Urethra Franklin
King Koopa
When Toronto sports teams lose, Alison Brie is sad
Posts: 11,099
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Post by Urethra Franklin on Sept 11, 2013 14:34:35 GMT -5
Edge said HHH married into success, while Hunter claimed that Edge never drew a dime. These are both very arguable points when we look back at wrestling history.
The thing is, though, we won't look back on them through a kayfabe lens, but they were presented through one on Monday and that doesn't really make any sense.
I suppose with Edge's point, there is less of an issue. You can argue that HHH received more title shots or favourable officiating because of his association with the McMahons. I suppose that's fair enough.
HHH's point, while meant to be cutting (and I guess it is) holds no water from a kayfabe standpoint.
Why would Edge care if he didn't draw when he won 11 World Titles and is one of the most decorated wrestlers of all-time? That's why you become a wrestler, isn't it - to win titles?
The more I think about it, the more I think the segment was pretty stupid.
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Post by gnr123 on Sept 11, 2013 14:38:31 GMT -5
It just like when Triple H said about Daniel Bryan and "it doesn't matter that your popular." He's being a dick, he's being a hypocrite.
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Pushed to the Moon
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Tony Schiavone in Disguise
Working myself into a shoot
Posts: 15,819 
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Post by Pushed to the Moon on Sept 11, 2013 14:39:46 GMT -5
Well even in kayfabe the whole point of HHH's hatred of Bryan is that he "isn't good for business". So Edge might not care if he didn't draw but all HHH cares about is making money.
Incidentally, are there any stories of backstage heatzz with HHH and Edge from back in the day?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 11, 2013 14:44:05 GMT -5
It is stupid but hey it's Triple H.
Beyond that Edge was like an upper-card Kofi. He always seemed to have a main title somehow.
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Post by cabbageboy on Sept 11, 2013 14:50:50 GMT -5
The thing that stood out to me was that not only is HHH not content with burying the current wrestlers, he has to go out of his way to bury retired HOF wrestlers as well.
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Bub (BLM)
Patti Mayonnaise
advocates duck on rodent violence
Fed. Up.
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Post by Bub (BLM) on Sept 11, 2013 14:54:07 GMT -5
Well even in kayfabe the whole point of HHH's hatred of Bryan is that he "isn't good for business". So Edge might not care if he didn't draw but all HHH cares about is making money. Incidentally, are there any stories of backstage heatzz with HHH and Edge from back in the day? Yep. Edge has been pretty honest about the fact that Triple H was one of his biggest detractors back in the day. All that stuff he said on Monday was essentially true. |
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Post by Dave the Dave on Sept 11, 2013 14:58:33 GMT -5
The Edge "married into his success" line seemed a little heated...but I'm sure it wasn't.
I do have to make my own point. Forget about titles and wrestling. HHH didn't marry in to that. He married into his role now. He married into owning wrestling. He may not have done it on purpose (I'm sure he didn't) but it's kind of like the First Lady being important. They just happened to marry someone of consequence. Granted HHH is capable, but it's just weird how it worked. What if she married Headbanger Thrash or something?
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Pushed to the Moon
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Tony Schiavone in Disguise
Working myself into a shoot
Posts: 15,819
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Post by Pushed to the Moon on Sept 11, 2013 15:02:17 GMT -5
Well even in kayfabe the whole point of HHH's hatred of Bryan is that he "isn't good for business". So Edge might not care if he didn't draw but all HHH cares about is making money. Incidentally, are there any stories of backstage heatzz with HHH and Edge from back in the day? Yep. Edge has been pretty honest about the fact that Triple H was one of his biggest detractors back in the day. All that stuff he said on Monday was essentially true. Ah ok. I have no recollection of these stories from the time. I thought it looked pretty heated on Raw but maybe they were just good at acting. HHH seemed genuinely annoyed. |
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Urethra Franklin
King Koopa
When Toronto sports teams lose, Alison Brie is sad
Posts: 11,099
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Post by Urethra Franklin on Sept 11, 2013 15:04:05 GMT -5
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Post by cool guy on Sept 11, 2013 15:05:55 GMT -5
Beyond that Edge was like an upper-card Kofi. He always seemed to have a main title somehow. I never liked the whole "Edge doesn't have any memorable title reigns" argument. Giving Edge a bunch of shorter reigns with the world title was a great way to play to his (rather considerable, in my opinion) strength as a performer. Edge may not have had many memorable title reigns, but he's had loads of memorable title wins. A large part of the reason I even kept watching throughout the 2007-9 period was just to see Edge and all the convoluted lengths he would go to win the title. He was like a scummy Team Rocket, you knew once he got what he wanted he wouldn't have it long, but that was fine, since you wanted to see what ridiculous way he would try to get it next. It's not same thing as CM Punk's 400 day reign, sure, but that doesn't mean it's not a valid way to book someone, just a different one. |
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Sektor
Unicron
The OTHER Big Red Machine.
Posts: 2,808
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Post by Sektor on Sept 11, 2013 15:07:01 GMT -5
Kayfabe is dead. Long live the new kayfabe.
