Is it safe to say the TNA section isn't feeling Havok?

[Emmet Russell]

Oct 14, 2014 0:54:42 GMT -5 Jedi-El of Tomorrow said:

Oct 13, 2014 19:25:24 GMT -5 Emmet Russell said:

TNA has done a terrible job covering up Havoks flaws. A mobster character should be just that: a monster. Instead she had a 50/50 brawl with Gail almost immediately and her lustre was lost. Her simple debut destroying Taryn and Gail was the best she has looked because it made her look strong and dominant, easily destroying the champion and number one contender. Flash forward a month and she's having a back-and-forth match with VELVET SKY! That's complete garbage.

Indeed, the battle royal should have been Havok killing Knockouts dead. Instead the battle royal goes on to long, and Havok winds up selling for Rebel and Velvet. The match should have lasted 5 minutes tops, with Havok destroying everyone. Then there's the even brawl, and how she won the title. An injured Gail Kim got in way too much offense against Havok. That's not how you make a monster. I'd also just like to say, I've been saying this for awhile.

TNA just doesn't know how to make a monster anymore. They knew how to do it with Kong, but that's it.

They've ruined her at this point and it only took a month. They rushed her to the top of the division, beating the best wrestler they have, and now have her selling for the likes of Velvet because she's all they have left.

Add in the fact that she's ratings death and not any good, and you've got yourself a transitional champion at best for one of the worst divisions in wrestling.

There's no one in the division to carry her to decent matches now Gail is gone. Taryn and Madison and Angelina had their best work against Gail because of her abilities to bring out the best in them. None of them are able to carry someone as sloppy as Havok.

They need to hire some more women and fast, or just kill the division all together -- it's worthless at the moment and that's a real shame.

[Deleted]

She's the exact opposite of a stiff worker in TNA. Her strikes are so overly worked it actually looks kinda stupid, probably told to do that I guess. I get that they're trying to keep her from hurting people but it has gone way too far.

If she did that kick to the stomach she does but aimed it at an infant's eye, it MIGHT make the baby blink. Sometimes.

[jimmyjames]

Oct 13, 2014 18:05:47 GMT -5 Crappler El 0 M said:

I've enjoyed Havok in TNA, from her look to her match with Gail Kim. I kind of like the partially shaved head and gas mask as well as the facepaint. So there's at least one fan of her in TNA.

I never saw her on the indies and can't compare her TNA work to anything else she's done.

Same here. The problem is that TNA knowing how great Awesome Kong was and everything connected to her , the buildup, the character, and her title reign, are obviously trying to do the dame thing with Havok, but in a condensed manner. It's like they know they only have a couple of months left so they're going to ram everything into one month. There's also the fact that the Knockouts division is a complete shell of it's self compared to Kong's run, that going over the likes of Gail Kim (leaving), Velvet Skye, 2014 Angelina Love, Madison Rayne, Taryn Terell, and Rebel (briefly) isn't really that impressive, then to actually have her struggle with them really makes her look weak.

[Celgress]

Oct 13, 2014 14:13:00 GMT -5 @jinxed said:

My only problem is she decided to join the KOs at a time it is filled with overrated nothings and less than nothings. She could be Ric Flair in there but these people are less than El Gigante.

sadly, agreed

[OVO 40 hunched over like he 80]

So just watched highlights from her match with Velvet...the finish man, the Japanese booed them out of the building, those fans are always respectful they don't care if you're good or bad, they just care if you give it your all, only on 3 occasions have I heard the Japanese fans shit on a match.
1- Dustin Runnels f***ing up a top rope elbow.
2- A Nasty Boys match from all japan.
3- Havok vs Velvet.

I hope this one incident do not hurt her on the long term as far as getting booked after TNA. Let this be a lesson for the comitee of only putting her in the ring with someone that can help her put a decent match.

[Talent Name]

Honestly the TNA section isn't really feeling TNA lately

[DjZonk]

I'm not feeling her. She is supposed to look like a fierce woman, but she doesn't have the structure of say Chyna or Beth, she just looks like a slightly large woman who could do with eating healthier. The theme music is corny. The whole presentation is a big swing and a miss.

