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Post by Deleted on Aug 28, 2014 19:05:21 GMT -5
I mean...when I go out, I like to look nice (and frankly, attractive to possible mates) while wearing something comfortable. Why should it be any different for girls? SLUT
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Post by Magic knows Black Lives Matter on Aug 28, 2014 19:10:03 GMT -5
I mean...when I go out, I like to look nice (and frankly, attractive to possible mates) while wearing something comfortable. Why should it be any different for girls? SLUT Don't hate me cause you ain't me, sweetie.
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Post by Long A, Short A on Aug 28, 2014 19:31:34 GMT -5
I know I'm late to the party, but my take: You should dress in a way that shows a little self respect regardless of how you look. No one has a right to stare at you no matter what you wear, doing that is just plain rude or creepy. But, if you dress a certain way people will automatically judge you or stare at you. If you choose to dress in a way that will draw stares or judgments don't complain when those things come to you. In making the choice of how you dress you also accept the benefits/consequences of that choice, same with any other action in your life. Dave Chapelle (above) nailed it perfectly. IF you dress/conduct yourself like you are successful/self respecting people will treat you as such. If you dress trashy or slutty and people treat you like one, don't complain. This post smells a lot like respectability politics and that type of stuff doesn't smell good.
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Post by HMARK Center on Aug 28, 2014 20:08:24 GMT -5
A lot of this comes down to the type of stuff parents have to wrestle with when they have young daughters going off to college or something.
Harassment, sexual violence, and rape are real things. They exist, and they won't vanish overnight. It's tough to blame a parent if, when their daughter goes off on her own, they do their best to tell her "there are bad people out there, people who will harass you, hurt you, or attack you for no good reason at all. Please, be careful."
However, there is a clear difference between that, and directly or indirectly telling a young woman (or any woman, really) that THEY are the ones responsible for whatever happens if they go out in public wearing an outfit somebody considers risque or revealing...a standard that, mind you, is hardly universal, as it varies greatly from culture to culture, community to community.
As a scientific principle, this doesn't hold up; the responsibility in such a circumstance, lies with the person who initiates the interaction, or begins the conversation and/or is the one doing the overt staring.
Male or female, people are allowed to wear whatever they want; as individuals, we are also allowed, rightly or wrongly, to look at, admire, judge, or whatever else people wearing whatever they want...so long as we keep it to ourselves. That's not to say a guy can't hit on a woman at a bar, obviously, but there are ways to do it that don't require creeping somebody out with leers or lewd comments.
Honestly, it's that simple. Looking is natural. Creeping is not. Some folks might have different perceptions of what they see as looking or creeping, but that's the way it goes. Be respectful, keep any dick-ish comments to yourself, and it's basically fine.
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Post by Kevin Hamilton on Aug 28, 2014 22:36:54 GMT -5
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Post by Zaq "That Guy" Buzzkill on Aug 29, 2014 0:21:11 GMT -5
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Johnny Flamingo
Hank Scorpio
Killing the business one post at a time
Posts: 6,477
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Post by Johnny Flamingo on Aug 29, 2014 2:06:27 GMT -5
I know I'm late to the party, but my take: You should dress in a way that shows a little self respect regardless of how you look. No one has a right to stare at you no matter what you wear, doing that is just plain rude or creepy. But, if you dress a certain way people will automatically judge you or stare at you. If you choose to dress in a way that will draw stares or judgments don't complain when those things come to you. In making the choice of how you dress you also accept the benefits/consequences of that choice, same with any other action in your life. Dave Chapelle (above) nailed it perfectly. IF you dress/conduct yourself like you are successful/self respecting people will treat you as such. If you dress trashy or slutty and people treat you like one, don't complain. This post smells a lot like respectability politics and that type of stuff doesn't smell good. I did not mean for it to sound like that. To put it in different (or simpler) terms. There are some streets and areas of town I simply will not travel to after dark. Main reason is that by doing that I take a