Dub H
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I ❤ Aniki
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Post by Dub H on Jun 10, 2017 16:01:15 GMT -5
His first US title run during the first brand split though, he made all his challengers look like goobers. Odd given how Angle, Jericho and Big Show had gone above the call of duty to make Cena a star. Yeah pulverized the Smackdown Midcard something fierce, but I would argue the US Open Challenge was even worse. I'm sure Cena saw it as these guys getting a lift by rubbing elbows with him. I saw it as "Cena kicks out of every finisher in the company and then wins clean". But all those up-and-comers who are now stalled in the midcard probably didn't want it as bad as Cena did back in 2004 when he ran down everyone on the roster and then beat them clean, often in non-competitive matches. The ONLY good one was with neville Where he was going to hit the red arrow(the most protected finisher). And Rusev interferes.
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Chiral
Salacious Crumb
Posts: 74,408
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Post by Chiral on Jun 10, 2017 16:12:41 GMT -5
Remember those times Cena basically broke the fourth wall to dump on his opponents? Like the Del Rio "You're not really rich and those cars are rentals" business. And how most of the time those segments ended with Cena getting the last five minutes to shit on them while they get to stand there like a goof as he yells at them and then his music plays? I guess it's just them not operating on Cena's ultra elite level.
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Post by ________ has left the building on Jun 10, 2017 16:31:39 GMT -5
Just follow the Triple H playbook, John. Co-sign on the indy and international talent that the company brings in. Create a vanity promotion within WWE with Old Man Vince's money that is less about creating & grooming future stars for the main roster and more of building a kick ass toy collection. Before long, people will forgive you of your past burial sins and actually non ironically want you to run the company. Sounds like something Gail Kim should do instead of Cena Naw, Gail will continue murking females on Impact while people still call her one of the greatest female wrestlers. She buried more bodies than a Civil War grave digger but flies under the radar.
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WWEedy
Don Corleone
Posts: 1,320
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Post by WWEedy on Jun 10, 2017 16:33:27 GMT -5
Remember those times Cena basically broke the fourth wall to dump on his opponents? Like the Del Rio "You're not really rich and those cars are rentals" business. And how most of the time those segments ended with Cena getting the last five minutes to shit on them? I guess it's just them not operating on Cena's ultra elite level. Haha yeah exactly, f*** the other guy for never being given the same amount of spotlight and promo time that Cena had. And as far as breaking the fourth wall? Cena's such a boy scout that all they had was that he was a fake goody two shoes that held people down. Sadly all he had to do was HUSTLE LOYALTY RESPECT, NEVER GIVE UP make a wish granter the heck out of it and apparently that made it a-ok to, as I mentioned before, assasinate guys characters and gimmicks before CenaWinsLOL. I'm a fan of Cena as a worker, think he's great in the ring, but holy freaking moly.
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on Jun 10, 2017 16:34:09 GMT -5
Sounds like something Gail Kim should do instead of Cena Naw, Gail will continue murking females on Impact while people still call her one of the greatest female wrestlers. She buried more bodies than a Civil War grave digger but flies under the radar. Over 80% win percentage in her time on impact/TNA. Maybe if we keep bringing her up people will realize how dirty she is on that end.
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Post by angryfan on Jun 10, 2017 16:59:59 GMT -5
It is somewhat true. There were plenty of guys who faced Cena that I didn't give a shit about and most of those guys are either gone or on their way out. I don't think feuding with Cena is the career-killer that some people think it is. If that's the case, then would guys like Danielson, CM Punk, AJ Styles or Kevin Owens still be around? They were already established in the indies/world and maybe that's why Cena feels that way about the WWE-raised talent he faced. Psychologically that is both possible and exceptionally odd. I can see it in the WWWE bubble of "see, these guys got over, but you losers couldnt' cut it". Thing is the connection of "these guys survived because over time they were already over before they even came to the company, and were seasoned enough to make lemonade out of cow shit". But, as that would just be a "bing halls haw haww" bit for WWE, they wont' mention that part, so everyone is clumped together. So everyone together, right? Take a guy with 10 years at a job. Now mix in somebody with, let's say, 2 years where he worked in smaller stores. You think they'll be able to have the same reaction to the customers? YOu think they'll be able to think on their feet as well? Nope, not a chance in hell. But the argument from Cena is seemingly the blanket "they couldn't cut it" shit that says "If you can't react like I do after a decade on top, even if you've been out of developmetnal for six months, then it's your fault".
