Sephiroth
Wade Wilson
Surviving
Posts: 29,086
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Post by Sephiroth on May 9, 2014 9:57:56 GMT -5
I both sympathize and don't sympathize. Every human being has the right to privacy, to deal with their issues and problems away from the glare of the spotlight. But with that said, when you become a celebrity you really do forfeit some of that right; celebrities are public figures, and every move they make and every word they say is going to be subject to public scrutiny. Its messed up, it honestly is, but that is the reality of it. IF you want to maintain your privacy, then don't become a celebrity; if you have a passion for acting you can indulge it with local theater and small film roles, but practically everyone who pursues acting wants to make it to Hollywood because that is where the big money is. If you have a passion for music you can indulge it by playing local gigs-but almost everyone who seeks out a musical career wants to make it big because that is where the real money is. It is no different for wrestling; Phil Brooks could have simply wrestled local indy shows and written articles for wrestling magazines, but he wanted to make it to WWE because that is where the big money is. I applaud his hard work and effort for making it so far-but when he got to WWE he became a celebrity, and his private life became very, very public. To make an example of what I am saying; I am quite sure that Adam Copeland, Amy Dumas, and Matt Hardy would have preferred sort out their difficulties between themselves, but because they were working for WWE their issues with each other very swiftly became a public matter. To their credit, it seems they did eventually reach some sort of understand, but the issues that came up between them remain a topic of speculation among fans to this day. That is the price you pay for being a celebrity, WWE superstar.
With all this in mind, I can say that I appreciate Phil Brooks desire for privacy. But he has honestly not helped himself on a number of levels. By exiting WWE in the fashion he did and being so tight lipped he is only causing fans to speculate more and more, which means they will just hound him and other parties for details. He honestly does deserve to be able to sort whatever problems drove him from WWE on his own, but because he is a celebrity that simply will not happen, and he could probably save himself and others so much of this annoyance with a single youtube video or blog post detailing what happened and why he made the decisions he did; it would never completely end the circus, but it would put so much of it to rest that it would almost certainly bring him a degree of peace. But, he prefers to keep it private-and I say good for him for it, he has every right to if he so wishes. But if that is his decision, he needs to be prepared to live with the potential consequences of it, given his status as a celebrity. The only real answer will be time, and even then it will never completely go away. On that same note, as some others have pointed out, he hasn't helped himself by still making some prominent public appearances, such as at a hockey game. He could just as easily watch a game at home on TV, or he could take out a private luxury box so he can enjoy it free of the camera glare-but instead he wants to sit in the audience like anyone else. Except he is not anyone else, he is a former WWE superstar and so when he appears in public like that it will draw attention. It really is little wonder that so many celebrities end up flying private flights, being driven around in cars with tinted windows, living in homes surrounded by fences, and travelling around with a retinue of bodyguards, because those are what they have to do to ensure a degree of the privacy that so many take for granted. Its not right that they should have to go to those lengths, but it is the cost of being a public figure.
In closing, I respect Phil Brooks' right to privacy and commend him for trying to keep his issues to himself-but he is just not going to ever get those things to the degree he may want, and he should either accept that or start doing the things that will ensure he does get a greater degree of it. There is no real middle ground for him in this case, as unfair as that is.
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Post by g1megatronfan on May 9, 2014 10:02:03 GMT -5
CM Punk seems like he went into the wrong line of work. He should have accepted the fact that he hates people before taking up a career in the entertainment industry. If it bothers him that much...he can wait about another year or so...most will have forgotten about him. WWE seems to be doing just fine without him and there isn't really much in the way of Punk chants like many thought there would be.
In another year or so when a lot of fans have moved on...he can show up on Raw and complain about how he's been booked...lol. Only for him to get pissy at fans for giving him some attention and he can start the cycle over again.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 9, 2014 10:22:20 GMT -5
The whole idea of being famous is crazy.
I can't imagine being that wow'd by someone just because they're on TV or an athelte to the point you'd hassle them while they're trying to eat a meal or staking out their place just to get a glimpse of them. Its pretty pathetic, if you ask me.