risk that something will happen. It isn't right that I would have to fear for my life in these areas, but unfortunately there are some bad people on this earth. Same thing with how you dress. Dressing a certain way does carry certain risks. People should be able to dress in what they feel comfortable in. Unfortunately, there are people in this world that are bad and are looking to start trouble. Basic thing is to dress and act in a way that you protect yourself from these things. Know your area and surroundings and act (and dress) in ways that will keep you safe. Also know that if you are going on a job interview you have to dress how THEY want you to. When interviewed for my current job I wore a suit and tie. A guy ahead of me wore blue jeans and a t shirt. My boss told me that they immediately decided not to hire the guy based on his dress. I personally have multiple tats, I keep those hidden at work. The way I dress around my house and with my friends is not the way I dress all the time. I used to be a teacher. We called a parent in for a parent-teacher conference. The parent showed up wearing a fishnet shirt and some VERY short shorts. With the shirt she was wearing her bra/breasts were very visible and her butt was hanging out the bottom of her shorts, which is not appropriate attire to wear to a school. She was very offended when we asked her to leave because of her clothing. Point being that you have to know your surroundings and dress accordingly and anyone with any kind of sense should know not to dress like that when going to a school. In short, be smart and be safe. Reality is that in the real world people will judge you, people will have unfair expectations and people will use anything they can against you. That isn't me bring up "respectable politics", its me being honest about what I have experienced working for almost 10 years in the business world to support my family and from myself making a lot of mistakes along the way. Most of the standards piss me off, sometimes you just have to suck it up and pick and choose your battles wisely.
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Toates Madhackrviper
King Koopa
Is owed an Admin life-debt.
This avatar is so far out of date I might as well stick with it forever now.
Posts: 10,723
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Post by Toates Madhackrviper on Aug 29, 2014 2:28:20 GMT -5
I'm not even going to touch this one probably, I mean unless I decide to read this thread later and see a particular post that so infuriates me that I decide to say something. But I did want to say... ...oh boy, we're in for a long thread, aren't we. Don't let Michael Coello, HMARK, or Andrew is Good see this thread. I am SO offended that I was left out of this. If I'm not yet known for my five paragraph essay social justice rants YET, what is the point of anything?
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Post by Ash Kingston on Aug 29, 2014 6:28:03 GMT -5
I'd imagine a lot of it has to do with the fact that it's late August, and their chances to wear these clothes (without feeling cold) are dwindling away as we get closer to the start of Autumn. In addition, it could be a comfort thing, or just wanting to look good. Although it does depend on where your limit on "chubbiness" is. Like, are we talking a muffin top, or a full out "Jim Neidhart when he wrestled Jay Lethal on Impact a few years back" gut?
Also, I haven't read this topic, and part of me thinks I shouldn't.
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mcstoklasa
Hank Scorpio
Sigs/Avatars cannot exceed 1MB
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Post by mcstoklasa on Aug 29, 2014 8:46:09 GMT -5
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khali
Dennis Stamp
Posts: 4,578
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Post by khali on Aug 29, 2014 9:42:31 GMT -5
It's been said before, but needs to be said again: women get stared and ogled at no matter what they wear. Here's an example.
I have a female friend who oftentimes, while waiting for the bus to to go work, wears the most inconspicuous outfit possible. She wears baggy jeans and a baggy hoodie with the hood pulled up. There's nothing revealing or provocative about it. In fact, you cannot see anything at all aside from a small part of her face. Still, dressed like that she has been ogled at, honked at and directly approached and propositioned for sex.
You can frame the argument "she dressed for attention so it should be expected!" all you want, but the fact of the matter is that women get ogled and accosted no matter what they wear.
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agent817
Fry's dog Seymour
Doesn't Know Whose Ring It Is
Posts: 21,164
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Post by agent817 on Aug 29, 2014 10:20:46 GMT -5
Someone please delete or lock this thread. I regret even starting it to begin with.
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