cjh
Hank Scorpio
Posts: 6,899
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Post by cjh on May 21, 2018 13:44:04 GMT -5
I don't know. In January 1998, Turner Broadcasting tried something like this with WCW when Thunder debuted, and it lasted 7 months before they started taping two Thunders at a time to save money, even though WCW's revenue that year was its best ever. WCW wasn’t getting a billion dollars in TV rights. Well, yeah, because WCW and the channels that aired were owned by the same corporation. Even so, the people who wanted Thunder live every week decided fairly quickly that whatever Thunder was making them wasn't worth the expense of airing it live every week. |
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Post by cabbageboy on May 21, 2018 13:45:35 GMT -5
Actually one could argue that wrestling was at its best when there were all sorts of promotions out there. And in some ways we've sort of gotten to the point where wrestlers can at least make a living away from WWE. As far as someone going head to head with Vince and besting him for a while, forget it. No one in their right mind would put a wrestling show on opposite WWE at this point, not after TNA's 2010 fiasco. The days of rampant DVR use make it pointless anyway. Personally I think the various wrestling wars were horrible and detrimental to the business. Did Vince and Crockett waging war in the 80s help the business? No. It led to both carving up the AWA (Vince first, but Crockett did this later while co-promoting). Vince's expansion led to other groups like WCCW and Mid-South cannibalizing each other (though WCCW had all sorts of problems with guys dying), only for Mid-South/UWF to also crash and Crockett ill advisedly bought them out to compete with Vince. It was really only Memphis that survived the 80s, mainly because it was a smaller, isolated territory with no national ambitions.
But hey, at least going into the 1990s there were two major promotions out there. The MNW in the mid to late 90s for all intents destroyed the industry. The early 2000s were a nightmare time for wrestling really, with the WWF basically monopolizing the industry and even places like Japan were crashing and burning with Baba's death tanking All Japan and Inoki going totally nuts with MMA and wrecking New Japan for quite a while. It would have sucked to be a wrestler circa 2001 or so.
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Post by Raw is Doodie101 on May 21, 2018 13:45:48 GMT -5
WCW wasn’t getting a billion dollars in TV rights. Well, yeah, because WCW and the channels that aired were owned by the same corporation. Even so, the people who wanted Thunder live every week decided fairly quickly that whatever Thunder was making them wasn't worth the expense of airing it live every week. This is a good point but nevertheless..WWE will change it’s taping schedule. It just doesn’t matter in the grand scheme of things. |
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MiLB Fan
Fry's dog Seymour
Posts: 20,566 
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Post by MiLB Fan on May 21, 2018 13:45:49 GMT -5
Also since we're bringing up WCW didn't they plan to have something on NBC circa 1999? Yeah, Eric Bischoff talked about that on his podcast. The plan was to run a live special on NBC called Love Hurts opposite WWE’s St. Valentine’s Day Massacre PPV. Eric claims that Turner execs killed the deal because they didn’t want WCW on another network. |
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Post by Raw is Doodie101 on May 21, 2018 13:46:45 GMT -5
It is gonna be really really f***ing interesting as it pretains to the Young Bucks and those guys as they are about to put on the biggest indy show of all time but ya know WWE especially now is gonna come at them with every single lining in their pocket. Gonna be real interesting to see what wins over now with those guys because if WWE backs the literal brinks truck up and they are going to now and they take it that is a blow to any competition for atleast the next 5yrs if not more from ever rising up ever. We’ll see Kenny Omega and whoever else is still big in the indies in WWE before 2020 for sure. |
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cjh
Hank Scorpio
Posts: 6,899
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Post by cjh on May 21, 2018 13:48:21 GMT -5
