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Post by "Trickster Dogg" James Jesse on Mar 23, 2017 19:53:01 GMT -5
I think the very idea of Batman having a car is stupid because he's supposed to be a ninja. The Batmobile, an incredibly noisy, expensive, and impractical means of commuting to and from Wayne Manor, breaks the logic of that very idea. Guns on the Batmobile is simply stupid on top of stupid.
EDIT: And let's not forget that The Dark Knight, most people's favourite Batman movie, has guns on the Batpod, which itself is simply the front end of the Tumbler. BCatwoman in TDKR even uses the guns on the Batpod to blast Bane away.
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Post by The Heartbreak TWERK on Mar 23, 2017 19:56:08 GMT -5
Guns on the Batmobile is simply stupid on top of stupid. I don't necessarily completely agree, because I like Batman having his car, but yeah, that. Batman shouldn't use guns. He shouldn't, because he wouldn't and anyone who writes him to do so has a fundamental lack of understanding of what makes Batman the character he is. If you want edgelord Batman with guns, go read New 52 Red Hood and the Outlaws. Edit: I forgot about Nolan's guns on the Tumbler/Batpod. Nolan is just as wrong as Burton and Snyder.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 23, 2017 19:57:52 GMT -5
The more I see of JL, the more I'm feeling it. I'm definitely interested to see what the trailer on Saturday looks like.
If nothing else, the potential for the Aquaman movie coming out of JL is shining bright for me.
I honestly don't care what one particular interpretation of Batman would/wouldn't do. The character's changed so much it's silly to play semantics now. I'm interested in what THIS Batman will do.
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Post by Pooh Carlson on Mar 23, 2017 20:01:48 GMT -5
What about the panel where the bat tank fires rubber bullets? And how is the machine guns on the batmobile from Tim Burton's Batman Zack Snyder's fault? Or the weaponry aboard the bat jet thing on Dark Knight Rises? Were rubber bullets used to kill the Waynes? Batman shouldn't have any kind of gun in any kind of medium, be it a plane, or car, or the one thing he's always sworn never to use, a damn gun. Mass Murderer Batman is the worst interpretation of Batman in any form outside of Bruce Timm's creepy Batman loves Batgirl fan fiction. Tim Burton was wrong, and Zack Snyder is sure as hell wrong. www.youtube.com/watch?v=psVIG7YvdjM&t=110sChristopher Nolan is wrong, too, then. I'm so sick of this narrative that Batman doesn't kill and people are sooooooooo angry at Zack Snyder for something that has happened in almost every incarnation of Batman. Even the games have bullets and you can run over enemies, just because they have a line of dialogue saying that they only "stun" the enemies and not kill them doesn't make them exempt. Batman kills. All the time. Everybody needs to get over it.
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Post by The Heartbreak TWERK on Mar 23, 2017 20:07:30 GMT -5
Were rubber bullets used to kill the Waynes? Batman shouldn't have any kind of gun in any kind of medium, be it a plane, or car, or the one thing he's always sworn never to use, a damn gun. Mass Murderer Batman is the worst interpretation of Batman in any form outside of Bruce Timm's creepy Batman loves Batgirl fan fiction. Tim Burton was wrong, and Zack Snyder is sure as hell wrong. www.youtube.com/watch?v=psVIG7YvdjM&t=110sChristopher Nolan is wrong, too, then. I'm so sick of this narrative that Batman doesn't kill and people are sooooooooo angry at Zack Snyder for something that has happened in almost every incarnation of Batman. Even the games have bullets and you can run over enemies, just because they have a line of dialogue saying that they only "stun" the enemies and not kill them doesn't make them exempt. Batman kills. All the time. Everybody needs to get over it. I don't need to do anything. Killer Batman sucks. BvS sucks and it shouldn't have been done the way it was.
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Post by Limity (BLM) on Mar 23, 2017 20:44:37 GMT -5
What about the panel where the bat tank fires rubber bullets? And how is the machine guns on the batmobile from Tim Burton's Batman Zack Snyder's fault? Or the weaponry aboard the bat jet thing on Dark Knight Rises? Were rubber bullets used to kill the Waynes? Batman shouldn't have any kind of gun in any kind of medium, be it a plane, or car, or the one thing he's always sworn never to use, a damn gun. Mass Murderer Batman is the worst interpretation of Batman in any form outside of Bruce Timm's creepy Batman loves Batgirl fan fiction. Tim Burton was wrong, and Zack Snyder is sure as hell wrong. Batman shouldn't have any kind of gun in any kind of medium on any kind of vehicle...according to you. Except the gun that shot the rubber bullets, or maybe the gun he used to shoot Darkseid...but no doubt you'll have some manufactured argument to disqualify that instance.