TNA has done an AMAZING job of making some female stars in the past, or bringing out their strengths and presenting them in an awesome way. But this isn't one of those times.

[Sephiroth]

Havok needs to either
A. have short, sweet matches with a lot of high impact moves

B. be in hardcore style matches were table and chair spots can keep the crowd WOWed

or

C. be working with opponents who can help cover her weaknesses in the ring.

[OVO 40 hunched over like he 80]

Oct 14, 2014 21:16:57 GMT -5 Sephiroth said:

Havok needs to either
A. have short, sweet matches with a lot of high impact moves

B. be in hardcore style matches were table and chair spots can keep the crowd WOWed

or

C. be working with opponents who can help cover her weaknesses in the ring.

There's no one else that can help her out in those scenarios, maybe Taryn but she can't work with her everytime, they can't afford Gail anymore, it's not Havok's fault that the rest of the division sucks, could you imagine her 3 years ago against Mickie, Tara, ODB, or anyone of the real lady wrestlers?

[El Cokehead del Knife Fight]

Oct 14, 2014 22:33:23 GMT -5 OVO 40 hunched over like he 80 said:

Oct 14, 2014 21:16:57 GMT -5 Sephiroth said:

Havok needs to either
A. have short, sweet matches with a lot of high impact moves

B. be in hardcore style matches were table and chair spots can keep the crowd WOWed

or

C. be working with opponents who can help cover her weaknesses in the ring.

There's no one else that can help her out in those scenarios, maybe Taryn but she can't work with her everytime, they can't afford Gail anymore, it's not Havok's fault that the rest of the division sucks, could you imagine her 3 years ago against Mickie, Tara, ODB, or anyone of the real lady wrestlers?

Can you imagine her working with the 2009 knockout roster? Now that would be good because they'd actually have people that she can work with.

[Deleted]

I thought she was pretty decent against Madison last night. Didn't see the Velvet Sky deal.

She's a lot better than Lady Topper, but not on Kong's level.

[A Platypus Rave is Correct]

Oct 16, 2014 9:57:35 GMT -5 @lovehater said:

I thought she was pretty decent against Madison last night. Didn't see the Velvet Sky deal.

She's a lot better than Lady Topper, but not on Kong's level.

Being better than Lei'd Tapa isn't exactly difficult.

[SCCB Was Told To Do Steroids]

This is how "this business" can drive a talent crazy:

On the indy circuit, she gets praised for "having it". She was green, but that's what working in the indies is for, the chance to hone one's craft. The promoters, I'm sure, told her to be herself, and don't look back.

Then, after one --maybe two-- minor forgivable incidents, she is labelled as "unsafe" and "green". Now, guess what the female "Next Big Thing" has in her head..."I have to be safe, so I don't kill these girls and ruin my spot."

Last night's match was better, but it was obvious that she did not want to kill Rayne with every move. Add the continuing awkwardness of the six sided ring and, there you go.

If the other KOs weren't petite sticks, it wouldn't look as badly. Imagine if Havok were in the ring with Paige, Natty, or Kong. Aesthetically, it would look more even. Those women being a little stockier, they might be able to take more punishment.

She'll find her way, especially if they work with her. If they can convince ODB or Knuckles to work with her for the immediate future, it might help.

[Mr PONYMANIA Mr Jenzie]

if it hasn't been said already by someone in this thread I WILL .....

yes
yes i want to FEEL havok

then get splattered

[Brandon Walsh is Insane.]

She's the most talked about person in the TNA section... Pretty sure she has fans. Since there are more people and a lot of threads about her, you'll also have a lot of detractors.

[Woo]

Oct 13, 2014 18:00:50 GMT -5 Emmet Russell said:

 She was in there with Gail Kim, the best female wrestling has to offer

Like seriously?!! Do you watch womens wrestling a lot?

Just a few women who are better:
Madison Eagles
Kana
Ayako Hamada
Athena
Cheerleader Melissa
Hikuru Shida
Nicole Matthews
Evie
Kay Lee Ray
Nikki Storm
Tomoka Nakagawa
Hiroyo Matsumoto
Ray
Leon
Syuri
Saree
Mia Yim
Kellie Skater
Arisa Nakajima
Lufisto
Mayumi Ozaki
Becky Lynch

Most of the best womens wrestlers are currently in Chicago wrestling at Shimmer as we speak.