Again, the only thing you can do if SD has to be live on Fridays is do Raw on Thursday. I'm not sure if WWE would want to hire a whole second TV crew because the whole idea here is that they're going to make more money while spending the same. Fox is investing in live programming, especially on the weekends. They have the NFL on Thursdays, SDL on Friday, NCAA Football on Saturdays, and more NFL on Sundays. Throw in NASCAR coverage and the MLB and it is obvious they are trying to beat DVRs. There is no issue, nothing stopping WWE from running Mondays and Fridays live, especially with the amount they are getting paid. The money was what prevented them from doing it to start with. Hell, the schedules probably easier on them that way.Raw is stil worth $400M a year, this deal is multi year, so only really $200M a year. Raw will still be the A show One is available to 100% of the country and will be tied to the NFL and College Football and the other is getting more cash. At the very least, they are equals but the availability and promotion with the NFL is not something to be ignored. The schedule wouldn't be easier. That's why WWE has been doing TV days back-to-back since 1986. WWE was making money hand over first in the Attitude Era (in both revenue and profit, not just revenue) and still didn't do Smackdown live because taping TV on consecutive days is just that much easier. |
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Post by Richard on May 21, 2018 13:49:37 GMT -5
Fox is investing in live programming, especially on the weekends. They have the NFL on Thursdays, SDL on Friday, NCAA Football on Saturdays, and more NFL on Sundays. Throw in NASCAR coverage and the MLB and it is obvious they are trying to beat DVRs. There is no issue, nothing stopping WWE from running Mondays and Fridays live, especially with the amount they are getting paid. The money was what prevented them from doing it to start with. Hell, the schedules probably easier on them that way.One is available to 100% of the country and will be tied to the NFL and College Football and the other is getting more cash. At the very least, they are equals but the availability and promotion with the NFL is not something to be ignored. The schedule wouldn't be easier. That's why WWE has been doing TV days back-to-back since 1986. WWE was making money hand over first in the Attitude Era (in both revenue and profit, not just revenue) and still didn't do Smackdown live because taping TV on consecutive days is just that much easier. They weren't being paid $600 million a year then either. |
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MiLB Fan
Fry's dog Seymour
Posts: 20,566
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Post by MiLB Fan on May 21, 2018 13:56:00 GMT -5
This seems appropriate in light of today’s news.
Also, I’m curious about who this third party is that supposedly offered more than Fox did. I know Facebook and Amazon were interested, but I can’t see them outbidding a national broadcast channel.
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cjh
Hank Scorpio
Posts: 6,899
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Post by cjh on May 21, 2018 13:57:15 GMT -5
The schedule wouldn't be easier. That's why WWE has been doing TV days back-to-back since 1986. WWE was making money hand over first in the Attitude Era (in both revenue and profit, not just revenue) and still didn't do Smackdown live because taping TV on consecutive days is just that much easier. They weren't being paid $600 million a year then either. Again, it's more a logistics issue than money. You're either paying the TV crew to sit in a hotel over the weekend and not work while they wait for Raw, or you're doubling the amount of flights they have to take every week (fly in for SD on Thursday night or Friday morning, fly home on Saturday, fly back on Sunday night or Monday morning for Raw, fly home again on Tuesday). |
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Post by 111111 on May 21, 2018 13:59:32 GMT -5
So this is the end of the brand split right? The talent is spread thin as is, they have a whole lot of upper midcarders the hardcore fans like but very few legit main event draws, not enough to maintain two shows if this scale. Brand Split becomes even more important when you’re dealing with two different networks and it probably allowed them to sell it as different unique brands. I mean if Fox are spending all that money though they're probably demanding Lesnar and Rousey and if USA really pay $400 million for Raw then they're also demanding Lesnar and Rousey. |
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Post by bcdx97 on May 21, 2018 14:02:05 GMT -5
A crappy product gets rewarded with tons of cash?
Somebody somewhere is going to be losing a ton of money. Or are these corporations just so rich they can’t lose? This doesn’t feel right at all.
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Post by Raw is Doodie101 on May 21, 2018 14:03:56 GMT -5
WWE’s longterm investment in becoming more mainstream and less niche has paid off big time.