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Bub (BLM)
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Fed. Up.
Posts: 37,742
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Post by Bub (BLM) on Jun 10, 2017 18:59:27 GMT -5
It is somewhat true. There were plenty of guys who faced Cena that I didn't give a shit about and most of those guys are either gone or on their way out. I don't think feuding with Cena is the career-killer that some people think it is. If that's the case, then would guys like Danielson, CM Punk, AJ Styles or Kevin Owens still be around? They were already established in the indies/world and maybe that's why Cena feels that way about the WWE-raised talent he faced. Psychologically that is both possible and exceptionally odd. I can see it in the WWWE bubble of "see, these guys got over, but you losers couldnt' cut it". Thing is the connection of "these guys survived because over time they were already over before they even came to the company, and were seasoned enough to make lemonade out of cow shit". But, as that would just be a "bing halls haw haww" bit for WWE, they wont' mention that part, so everyone is clumped together. So everyone together, right? Take a guy with 10 years at a job. Now mix in somebody with, let's say, 2 years where he worked in smaller stores. You think they'll be able to have the same reaction to the customers? YOu think they'll be able to think on their feet as well? Nope, not a chance in hell. But the argument from Cena is seemingly the blanket "they couldn't cut it" shit that says "If you can't react like I do after a decade on top, even if you've been out of developmetnal for six months, then it's your fault". That's a good point. If you look at guys who survived after Cena feuds, it's always seasoned vets of the indys. Any time he feuds with a homegrown WWE developmental talent, he obliterates them and they have to completely rebuild from the ground up. Miz, Barrett, Wyatt, Rusev. It's not a coincidence.
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Post by Alice Syndrome on Jun 10, 2017 19:04:05 GMT -5
No, Cena. Plenty of people wanted to see that Miz match.
Noone wanted to see you win it.
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Xxcjb01xX [PIECE OF: SH-]
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Post by Xxcjb01xX [PIECE OF: SH-] on Jun 10, 2017 20:34:44 GMT -5
No, Cena. Plenty of people wanted to see that Miz match. Noone wanted to see you win it. I get the whole Mania Proposal thing, and I get Miz was being just as degrading to John, but the thing is everything Miz said had a fringe of Truth. Cena saying Miz never got anywhere without stealing others talents and moves, is ridiculous, because Wrestling is all about taking what others did before you and trying to make it your own. Him trying to call Miz a sellout and a ripoff, was unnecessary and only proceeded to bury Miz further in the loss, but AWWW LOOK AT HIM MARRYING NIKKI, what a smokescreen, and then the feud was dropped.
Same happened with Styles where he undermined his skill and talent until he won, and Owens, how about Alberto's "Lucky Kick"? Mysterio wins the belt and Cena wins it back in the same night? (Something some kid predicted on a Talk Show segment with Punk by the way that's how predictable Cena getting his shit back is) and lest we forget how he flat out buried the Wyatts three on one when he lost to Lesnar. To me that's Cena's biggest whiney bitch moment of his career, he took out getting squashed on other talents to "Rebound", when all it did was hurt Wyatt like well, everything else the booking ever did with him. It was the LEAST Cena could do dropping two wins to him like he did earlier this year to be frank.
And what a role model by the way. For how much they say Cena is a great one for kids there are so many instances where he isn't. Remember kids, if you lose, throw a f***ing hissy fit and demand rematches until you win, THEN be a good sport. The Make A Wish stuff I can't hate, but Cena's a pile of shit character wise especially if he's supposed to be the flag bearer for kids. And Roman's even worse in that regard too...
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Perd
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Posts: 32,100
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Post by Perd on Jun 10, 2017 20:46:09 GMT -5
If you play Cena's theme backwards, if says "I buried Raw".