I feel the same about Paige - people overrate her so much because she's the daughter of a wrestler (who I must admit is quite bad-ass) and looks "hot". Her time in WWE has been dreadful, full of nothing matches and terrible promos, yet people still love her? I don't understand. She's no better than any of the other divas they have but because she wrestled on the indies in Shimmer it makes her good? no
it doesn't! her terrible faux-lesbian gimmick that appeals to creepy fan-boys is even worse. It's cringeworthy.

Again everything in this paragraph is wrong.

First of all if you've been flown half way round the world to wrestle in Shimmer then yes, it does make you good. Very good. Why would Dave Prazak, a man who pays to fly the best wrestlers in the world to Chicago twice a year, spend all that money on someone who isn't good? Why didn't he save money by hiring any great American female at a much cheaper price?

Britani Knight went toe to toe with some of the best wrestlers in the world in her eight Shimmer matches and all of them have been better than anything the WWE divas have done in years. The only Divas that come close to her are Becky Lynch, Emma, Bayley, Nattie Neidhart (all Shimmer alumni), AJ and Charlotte, who let's not forget was trained by Sara Del Rey (from Shimmer).

That said regarding Havok, something with her isn't clicking with me with her in Shimmer at the moment. It could be that she sells too much, like Melanie Cruise, or it could be that she lost some speed since she's bulked up? Her matches with Serena Deeb were good, but I think Deeb is one of the very best American wrestlers.

[El Cokehead del Knife Fight]

Oct 18, 2014 20:03:28 GMT -5 Woo said:

Oct 13, 2014 18:00:50 GMT -5 Emmet Russell said:

 She was in there with Gail Kim, the best female wrestling has to offer

Like seriously?!! Do you watch womens wrestling a lot?


Most of the best womens wrestlers are currently in Chicago wrestling at Shimmer as we speak.

To be fair, I think he meant on a bigger stage than SHIMMER. It's still wrong of course.

[Woo]

Oct 18, 2014 20:38:20 GMT -5 El Cokehead del Knife Fight said:

Oct 18, 2014 20:03:28 GMT -5 Woo said:

Like seriously?!! Do you watch womens wrestling a lot?


Most of the best womens wrestlers are currently in Chicago wrestling at Shimmer as we speak.

To be fair, I think he meant on a bigger stage than SHIMMER. It's still wrong of course.

Fair enough. I assume he means currently only, but in that case you'd still have to include Cheerleader Melissa, Ayako Hamada, Sarah Stock who all wrestled in TNA and are still around (sort-of in Stock's case), plus a few of the NXT girls.

[Emmet Russell]

Oct 18, 2014 20:38:20 GMT -5 El Cokehead del Knife Fight said:

Oct 18, 2014 20:03:28 GMT -5 Woo said:

Like seriously?!! Do you watch womens wrestling a lot?


Most of the best womens wrestlers are currently in Chicago wrestling at Shimmer as we speak.

To be fair, I think he meant on a bigger stage than SHIMMER. It's still wrong of course.

I don't think it's wrong at all. I'm sure if Gail was given time like the women in Shimmer are given, she'd be praised more than the others. She's amazing. Certainly the best mainstream wrestling has to offer.

[Emmet Russell]

Oct 18, 2014 20:41:40 GMT -5 Woo said:

Oct 18, 2014 20:38:20 GMT -5 El Cokehead del Knife Fight said:

To be fair, I think he meant on a bigger stage than SHIMMER. It's still wrong of course.

Fair enough. I assume he means currently only, but in that case you'd still have to include Cheerleader Melissa, Ayako Hamada, Sarah Stock who all wrestled in TNA and are still around (sort-of in Stock's case), plus a few of the NXT girls.

Cheerleader Melissa is really good, but she's not as good as Gail. Hamada isn't as diverse and Sarita was good in her time there and very impressive, but I still find Gail a much better performer overall.