I've stumbled across celebrities a time or two and while I did a double take just to make sure they were who I thougth they were, other than that I just left them alone. Most fans chasing celebrities are like a dog chasing a car.
Being famous doesn't mean you've given up your privacy or your right to being a normal citizen, it just means a high volume of people appeciate your skills as an athlete/actor/etc (the exception being people who are just famous for being famous). That's it.
Its easy to go, "Oh you're famous, deal with it!" but that's very "victim-blamey" to me. Its on humans to act like human beings, not to suffer the inhumanity of others.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 9, 2014 10:32:40 GMT -5
I don't get the arguement if he wanted solitude he should of never gotten into wrestling. Dude got into wrestling because it was his passion and he was obsessed with it. He didn't want any other job or live a life of regrets he actually followed through to chase his dream. He didn't want any what if's scenarios he actually went through it to chase the dream. Also why does he want to be the face of the company the franchise? Well it's because he wanted to prove he's the best wrestler in the world and it's hard to prove you're the best if you are a upper midcarder who is not being paid like someone who is the best. That's also another thing. Money. Dude is a 35 year old multi millionaire who traveled the world so many times he practically collected enough air miles to travel anywhere in the world. So yeah dude is 35 years old who has enough money to never work again and live a comfortable life and can travel anywhere in the world for free.
As why he wants to drop opening faceoff in the Blackhawks game? Famous or not dude is a passionate Blackhawks fan who travels to see all of his games. Anyone who has a favorite sports team is usually a big f***ing mark for that team and it's a dream come true when that team gives you some attention. If I dropped the puck in a Edmonton Oiler's game I would brag about that shit for the rest of my life no matter how obnoxious I become and how it's really a pointless thing to brag about.
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Post by xCompackx on May 9, 2014 11:33:01 GMT -5
Shouldn't be surprised this thread reached 6 pages I suppose lol. But yeah, I think if you see any celebrity in public and politely ask for their autograph, then that's completely fine. But if you're staking out their home just to see them, or crowding them in a grocery store just because they're famous, you really should rethink your priorities. I mean, I'm a fan of CM Punk. Would I ask for an autograph or a picture if it was the appropiate place and time for that? Sure. But there's just no way that bothering a guy while he's eating or camping out in an alley to catch a glimpse even sounds okay.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 9, 2014 11:36:09 GMT -5
I do remember Mick Foley discussing this issue when he decided to shun himself from public eye by shaving his head (discussed in Foley is Good and also on the For All Mankind DVD), yet failed because he was identified instantly.
This is something that we like to make fun of, but it has to be very frustrating, especially if you feel like you can't do what you used to do anymore.
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Post by Red Impact on May 9, 2014 12:55:31 GMT -5
I don't get the arguement if he wanted solitude he should of never gotten into wrestling. Dude got into wrestling because it was his passion and he was obsessed with it. He didn't want any other job or live a life of regrets he actually followed through to chase his dream. He didn't want any what if's scenarios he actually went through it to chase the dream. Also why does he want to be the face of the company the franchise? All that is well and good, and it's his right to be passionate and follow his dreams. But say a little kid's passion is skateboarding, but he never ever wants to fall. Then he needs to figure out which of those two desires is really more important, because you can't participate in one without the other occurring. To be a big name in WWE is to be famous. They are inseparable, you cannot have one without the other, and this isn't a new development. So while it's his right if he wants to retire, he knew going in that to be the face of the WWE meant you're no longer anonymous in public. So I can see why people aren't lining up to feel sorry for the guy, it's not like the consequences should have caught him off guard. That's not excusing the fan's behavior. The fans are obviously crossing every sort of line, and there's no justification for stalking or seeking out a guy's house to get a glimpse. He's not Jesus, he's a wrestler, and it's especially ocunterproductive when you know that he doesn't like that behavior. It's just that you can't really pursue making yourself famous and expect anonymity afterwards, unless you want to hit a puck at a playoff hockey game or be a special guest on a podcast.