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Post by Mighty Attack Tribble on Jun 10, 2017 20:49:15 GMT -5
And what a role model by the way. For how much they say Cena is a great one for kids there are so many instances where he isn't. Remember kids, if you lose, throw a f***ing hissy fit and demand rematches until you win, THEN be a good sport. The Make A Wish stuff I can't hate, but Cena's a pile of shit character wise especially if he's supposed to be the flag bearer for kids. And Roman's even worse in that regard too... It's no coincidence that that is pretty much Vince McMahon's outlook on life to a tee.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 10, 2017 21:42:01 GMT -5
Cena's been on top for 10 years and the company's TV has shed more viewers. Judging by the ratings decline and the reduced money for TV deals throughout the "Cena Era," one could draw the conclusion that Cena may have worked hard and at an Elite level, but actually hurt the company. The results simply aren't there. If I were talent that felt buried, I might bring that up to Cena. Don't get me wrong, I admire Cena. He has worked his ass off. He changed characters and he became more popular, however, he didn't spur a boom period. Sure, this isn't the New Generation Era but the company has a lot of soul searching to do before they negotiate their next deal with NBC/Universal. And if revenue from that deal drops, you can point the blame directly at Vince for not developing more stars. Cena should have been the Final Boss position after five or six years, not 10. You can't blame most of that on Cena as it is Vince. I think Vince's reliance on part-time like Lesnar and Goldberg actually hurt the company as much as Cena on top. While Vince threw money at guys who barely popped a rating, other wrestlers languished behind them, putting on great matches but not getting the right spot in the card. But the last few years has been some of the most profitable years for the WWE since The Attitude Era. Keep in mind that's mostly because of the Network but apparently their subscriptions have been strong, practically turned their development into a third brand with NXT, the few PPV buys they get are better than expected, they raise Wrestlemania tickets and travel packages prices every year and it's ticket sales are still strong, merch is still strong, etc. They set up so many revenue streams and the 3rd hour does bring the ratings average down but they make so much from the extra advertising on the 3rd hour and have more room for more in show advertising because of it. Ratings are going down on everything (Sports most notably NFL, TV Shows, Late Night Talk Shows, etc) with the exception for the NBA and the NHL Finals (not the playoffs that was down) but that was because they generated two strong markets in the finals. The one thing I forgot to mention was in the last report about merchandise it was reported that John Cena merch is still #1 by many Country Miles. All the other top merch guys are neck to neck but Cena is still way ahead at #1 despite now being a part timer. I get the argument that since WWE sells itself as more of a brand & America's past time rather than watch us for Stone Cold/The Rock/Hogan like in the past and they set themselves up with so many revenue streams they can afford taking risks by pushing new talent *cough *cough Jinder Mahal. But Cena is so ahead of everyone else in mainstream appeal. Realistically who do you see outside of Cena on the main roster has a realistic shot in Hollywood and compare runs with John Cena?
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Jun 10, 2017 21:51:52 GMT -5
Just follow the Triple H playbook, John. Co-sign on the indy and international talent that the company brings in. Create a vanity promotion within WWE with Old Man Vince's money that is less about creating & grooming future stars for the main roster and more of building a kick ass toy collection. Before long, people will forgive you of your past burial sins and actually non ironically want you to run the company. Don't forget being bullet proof by winning the 2016 Rumble, having a 3 month title run, and main eventing Wrestlemania against Roman Reigns. Shit I consider his 2016 Rumble win worse than the 2015 Rumble and just only above 2014 because that should of went to Daniel Bryan and WWE's skeezy way of marketing by not publicly saying DB was going to be in it so people were going to buy the PPV under false pretenses. The only statement they had was Daniel Bryan briefly saying he wasn't going to be in the match in a local radio interview few days before the match which had the usual "It's a work" or "He's working us" or "It's kayfabe" comments. But yeah that's power that people don't hate you for booking a vanity Wrestlemania main event against your pet project in Roman Reigns so you can say you both made Roman Reigns and wrestled in the highest attendant Wrestlemania in history. Those selfies have tons of power.
