the gay demo.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 3, 2013 9:14:36 GMT -5
PTP is a team that actually gets a good reaction when they wrestle. Titus got plenty of cheers doing his fraternity pose/flourish/whatever and when he hit his finisher. Considering that fans like PTP and not just Darren, but Titus as well, I'd say pushing them is an excellent choice, no matter what the circumstances might be.
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Post by Dave the Dave on Sept 3, 2013 9:19:32 GMT -5
I don't think it's terribly wrong for the WWE to capitalize on someone's newly found notoriety....
but claiming "all kinds of guys are getting pushed so who knows why PTP is now" is a little bit of putting our heads in the sand. MAybe they were planning to start pushing them THE SAME WEEK already, but I doubt it.
I'm okay with it mainly because it's trying to make something out of the fame not his sexuality (though they go hand in hand) but I can see why people would have an issue.
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Abdullah
Hank Scorpio
Thank you, Ishmeal Loves Bayley!
Posts: 6,421
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Post by Abdullah on Sept 3, 2013 9:21:51 GMT -5
If WWE wanted to book Hawkins or Ryder, they would. Darren Young isn't stopping that. Prime Time Players are regularly plastered on WWE.com as well as the company's Youtube channel and were recently booked in a brief angle with CM Punk; They have almost always been featured whenever possible, way before Darren came out. It's disingenuous to pretend otherwise and it's a little sad that a couple of wins in cooldown matches could draw the dismay of so many. Thing is that Ryder is currently playing a face character, and all the excess face turns make it less and less likely that the faces they already have in the undercard get a chance to step up. Ryder and Hawkins are just "generic heterosexual white guys", so they don't appeal to any "demographic" the way that Khali pulls in the Indian demo, or Sin Cara pulls in the Mexican demo, or how Darren Young will supposedly pull in the gay demo. I think you're over-thinking it. I say this as a Primo fan, I never thought he would be plucked from obscurity and given a gimmick. Or Hawkins and Reks last year with their quest to impress. If WWE had anything in mind for Hawkins or Ryder, they'd get TV time. If not on RAW or Smackdown, then they'd take over Main Event at least. WWE just doesn't seem to have any interest in them and you can blame the writers for that. But Young has very little to do with it, especially considering that PTP have always been favored when it comes to TV time. ...Remember Pancake Patterson, randomly? Yeah, this isn't new.
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Post by Red Impact on Sept 3, 2013 9:24:05 GMT -5
I have no doubt that it was a contributing factor, but I don't think they'd be getting a push if they weren't already talented. The difference between PTP and, say, Zack Ryder getting a push, is that PTP is really entertaining when given a live mic, where Ryder wasn't. Since Ryder's gimmick was supposed to be based around his ability to have a funny web show, it sort of hurts him more than anyone else.
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Post by EoE: Well There's Your Problem on Sept 3, 2013 9:24:27 GMT -5
I love that The Prime Time Players are face now and getting a half-decent run of TV time. Even without Young's announcement, I don't think they would have been heel much longer anyway (since they were REALLY spinning their wheels and a face turn might have been a last-ditch thing to do before releasing them).
Also, seeing so many people in the crowd do the Millions Of Dollars dance makes me smile.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Sept 3, 2013 9:27:44 GMT -5
A face turn was coming either way. They didn't really do anything heelish and hell, they palled around with Cena too.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Sept 3, 2013 9:28:56 GMT -5
Will FAN push me if I come out too? Nope, we already have a bunch of serious gay posters.
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The Ichi
Patti Mayonnaise
AGGRESSIVE Executive Janitor of the Third Floor Manager's Bathroom
Posts: 37,656
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Post by The Ichi on Sept 3, 2013 9:31:29 GMT -5
They're a comedy based tag team with a fun catchphrase and a dancemove that goes with it. I'm suprised they were ever heels to begin with.
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chazraps
Wade Wilson
Better have my money when I come-a collect!