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Post by The Heartbreak TWERK on Mar 23, 2017 21:00:53 GMT -5
Were rubber bullets used to kill the Waynes? Batman shouldn't have any kind of gun in any kind of medium, be it a plane, or car, or the one thing he's always sworn never to use, a damn gun. Mass Murderer Batman is the worst interpretation of Batman in any form outside of Bruce Timm's creepy Batman loves Batgirl fan fiction. Tim Burton was wrong, and Zack Snyder is sure as hell wrong. Batman shouldn't have any kind of gun in any kind of medium on any kind of vehicle...according to you. Except the gun that shot the rubber bullets, or maybe the gun he used to shoot Darkseid...but no doubt you'll have some manufactured argument to disqualify that instance. Nothing manufactured, he called it a one time exception, and he was willing to pay for it with his life. DC shenanigans led to him not dying, but that's that. Batman should not have a gun or use a gun. If he does, he should die after using it and I have no use for Bruce Wayne being dead.
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Post by Limity (BLM) on Mar 23, 2017 21:07:14 GMT -5
Batman shouldn't have any kind of gun in any kind of medium on any kind of vehicle...according to you. Except the gun that shot the rubber bullets, or maybe the gun he used to shoot Darkseid...but no doubt you'll have some manufactured argument to disqualify that instance. Nothing manufactured, he called it a one time exception, and he was willing to pay for it with his life. DC shenanigans led to him not dying, but that's that. Batman should not have a gun or use a gun. If he does, he should die after using it and I have no use for Bruce Wayne being dead. Sure thing. There's no pinning you down as you'll keep absorbing each time you're proven wrong with an altered argument and justification. So it went from Batman should never ever ever ever ever ever ever ever use a gun ever ever ever ever ever, to now it's okay if he...dies. I'd point out that Batman also used a sonic gun on Superman in TDKR, but then you'll probably say it doesn't count because reasons.
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Post by The Heartbreak TWERK on Mar 23, 2017 21:24:54 GMT -5
Nothing manufactured, he called it a one time exception, and he was willing to pay for it with his life. DC shenanigans led to him not dying, but that's that. Batman should not have a gun or use a gun. If he does, he should die after using it and I have no use for Bruce Wayne being dead. Sure thing. There's no pinning you down as you'll keep absorbing each time you're proven wrong with an altered argument and justification. So it went from Batman should never ever ever ever ever ever ever ever use a gun ever ever ever ever ever, to now it's okay if he...dies. I'd point out that Batman also used a sonic gun on Superman in TDKR, but then you'll probably say it doesn't count because reasons. I'll point to where I said that rubber bullets didn't kill the Waynes, neither did a sonic gun. Either way, I stand by what I've said and I'm not moving away from it. You can keep trying to get me to say it's okay that Batman kills or uses a gun with actual bullets. It's not okay.
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Post by Limity (BLM) on Mar 23, 2017 21:35:57 GMT -5
Sure thing. There's no pinning you down as you'll keep absorbing each time you're proven wrong with an altered argument and justification. So it went from Batman should never ever ever ever ever ever ever ever use a gun ever ever ever ever ever, to now it's okay if he...dies. I'd point out that Batman also used a sonic gun on Superman in TDKR, but then you'll probably say it doesn't count because reasons. I'll point to where I said that rubber bullets didn't kill the Waynes, neither did a sonic gun. Either way, I stand by what I've said and I'm not moving away from it. You can keep trying to get me to say it's okay that Batman kills or uses a gun with actual bullets. It's not okay. And I'll point to where you said Batman shouldn't use ANY KIND OF GUN. I haven't once tried to make you say Batman should or shouldn't kill. That has nothing to do with the tangent this thread has recently gone off on. You are yet again trying to pivot away from your disproven arguments. Have your post to post contradictions, your eye rolling anti Snyder vitriol; the last thing I want to do is derail the thread further or make the mods yell at us.