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Post by Kevin Hamilton on May 9, 2014 13:08:35 GMT -5
Put me in the "he knew he was going to deal with some annoying fans when he hit it big, but he still doesn't deserve to be constantly harassed" category. Not all celebs are the same with their fame- some find a good balance, some make working with the press a full time job to stay in the public mix, and others are more low key. Although I will say that dropping the puck for a major NHL franchise isn't likely to decrease the chances of fans annoying him. It's not, but if you've loved that team all your life, and they offer, are you gonna say no? If the Cardinals came calling, you're throwing out that first pitch, damn the consequences right?
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Post by carp (SPC, Itoh Respect Army) on May 9, 2014 13:11:03 GMT -5
All that is well and good, and it's his right to be passionate and follow his dreams. But say a little kid's passion is skateboarding, but he never ever wants to fall. Then he needs to figure out which of those two desires is really more important, because you can't participate in one without the other occurring. To be a big name in WWE is to be famous. They are inseparable, you cannot have one without the other, and this isn't a new development. So while it's his right if he wants to retire, he knew going in that to be the face of the WWE meant you're no longer anonymous in public. So I can see why people aren't lining up to feel sorry for the guy, it's not like the consequences should have caught him off guard. I'm really not sure of the logic of what you're saying. It's unfair, but it's not surprising, so it makes sense not to feel sorry for him? Unfair, crappy things are unfair and crappy even if they can be expected. Unfair, crappy things are unfair and crappy even if someone's own behavior place themselves in a position where it would happen. Why on earth wouldn't you have sympathy for someone having trouble? Also, you're kind of arguing that people shouldn't become WWE wrestlers. Which, probably that's true actually, but not for the reasons you're saying.
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Post by sybaku on May 9, 2014 13:30:38 GMT -5
This is clearly a long work
For the next several years Punk will remain out of the spotlight but these reports will continue to trickle until finally Punk makes his return, as a heel who hates the fans, he'll have guys cover his face while he exits and enters the ring, he'll hold autograph signings and never show up, and finally in an ultimate heel move he will hire CM Munk to stand in for a "Make-A-Wish".
CM Punk, master of the work, preserver of kayfabe
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 9, 2014 13:37:37 GMT -5
"I'm all for celebrities having boundaries, but goddamn it, I HATE those celebrities who have BOUNDARIES!!" More like, "I'm all for celebrities having boundaries but that doesn't give them the right to act like assholes to the people who pay their salary." Which is, y'know, exactly what I said, but by all means draw your own conclusions.
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Bub (BLM)
Patti Mayonnaise
advocates duck on rodent violence
Fed. Up.
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Post by Bub (BLM) on May 9, 2014 13:40:31 GMT -5
To be honest, I can't really throw stones at the guy because I'd probably act the same way. I hate it when people bother me now, and I'm just a regular guy. If I was getting bugged by people every time I stepped out the door, yeah, I'd probably be a giant asshole too.
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Post by Red Impact on May 9, 2014 13:58:39 GMT -5
I'm really not sure of the logic of what you're saying. It's unfair, but it's not surprising, so it makes sense not to feel sorry for him? Unfair, crappy things are unfair and crappy even if they can be expected. Unfair, crappy things are unfair and crappy even if someone's own behavior place themselves in a position where it would happen. Why on earth wouldn't you have sympathy for someone having trouble? Also, you're kind of arguing that people shouldn't become WWE wrestlers. Which, probably that's true actually, but not for the reasons you're saying. See, the problem is that you see such things as having your picture taken as unfair. It's not unfair, he willingly traded his anonymity for millions of millions of dollars, knowing full well what it'd entail. A lot of people would love to make that trade, but most won't be able to. Those that don't want to deal with that usually learn early on not to pursue a line of work that'd make them have to deal with that. That's life, when you choose to pursue a profession, you willingly take on the good and bad of it. He wasn't exploited, he got what he was owed and got out. More power to him for that. But if you get the benefits of something, you have to be willing to take the costs and it's highly unlikely that he didn't know what they were. So it makes sense that people aren't terribly sympathetic that the guy who made millions by willingly making himself famous has to deal with the fact that people who were fans of his see him in public and want to take pictures. The stalkerish shit is over the top and he's certainly within his rights to be pissed off by the idiots who do that. There's no denying that, but the sheer fact that he's famous and has to deal with people recognizing him? That sort of thing came with the contract he signed. If you don't want to deal with the fact that the average person might be excited to see you, then you have to choose a career path that allows you to avoid it. So I understand it when people don't have sympathy for a guy who willingly decided to take millions to deal with that.