Posts: 28,273
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Post by chazraps on Sept 3, 2013 10:06:47 GMT -5
Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't Darren Young's strong showing against CM Punk predate his coming out? They had been slowly building all summer. Plus, it's not like the fan turn has really changed their personalities at all. They're hitting all the same idiosyncrasies we've come to love, they're just facing heels now. Isn't that what we've been wanting from our logical fan-dictated heel-faces turns for a while now? It did. But that's because you can't just have Punk squashing midcarders because then it contradicts all of his talk about "change" and being "The Voice of the Voiceless". If Punk didn't put Darren over and make him look strong, he would just perpetuate the "status quo" of "only the main event matters" and "the midcard is meaningless", a status quo that Darren only managed to skirt around because of his coming out. Seriously? If WWE wanted to book Hawkins or Ryder, they would. Darren Young isn't stopping that. Prime Time Players are regularly plastered on WWE.com as well as the company's Youtube channel and were recently booked in a brief angle with CM Punk; They have almost always been featured whenever possible, way before Darren came out. It's disingenuous to pretend otherwise and it's a little sad that a couple of wins in cooldown matches could draw the dismay of so many. Thing is that Ryder is currently playing a face character, and all the excess face turns make it less and less likely that the faces they already have in the undercard get a chance to step up. Ryder and Hawkins are just "generic heterosexual white guys", so they don't appeal to any "demographic" the way that Khali pulls in the Indian demo, or Sin Cara pulls in the Mexican demo, or how Darren Young will supposedly pull in the gay demo. I'm sorry, I wasn't aware we were dealing with a marketing expert whose managed to deconstruct the capitalist agenda that navigates the WWE's masculine gaze. Or am I misreading this and we're just taking umbrage with PTP's recent success because they're not Ryder and trying to figure out why?
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Post by corndog on Sept 3, 2013 10:21:21 GMT -5
I love that The Prime Time Players are face now and getting a half-decent run of TV time. Even without Young's announcement, I don't think they would have been heel much longer anyway (since they were REALLY spinning their wheels and a face turn might have been a last-ditch thing to do before releasing them). Also, seeing so many people in the crowd do the Millions Of Dollars dance makes me smile. I agree with the last part, loved seeing the kids do the Millions of Dollars dance. A bright spot in a somewhat depressing episode of Raw. You are probably right about the first part, not really going anywhere as heels and this being a last ditch effort. But this also proves something alot of people here believe, strong booking helps get people over. Granted, it has failed in the case of Alberto Del Rio, but if you have any charisma at all, you should be able to get over with good booking. The good news, it seems to be working for the Prime Time Players and I think they are building for a show down with the Shield. Granted, they will lose it in a screwy finish,atleast in the first try, but the fans will be behind them.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Sept 3, 2013 11:16:28 GMT -5
Meh they are long overdue for a push anyways. Considering they are actually good and entertaining and have characters. Plus didn't Titus have more single matches and pinfall victories then Darren? Plus they just showed up on Raw as faces after Darren came out and nobody questioned their sudden babyface turn and started cheering and doing the dance.
That's talent
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Sept 3, 2013 12:51:05 GMT -5
If WWE wanted to book Hawkins or Ryder, they would. Darren Young isn't stopping that. Prime Time Players are regularly plastered on WWE.com as well as the company's Youtube channel and were recently booked in a brief angle with CM Punk; They have almost always been featured whenever possible, way before Darren came out. It's disingenuous to pretend otherwise and it's a little sad that a couple of wins in cooldown matches could draw the dismay of so many. Thing is that Ryder is currently playing a face character, and all the excess face turns make it less and less likely that the faces they already have in the undercard get a chance to step up. Ryder and Hawkins are just "generic heterosexual white guys", so they don't appeal to any "demographic" the way that Khali pulls in the Indian demo, or Sin Cara pulls in the Mexican demo, or how Darren Young will supposedly pull in the gay demo. I know it's a problem with the midcard in the WWE but Darren Young & Titus got consistent time on Raw (whether as squash guys for the likes of Punk or tag competitors against the Usos) a while before Darren Young came out. They were already above Ryder and co before it so making the bold -and with the former facts in mind entirely baseless- accusations that they're only on the show because of Young coming out (which also means you're playing the positive discrimination type card, whether intentional or not, and I know you're a gay guy too so I appreciate it is likely entirely by accident) is untrue. I mean, blame the company for making it impossible for your favourite lower carders to have time on TV, blame the structure of the shows, blame 3 hours Raws being 1/3 replays of the same segments, don't blame the guy who was already on TV regularly coming out. Plus, as is seen in many sports (example: Steven Gerrard/Gareth Bale regularly voted as "hot guys!" for the gay community in the Premier League) sexuality doesn't really play into drawing in the gay community. I mean, everything is vanity, no one genuinely thinks they have a chance with these people (well, some do, but we'll avoid those folk for our own sanity), so there's no hard facts behind "must be gay to draw in non-straight orientations" ideas.
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