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Post by Pooh Carlson on Mar 23, 2017 22:12:23 GMT -5
Guns on the Batmobile is simply stupid on top of stupid. I don't necessarily completely agree, because I like Batman having his car, but yeah, that. Batman shouldn't use guns. He shouldn't, because he wouldn't and anyone who writes him to do so has a fundamental lack of understanding of what makes Batman the character he is. If you want edgelord Batman with guns, go read New 52 Red Hood and the Outlaws. Edit: I forgot about Nolan's guns on the Tumbler/Batpod. Nolan is just as wrong as Burton and Snyder. You managed to post this in the time I was replying to you with the kill count video. So I'll give you props for being consistent in your opinion of who is wrong in the face of evidence. I really don't have anything against you personally. It just seems common practice these days to hate on BvS and hate on Snyder for "Batman killing" even though he's done it literally in every movie he's ever been in. A lot of people have revisionist memories and act like he never did in the Nolan movies, even though "no killing" was a huge part of that series.
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riseofsetian1981
King Koopa
"I met him fifteen years ago. I was told there was nothing left."
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Post by riseofsetian1981 on Mar 23, 2017 22:16:12 GMT -5
You mean how every Batmobile has shot bullets? Yeah can't believe it. And it's all Zack Snyder's fault. Show me the Batmobile shooting bullets in the Nolan trilogy, show me the main timeline comic Batmobile that shoots bullets. Yes, the state of the DCEU is Zack Snyder's fault. Seem to remember the tumbler in the Nolan trilogy shooting bullets and explosives. Rubber bullets don't cause other vehicles to explode or cause massive Michael Bay like explosions in The Dark Knight Rises.
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Post by The Heartbreak TWERK on Mar 23, 2017 22:41:56 GMT -5
I don't necessarily completely agree, because I like Batman having his car, but yeah, that. Batman shouldn't use guns. He shouldn't, because he wouldn't and anyone who writes him to do so has a fundamental lack of understanding of what makes Batman the character he is. If you want edgelord Batman with guns, go read New 52 Red Hood and the Outlaws. Edit: I forgot about Nolan's guns on the Tumbler/Batpod. Nolan is just as wrong as Burton and Snyder. You managed to post this in the time I was replying to you with the kill count video. So I'll give you props for being consistent in your opinion of who is wrong in the face of evidence. I really don't have anything against you personally. It just seems common practice these days to hate on BvS and hate on Snyder for "Batman killing" even though he's done it literally in every movie he's ever been in. A lot of people have revisionist memories and act like he never did in the Nolan movies, even though "no killing" was a huge part of that series. Again, if I wanted Killer Batman, I'd read the old RHatO. I don't want Killer Batman. I want iconic Batman, and it seems that the general public wants the same. Snyder would be wise to step away after this movie.
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riseofsetian1981
King Koopa
"I met him fifteen years ago. I was told there was nothing left."
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Post by riseofsetian1981 on Mar 23, 2017 22:50:41 GMT -5
You managed to post this in the time I was replying to you with the kill count video. So I'll give you props for being consistent in your opinion of who is wrong in the face of evidence. I really don't have anything against you personally. It just seems common practice these days to hate on BvS and hate on Snyder for "Batman killing" even though he's done it literally in every movie he's ever been in. A lot of people have revisionist memories and act like he never did in the Nolan movies, even though "no killing" was a huge part of that series. Again, if I wanted Killer Batman, I'd read the old RHatO. I don't want Killer Batman. I want iconic Batman, and it seems that the general public wants the same. Snyder would be wise to step away after this movie. But what do you want him to fight Parademons with then? Gadgets are all fine and good, however, I don't see the issue with him having guns on the batmobile or shooting Parademons. As I said, Nolan's Batman had guns on his batmobile, so did Burton, and even in some of the games there were guns on the batmobile. It's really not that big of a deal in my opinion.
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Bub (BLM)
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Fed. Up.
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Post by Bub (BLM) on Mar 23, 2017 22:54:34 GMT -5
Again, if I wanted Killer Batman, I'd read the old RHatO. I don't want Killer Batman. I want iconic Batman, and it seems that the general public wants the same. Snyder would be wise to step away after this movie. But what do you want him to fight Parademons with then? Gadgets are all fine and good, however, I don't see the issue with him having guns on the batmobile or shooting Parademons. As I said, Nolan's Batman had guns on his batmobile, so did Burton, and even in some of the games there were guns on the batmobile. It's really not that big of a deal in my opinion. Nolan's Batman also very clearly didn't kill. It was referenced multiple times in all 3 films. And the only thing the guns on his vehicles were ever used for in those movies were blowing obstructions out of the way. He never fired towards people.
