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Post by Deleted on Nov 12, 2013 20:37:36 GMT -5
How can you say this with a straight face? Well because I'm counting as what it means to be a top wrestler as someone who has the crowd in the palm of his hands. I understand the usual interpretation is someone who can do lots of moves, nearly all of which are inconsequential to everything - but my own differs. If you work a crowd you're a better wrestler than someone who can't, even if your move repertoire isn't as large. The best actor is the one with the most engaging performance not the longer list of credits listed on imdb I get what you mean, I really do, and agree with the philosophy. But in Orton's case, I think it's to the point that he sucks the life out of the match. His main events with Daniel Bryan were even boring, and boring Daniel Bryan matches don't happen often. It's different "heeling it up" boring, it's actually looking bored himself. Dude looks like he just woke up a lot of the time. He was like that as a face too, unless he was Vipering it up. I think he's a great talent but he gives off this vibe like he has to punch a clock before he walks out there. I thought it was funny how specific it was. Not just a boring chant, Randy's boring.
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Post by Starshine on Nov 12, 2013 20:38:16 GMT -5
Orton's so boring that even just talking about him pu-zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz...
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wisdomwizard
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Post by wisdomwizard on Nov 12, 2013 20:39:56 GMT -5
He's not boring. People just hate the sound of his voice. But a number of his promos have worked for me. Also, he's still great in the ring. This was just an English crowd entertaining themselves at Orton's expense. They are not the "correct" ones, and anyone who says otherwise loses any right to call out Smackdown's stupid hair-dryer.
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Sparkybob
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Post by Sparkybob on Nov 12, 2013 20:41:08 GMT -5
I think Orton does play off this perception quite a bit for heat. He knows his reputation, but why change it when you can get more heat than anybody on the roster just by slapping on a chinlock? If anything, he needs to make it more blatant. He should go up top for what appears to be a high risk move, only to step off at the last second and slap on a headlock. He should do his taunt for the rko but instead go for the sleeper hold.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 12, 2013 20:42:45 GMT -5
By the same token, shouldn't heel Del Rio get credit? If he was a tweener, Del Rio should get all the credit in the world. The crowd has no idea how to react!
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The Ichi
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Post by The Ichi on Nov 12, 2013 20:43:10 GMT -5
He's not boring. People just hate the sound of his voice. But a number of his promos have worked for me. Also, he's still great in the ring. This was just an English crowd entertaining themselves at Orton's expense. They are not the "correct" ones, and anyone who says otherwise loses any right to call out Smackdown's stupid hair-dryer. They gave a heel shit. Sounds like a correct crowd reaction to me.
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wisdomwizard
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Post by wisdomwizard on Nov 12, 2013 20:44:32 GMT -5
He's not boring. People just hate the sound of his voice. But a number of his promos have worked for me. Also, he's still great in the ring. This was just an English crowd entertaining themselves at Orton's expense. They are not the "correct" ones, and anyone who says otherwise loses any right to call out Smackdown's stupid hair-dryer. They gave a heel shit. Sounds like a correct crowd reaction to me. Calling the heels boring has never been considered the desired reaction.
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Sparkybob
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Post by Sparkybob on Nov 12, 2013 20:44:50 GMT -5
By the same token, shouldn't heel Del Rio get credit? The problem is is that Del Rio really doesn't get boo'd by the live audience. He gets the worst type of reaction. Be hated on the internet and get no reaction from the casuals.
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Sparkybob
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Post by Sparkybob on Nov 12, 2013 20:45:51 GMT -5
They gave a heel shit. Sounds like a correct crowd reaction to me. Calling the heels boring has never been considered the desired reaction. Meh heel heat is heel heat. The crowd chanting boring means they don't like the guy.
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The Ichi
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Post by The Ichi on Nov 12, 2013 20:46:03 GMT -5
They gave a heel shit. Sounds like a correct crowd reaction to me. Calling the heels boring has never been considered the desired reaction. Of course it is, the point of the heel is to be hated.
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Post by Starshine on Nov 12, 2013 20:46:07 GMT -5
They gave a heel shit. Sounds like a correct crowd reaction to me. Calling the heels boring has never been considered the desired reaction. Really?
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wisdomwizard
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Post by wisdomwizard on Nov 12, 2013 20:50:57 GMT -5
Calling the heels boring has never been considered the desired reaction. Of course it is, the point of the heel is to be hated. Yes, but none of the main heels they pushed are supposed to be considered by the crowds to be boring. I'm saying that I don't think they'll take him getting boring chants as "any heat is heel heat". There's a certain reaction they want even heels to get. As for Lance Storm, he was a low-carder at the time and that thing with Austin was just to give him a gimmick.