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Post by xCompackx on Jun 11, 2017 0:07:42 GMT -5
Remember those times Cena basically broke the fourth wall to dump on his opponents? Like the Del Rio "You're not really rich and those cars are rentals" business. And how most of the time those segments ended with Cena getting the last five minutes to shit on them while they get to stand there like a goof as he yells at them and then his music plays? I guess it's just them not operating on Cena's ultra elite level. This shit annoys me to no goddamn end. I don't need constant reminders that wrestling isn't legit nor do I care about whatever "insider" bullshit Cena spews in an attempt to make these feuds interesting.
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JoDaNa1281
Crow T. Robot
Jackie Daytona, Regular Human Bartender. #BLM
Posts: 41,015
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Post by JoDaNa1281 on Jun 11, 2017 2:59:41 GMT -5
Just follow the Triple H playbook, John. Co-sign on the indy and international talent that the company brings in. Create a vanity promotion within WWE with Old Man Vince's money that is less about creating & grooming future stars for the main roster and more of building a kick ass toy collection. Before long, people will forgive you of your past burial sins and actually non ironically want you to run the company. Don't forget being bullet proof by winning the 2016 Rumble, having a 3 month title run, and main eventing Wrestlemania against Roman Reigns. Shit I consider his 2016 Rumble win worse than the 2015 Rumble and just only above 2014 because that should of went to Daniel Bryan and WWE's skeezy way of marketing by not publicly saying DB was going to be in it so people were going to buy the PPV under false pretenses. The only statement they had was Daniel Bryan briefly saying he wasn't going to be in the match in a local radio interview few days before the match which had the usual "It's a work" or "He's working us" or "It's kayfabe" comments. But yeah that's power that people don't hate you for booking a vanity Wrestlemania main event against your pet project in Roman Reigns so you can say you both made Roman Reigns and wrestled in the highest attendant Wrestlemania in history. Those selfies have tons of power. I seem to remember quite a bit of people not liking that result, mainly because we could see where it was going a long while before it happened. Many people complained about Trips putting himself in the main event of "The Biggest Wrestlemania Everz!" & facing Roman, in what most of us thought was gonna be a terrible main event(and, it was), just to stroke his ego even more. Some people may give him a pass...sometimes, but he sure as hell ain't bullet proof. Also, many people see through the selfie stuff.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 11, 2017 3:04:40 GMT -5
Don't forget being bullet proof by winning the 2016 Rumble, having a 3 month title run, and main eventing Wrestlemania against Roman Reigns. Shit I consider his 2016 Rumble win worse than the 2015 Rumble and just only above 2014 because that should of went to Daniel Bryan and WWE's skeezy way of marketing by not publicly saying DB was going to be in it so people were going to buy the PPV under false pretenses. The only statement they had was Daniel Bryan briefly saying he wasn't going to be in the match in a local radio interview few days before the match which had the usual "It's a work" or "He's working us" or "It's kayfabe" comments. But yeah that's power that people don't hate you for booking a vanity Wrestlemania main event against your pet project in Roman Reigns so you can say you both made Roman Reigns and wrestled in the highest attendant Wrestlemania in history. Those selfies have tons of power. I seem to remember quite a bit of people not liking that result, mainly because we could see where it was going a long while before it happened. Many people complained about Trips putting himself in the main event of "The Biggest Wrestlemania Everz!" & facing Roman, in what most of us thought was gonna be a terrible main event(and, it was), just to stroke his ego even more. Some people may give him a pass...sometimes, but he sure as hell ain't bullet proof. Also, many people see through the selfie stuff. Oh yeah some people hated it myself included. But it did not receive anywhere near the levels of venom and hatred as the 2014 or 2015 Rumbles which were just as predictable.