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riseofsetian1981
King Koopa
"I met him fifteen years ago. I was told there was nothing left."
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Post by riseofsetian1981 on Mar 23, 2017 22:57:49 GMT -5
But what do you want him to fight Parademons with then? Gadgets are all fine and good, however, I don't see the issue with him having guns on the batmobile or shooting Parademons. As I said, Nolan's Batman had guns on his batmobile, so did Burton, and even in some of the games there were guns on the batmobile. It's really not that big of a deal in my opinion. Nolan's Batman also very clearly didn't kill. It was referenced multiple times in all 3 films. And the only thing the guns on his vehicles were ever used for in those movies were blowing obstructions out of the way. He never fired towards people. Batman killing has been done in the comics before. It's quite possible that Superman sacrificing himself has made Batman more hopeful and caused him to stray away from his killing spree in these recent films. As for the Nolan trilogy? He did kill Harvey Dent when he tackled him to the ground, he let Ra's Al Ghul die, and he caused the death of Talia. He also fired several explosives towards Talia too in The Dark Knight Rises. He may've not gone full murderer in the trilogy. But to make it seem like he didn't kill at all or caused the deaths of others is just wrong.
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Post by xCompackx on Mar 23, 2017 23:01:16 GMT -5
Show me the Batmobile shooting bullets in the Nolan trilogy, show me the main timeline comic Batmobile that shoots bullets. Yes, the state of the DCEU is Zack Snyder's fault. Seem to remember the tumbler in the Nolan trilogy shooting bullets and explosives. Rubber bullets don't cause other vehicles to explode or cause massive Michael Bay like explosions in The Dark Knight Rises. I don't remember The Dark Knight Rises so I can't comment there, but I think the Tumbler/Batpod has only used bullets/explosives to clear obstacles and stuff in the first two. I don't personally have a problem with the Batmobile being armed as it'd be a little silly to purposefully have no method of defense. As far as having Batman kill, you really shouldn't need to change such a basic character trait to tell a good story. Sure, sometimes they bend it a bit too far to say it doesn't count ("I don't have to save you"; come on, he knew Ra's was going to die), but if you take away the central rule Batman follows, how do any of these stories happen? Why didn't Batman just kill Joker at the beginning to Arkham Asylum or the thousands of other times he's caught him? I don't know, it seems like an unnecessary way to justify making your film dark when it doesn't have to be.
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Post by The Heartbreak TWERK on Mar 23, 2017 23:02:45 GMT -5
Again, if I wanted Killer Batman, I'd read the old RHatO. I don't want Killer Batman. I want iconic Batman, and it seems that the general public wants the same. Snyder would be wise to step away after this movie. But what do you want him to fight Parademons with then? Gadgets are all fine and good, however, I don't see the issue with him having guns on the batmobile or shooting Parademons. As I said, Nolan's Batman had guns on his batmobile, so did Burton, and even in some of the games there were guns on the batmobile. It's really not that big of a deal in my opinion. Go read New 52 Justice League, the very first volume. Batman doesn't need guns to fight Parademons and it's lazy to just have him use them because "Hurr durr, aliens that don't look like people". Batman should not use guns.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 23, 2017 23:55:48 GMT -5
This is my theory on the arc. Batman started off as peaceful. Then The Joker killed Robin. Shortly after those events Batman vs. Superman happened where a disheartened Batman has bended his own rule because he knows Robin and others would still be alive if he have killed The Joker but to be fair The Joker might just got away every time in this universe. Superman's self sacrifice has restored Batman's faith.
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Post by A Platypus Rave is Correct on Mar 23, 2017 23:57:56 GMT -5
This is my theory on the arc. Batman started off as peaceful. Then The Joker killed Robin. Shortly after those events Batman vs. Superman happened where a disheartened Batman has bended his own rule because he knows Robin and others would still be alive if he have killed The Joker but to be fair The Joker might just got away every time in this universe. Superman's self sacrifice has restored Batman's faith. It ignores what was stated in Suicide Squad that in response for Joker killing Robin, Batman broke Joker's face and dumped him in prison. There is no way Joker should be alive in this universe. then again considering Joker in Suicide Squad I can understand why you'd want to ignore that movie >_>
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