Even in the early 2000's, wrestlers took it as a big deal if someone moved merch or "put asses in the seats". So that would be the weight of that insult, that no one cared about Edge, and he didn't make any money.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 11, 2013 15:24:05 GMT -5
Beyond that Edge was like an upper-card Kofi. He always seemed to have a main title somehow. I never liked the whole "Edge doesn't have any memorable title reigns" argument. Giving Edge a bunch of shorter reigns with the world title was a great way to play to his (rather considerable, in my opinion) strength as a performer. Edge may not have had many memorable title reigns, but he's had loads of memorable title wins. A large part of the reason I even kept watching throughout the 2007-9 period was just to see Edge and all the convoluted lengths he would go to win the title. He was like a scummy Team Rocket, you knew once he got what he wanted he wouldn't have it long, but that was fine, since you wanted to see what ridiculous way he would try to get it next. It's not same thing as CM Punk's 400 day reign, sure, but that doesn't mean it's not a valid way to book someone, just a different one. It was part of his character really. There's not many wrestlers who incorporated the title into their characters and Edge was perfect with his. It was also a smart way to keep him in the title picture whenever they needed him to be. You just never knew with him. Unlike other wrestlers as soon as they lose the title you usually think "Well he won't have a title in a good while", well unless they were Cena or something. With Edge you really thought "Ok, he lost the belt but you know he's going to end up getting it again sometime, damn that Edge". |
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Post by Can you afford to pay me, Gah on Sept 11, 2013 16:27:07 GMT -5
Edge said HHH married into success, while Hunter claimed that Edge never drew a dime. These are both very arguable points when we look back at wrestling history. The thing is, though, we won't look back on them through a kayfabe lens, but they were presented through one on Monday and that doesn't really make any sense. I suppose with Edge's point, there is less of an issue. You can argue that HHH received more title shots or favourable officiating because of his association with the McMahons. I suppose that's fair enough. HHH's point, while meant to be cutting (and I guess it is) holds no water from a kayfabe standpoint. Why would Edge care if he didn't draw when he won 11 World Titles and is one of the most decorated wrestlers of all-time? That's why you become a wrestler, isn't it - to win titles? The more I think about it, the more I think the segment was pretty stupid. It makes no sense. If Edge wasn't a draw then why was he champion so many times. And had his match go on last at two WM's? |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 11, 2013 16:28:16 GMT -5
I really hate pseudo-shoot comments in general.
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Post by "Gizzark" Mike Wronglevenay on Sept 11, 2013 16:32:35 GMT -5
What is this forum's problem with heels saying deliberately inflammatory, stupid shit? That is the point of being a heel. Either Triple H really is an asshole, or you just got worked, or more than likely some combination of the two. Heels should never be right, ever, otherwise they shouldn't be heels.
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Post by Straight Edge Scrotum on Sept 11, 2013 16:37:55 GMT -5
What is this forum's problem with heels saying deliberately inflammatory, stupid shit? That is the point of being a heel. Either Triple H really is an asshole, or you just got worked, or more than likely some combination of the two. Heels should never be right, ever, otherwise they shouldn't be heels.  |
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Post by xxshoyuweeniexx on Sept 11, 2013 16:41:58 GMT -5
I really hate pseudo-shoot comments in general. At this rate, we're gonna have an entire generation of kids on the playground arguing about Bo Dallas being a bigger draw than Hulk Hogan because Hogan never ended the streak or main evented 10 Wrestlemanians in a row like The Bo. |
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Post by Dave the Dave on Sept 11, 2013 16:44:32 GMT -5
What is this forum's problem with heels saying deliberately inflammatory, stupid shit? That is the point of being a heel. Either Triple H really is an asshole, or you just got worked, or more than likely some combination of the two. Heels should never be right, ever, otherwise they shouldn't be heels. The hate isn't blind. At least not this hate. Dude deserves a lot of what he gets. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 11, 2013 16:46:15 GMT -5
I really hate pseudo-shoot comments in general. We're gonna have an entire generation of kids on the playground arguing about Bo Dallas being a bigger draw than Hulk Hogan because Hogan never ended the streak or main evented 10 Wrestlemanians in a row like The Bo. BO-ok it! |
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Urethra Franklin
King Koopa
When Toronto sports teams lose, Alison Brie is sad
Posts: 11,099
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Post by Urethra Franklin on Sept 11, 2013 16:49:53 GMT -5
What is this forum's problem with heels saying deliberately inflammatory, stupid shit? That is the point of being a heel. Either Triple H really is an asshole, or you just got worked, or more than likely some combination of the two. Heels should never be right, ever, otherwise they shouldn't be heels. But the issue isn't that HHH is right or is wrong, it's that his comments are irrelevant in kayfabe. He says Edge is a failure because he didn't draw. 95% of your audience doesn't understand the business aspect of wrestling, but most know that Edge has a shit-ton of titles. If HHH wants to be a dick and heel it up, just say Edge is a failure because he was constantly injured. These business-related worked shoots just misfire. I know HHH wants to incite, but you're not going to do that by talking about drawing money. |
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