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Post by Alice Syndrome on Jun 11, 2017 3:21:09 GMT -5
Don't forget being bullet proof by winning the 2016 Rumble, having a 3 month title run, and main eventing Wrestlemania against Roman Reigns. Shit I consider his 2016 Rumble win worse than the 2015 Rumble and just only above 2014 because that should of went to Daniel Bryan and WWE's skeezy way of marketing by not publicly saying DB was going to be in it so people were going to buy the PPV under false pretenses. The only statement they had was Daniel Bryan briefly saying he wasn't going to be in the match in a local radio interview few days before the match which had the usual "It's a work" or "He's working us" or "It's kayfabe" comments. But yeah that's power that people don't hate you for booking a vanity Wrestlemania main event against your pet project in Roman Reigns so you can say you both made Roman Reigns and wrestled in the highest attendant Wrestlemania in history. Those selfies have tons of power. I seem to remember quite a bit of people not liking that result, mainly because we could see where it was going a long while before it happened. Many people complained about Trips putting himself in the main event of "The Biggest Wrestlemania Everz!" & facing Roman, in what most of us thought was gonna be a terrible main event(and, it was), just to stroke his ego even more. Some people may give him a pass...sometimes, but he sure as hell ain't bullet proof. Also, many people see through the selfie stuff. Yeah, the only surprise about that was them not completing the Aztec Warfare ripoff by making Trips #31
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Post by Mid-Carder on Jun 11, 2017 4:26:39 GMT -5
There is no comparison between Cena and Hulk Hogan. Hogan sold his opponents like they were huge threats and everybody who worked with him got a boost out of it. He's the biggest star of all time and wrestling was the biggest its ever been when he was on top, therefore everybody was better off. Business was best when Hogan was winning, and he helped guys simply by feuding with them. Cena doesn't have this. Business has been just ok when he's on top and he's been consistently booed out of buildings as the top face for more than a decade.
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Post by Oh Cry Me a Screwball on Jun 11, 2017 4:45:33 GMT -5
I seem to remember quite a bit of people not liking that result, mainly because we could see where it was going a long while before it happened. Many people complained about Trips putting himself in the main event of "The Biggest Wrestlemania Everz!" & facing Roman, in what most of us thought was gonna be a terrible main event(and, it was), just to stroke his ego even more. Some people may give him a pass...sometimes, but he sure as hell ain't bullet proof. Also, many people see through the selfie stuff. Oh yeah some people hated it myself included. But it did not receive anywhere near the levels of venom and hatred as the 2014 or 2015 Rumbles which were just as predictable. Bear in mind that Triple H in the Mania 32 main event was mostly attributed due to circumstance first, and Hunter's ego second. Yeah, it's rather egocentric to put yourself in the main event of the show when half of your main event grade talent is on the shelf, but well, half of WWE's main event grade talent was on the shelf. I can't even really fault them considering Brock vs. Ambrose was disappointing too, and Shane vs. Taker, despite being the most interesting of the main event level matches, was just a couple of noteworthy spots in between 30 minutes of filler and didn't even really have any storyline relevance after about 48 hours after the show. At least Hunter vs. Roman had the title main eventing the show.
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JoDaNa1281
Crow T. Robot
Jackie Daytona, Regular Human Bartender. #BLM
Posts: 41,015
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Post by JoDaNa1281 on Jun 11, 2017 5:14:30 GMT -5
I seem to remember quite a bit of people not liking that result, mainly because we could see where it was going a long while before it happened. Many people complained about Trips putting himself in the main event of "The Biggest Wrestlemania Everz!" & facing Roman, in what most of us thought was gonna be a terrible main event(and, it was), just to stroke his ego even more. Some people may give him a pass...sometimes, but he sure as hell ain't bullet proof. Also, many people see through the selfie stuff. Oh yeah some people hated it myself included. But it did not receive anywhere near the levels of venom and hatred as the 2014 or 2015 Rumbles which were just as predictable. Oh yeah, I agree with that. Speaking of reeeaaallyy predictable Rumbles, let's not forget Cena winning it in 2013. Hell, everybody predicted how that would play out at Raw 1000, after Rock said that he was challenging for the WWE Title at Rumble. - Rock wins WWE Title - Cena recovers from "The Worst Night Year of Bret Hart's His Life" by winning the Rumble. - We get "Twice in a Lifetime". - Cena wins, fans rejoice, punch & pie for everyone.
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