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Sparkybob
King Koopa
I have a status?
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Post by Sparkybob on May 9, 2014 14:25:33 GMT -5
This isn't a one side relationship here. Punk got a ton out of the WWE. Recognition from his peers, traveling all over the world, a ton of money which gave him the opportunity to retire in his mid 30's set for life if he invest right, meeting the women he's going to marry etc. This was a 2 way street and Punk knew the consequences of being a #1 or #2 of a big company like the WWE(Travel/being famous/those crazy bumps). Punk in his judgment accepted those consequences because he wanted all the benefits of being a top star. He wasn't hoodwinked here by Vince, he knew ahead of time the warts that come with the job.
Yes those stalker stories are crazy and Punk should be furious about that invasion of privacy, but in general he could have avoided most of these problems. You know how? By turning down a chance to be a top star. He choose to be in that top spot. So I think it's hard for me to feel sympy about issues that Punk basically accepted that he'll live with them(Just the general be famous thing, not the crazy stalkers).
He can complain till the cows come home, but I can see why people don't feel too bad for Punk.
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Post by Lance Uppercut on May 9, 2014 14:47:35 GMT -5
The only real answer will be time, and even then it will never completely go away. On that same note, as some others have pointed out, he hasn't helped himself by still making some prominent public appearances, such as at a hockey game. He could just as easily watch a game at home on TV, or he could take out a private luxury box so he can enjoy it free of the camera glare-but instead he wants to sit in the audience like anyone else. Except he is not anyone else, he is a former WWE superstar and so when he appears in public like that it will draw attention. It really is little wonder that so many celebrities end up flying private flights, being driven around in cars with tinted windows, living in homes surrounded by fences, and travelling around with a retinue of bodyguards, because those are what they have to do to ensure a degree of the privacy that so many take for granted. Its not right that they should have to go to those lengths, but it is the cost of being a public figure. this is what I was trying to say but better. The man has made a lot of money, and I'm sure he'll figure out how to make more over the rest of life. There are ways for money to afford you some privacy, but he insists on being a man of the people living in the city he grew up in, in a part of town where everyone can see him, riding his bike all over the place, doing Jiu jitsu at a famous Jiu Jitsu studio in Torrance (which is still really close to LA) that's both well known but really a local hometown jiu jitsu club considering the Gracies have lived here long before they became famous.
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Rican
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
July 17, 2011 - HHHe called it
Posts: 16,565
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Post by Rican on May 9, 2014 14:53:30 GMT -5
oh no, free chocolate - punk has it so tough. cry my a river dickwad I completely disagree with the sentiment here but the phrasing made me legit laugh my ass off for some reason.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 9, 2014 14:59:42 GMT -5
So this woman is another ex-girlfriend?
Do you have to sleep with CM Punk to be his friend if you're a woman or something?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 9, 2014 15:10:31 GMT -5
When are we as a society going to stop treating celebrities like they're a part of a human game of Pokémon Snap? I always wanted to see what would happen if I just started taking pictures of random people, everywhere they went, following them to their house, banging on the door and begging for autographs... I'd seem like a completely insane person. So why is that acceptable behavior when it comes to celebrities? I just don't get it.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 9, 2014 15:12:26 GMT -5
I have a rule - if people want to make a lot of money out of exposure then they take the exposure. You can't want money for a job that involves wanting more and more people to see you then moan when people want to see you at a time that does not suit you.
A Paramedic on a TV documentary being followed everywhere is out of hand and wrong but a pro wrestler whose job was to make more and more people watch him moaning when people want to see him is pathetic.
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Post by Hurbster on May 9, 2014 15:13:44 GMT -5
Wonder how long it will take him to find his smile again ?
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