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Post by Magic knows Black Lives Matter on Nov 12, 2013 20:52:24 GMT -5
Well because I'm counting as what it means to be a top wrestler as someone who has the crowd in the palm of his hands. I understand the usual interpretation is someone who can do lots of moves, nearly all of which are inconsequential to everything - but my own differs. If you work a crowd you're a better wrestler than someone who can't, even if your move repertoire isn't as large. The best actor is the one with the most engaging performance not the longer list of credits listed on imdb I get what you mean, I really do, and agree with the philosophy. But in Orton's case, I think it's to the point that he sucks the life out of the match. His main events with Daniel Bryan were even boring, and boring Daniel Bryan matches don't happen often. It's different "heeling it up" boring, it's actually looking bored himself. Dude looks like he just woke up a lot of the time. He was like that as a face too, unless he was Vipering it up. I think he's a great talent but he gives off this vibe like he has to punch a clock before he walks out there. I thought it was funny how specific it was. Not just a boring chant, Randy's boring. Seriously, if what Orton does is "working", give me high spots and STRONG STYLE~! all day and all night. It seriously looks like the dude is sleep walking through the match. People gave me shit when I called him lazy but that's what I really believe. In TV matches, he wrestles lazily. Don't get me wrong, I understand WHY he wrestles that way. He's still over like rover without doing much and considering that he has had quite a few injuries, that's probably for the best. If I was in his position, I'd wrestle like that too. But it's comes off way too mechanical.
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Sparkybob
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Post by Sparkybob on Nov 12, 2013 20:55:49 GMT -5
Of course it is, the point of the heel is to be hated. Yes, but none of the main heels they pushed are supposed to be considered by the crowds to be boring. I'm saying that I don't think they'll take him getting boring chants as "any heat is heel heat". There's a certain reaction they want even heels to get. You can make an argument that SRS Jericho in 2008 was suppose to get the fans to hate for how boring he looked compared to his old self. Also SRS Swaggie in 2010.
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Surfer Sandman
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Post by Surfer Sandman on Nov 12, 2013 21:10:02 GMT -5
Randy is a hell of a wrestler, but has never exhibited anything that I would consider worthy of 10+ title reigns given his "character". If I had my way, he'd be following his daddy and sucking up to someone like Piper.
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Post by Bo Rida on Nov 13, 2013 7:37:18 GMT -5
I agree so boring I've stopped watching and didn't go to a house show because of him And that right there is the problem. Being deliberately boring may get heel heat from the live crowd but why would they pay to see such a performance again? Either the next time he's headlining a tour or main-eventing a PPV. He's perfectly capable of having a good match without doing any flashy moves but chooses to be boring instead. Surely the ideal heel is is somebody people want to see get beat not somebody many people don't want to see at all. They may have booed Orton but I doubt anybody leaving that arena Monday was thinking they must come back and see Orton the next time he's in town, however The Shield have kept their heel heat wherever they've gone and I bet people leaving the arena would be happy paying to see them again. Strangely of all the wrestlers around today Bo Dallas is arguably the best heel, he manages to be get amazing heel heat and be consistently entertaining without doing anything that overshadows the faces, these days people want to see him get beat so badly that a no-name jobber facing him was instantly the biggest face on the roster.
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Post by Baldobomb-22-OH-MAN!!! on Nov 13, 2013 9:15:21 GMT -5
Calling the heels boring has never been considered the desired reaction. Meh heel heat is heel heat. The crowd chanting boring means they don't like the guy. *watches as people change the channel due to someone being boring* yeah that guy sure showed them!
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Post by Crimson on Nov 13, 2013 9:21:32 GMT -5
Lawler heard em just fine Lawler mentioning it was quite funny because he said it in a manner that was like he wasn't sure whether he should actually say it or not. "I think they're saying Randy's...boring *nervous laughter*" What he meant to say was they were chanting "Let's Go Sheamus."
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Post by Deleted on Nov 13, 2013 12:03:19 GMT -5
Randy's good in the ring and I don't give a good goddamn about high spots and I still don't feel like watching his matches when he's a heel. It has little to do with him being "old school" and more to do with Randy actually being boring when he's heel. So if his master plan is to be boring to get me to tune out: mission accomplished. A guy like Macho may have worked a different style as a heel but he had a character with the undercurrent of insanity always there, Jake the Snake always had an aura of darkness bubbling under the surface. Randy makes goofy faces and punches the mat.
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Post by Urfarkendarf on Nov 13, 2013 12:08:13 GMT -5
When Randy loses his temper, I laugh at him. It comes off as contrived and not natural. He's a terrible actor and yes, he's boring. Good hand in the ring, terrible at pretty much everything else.
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