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Post by Feargus McReddit on May 21, 2018 14:05:48 GMT -5
With these two deals, Raw and Smackdown are both going to HAVE to get better. Honestly, that’s nowhere near the case. If anything, ratings have kept steady going the direction they have so getting money from these TV deals and Saudi Arabia means that regardless of the on air product, things can go the way they are because the profits are going to be much higher. It’s why I’m not bothering much with WWE outside YouTube and going to a bar to watch a PPV. At the very least, I’ll have a fun time. My money is better spent on indie promotions not far from me. |
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on May 21, 2018 14:06:00 GMT -5
They weren't being paid $600 million a year then either. Again, it's more a logistics issue than money. You're either paying the TV crew to sit in a hotel over the weekend and not work while they wait for Raw, or you're doubling the amount of flights they have to take every week (fly in for SD on Thursday night or Friday morning, fly home on Saturday, fly back on Sunday night or Monday morning for Raw, fly home again on Tuesday). Money solves a lot of logistics issues. WWE's production expenses will go up but that's not a big deal when they're getting such a huge revenue increase. You're making a big deal out of a very, very minor issue. |
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Lancers
El Dandy
Oh you
Posts: 7,951
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Post by Lancers on May 21, 2018 14:09:13 GMT -5
Stock almost up to $60 a share from the news. Estimated 200 million a year for SD. Estimated 240 million a year for RAW. Almost 2 million Network subscribers.
This company can just buy the Sears Center in Hoffman Estates, cancel All In and replace it with a Baron Corbin-Jinder Mahal 180 minute iron man match on September 1st.
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Post by The Summer of Muskrat XVII on May 21, 2018 14:09:15 GMT -5
Wow. Just f***ing wow. Never did I expect SDL to get $200 mil. a year. I figured $120m and they’re laughing, and if they really hit a home run maybe $150m but this is a game changer
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cjh
Hank Scorpio
Posts: 6,899
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Post by cjh on May 21, 2018 14:10:23 GMT -5
Again, it's more a logistics issue than money. You're either paying the TV crew to sit in a hotel over the weekend and not work while they wait for Raw, or you're doubling the amount of flights they have to take every week (fly in for SD on Thursday night or Friday morning, fly home on Saturday, fly back on Sunday night or Monday morning for Raw, fly home again on Tuesday). Money solves a lot of logistics issues. WWE's production expenses will go up but that's not a big deal when they're getting such a huge revenue increase. You're making a big deal out of a very, very minor issue. They could, but I would imagine WWE isn't wanting to add new, avoidable expenses when they have the chance to be more profitable than ever if they keep spending at current levels. They've been setting revenue records for awhile now, but profits remain fairly small because they've been spending like crazy. |
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Post by EoE: Workin On My Night Cheese on May 21, 2018 14:16:18 GMT -5
To revise a previous summary of the situation:
USA: “Here’s a big bag of money for RAW.”
FOX: “Here’s a big bag of money for SmackDown.”
Fans: “SERIOUSLY, HAVE YOU ACTUALLY WATCHED THE F***ING SHOWS AT ANY POINT?! GOOGLE THE NAME ROMAN REIGNS, FOR CHRIST SAKES.”
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Post by Can you afford to pay me, Gah on May 21, 2018 14:19:26 GMT -5
Again, it's more a logistics issue than money. You're either paying the TV crew to sit in a hotel over the weekend and not work while they wait for Raw, or you're doubling the amount of flights they have to take every week (fly in for SD on Thursday night or Friday morning, fly home on Saturday, fly back on Sunday night or Monday morning for Raw, fly home again on Tuesday). Money solves a lot of logistics issues. WWE's production expenses will go up but that's not a big deal when they're getting such a huge revenue increase. You're making a big deal out of a very, very minor issue. I thought there where two teams as it is. I thought I read it takes eight hours to set up TV. So I thought like the ring crews production was the same setting all up. Anyway as people debate who the A show. Smackdown is the A show now regardless how much Raw is be paid for. We are talking about Fox here. Meaning EVERYONE cable or not can watch Smackdown and all the links to the NFL and stuff like that to promote it. It's not about how much a show is getting paid for but how many potential viewers one network can generate. Fox are in way more house holds than USA network. Sure Raw has his long history but that doesn't matter when Fox availability comes into play. As long you have a TV you can watch you can watch smackdown, cable or no cable. You have to pay for the USA network, you don't fox, thats a HUGE difference. |
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Post by sportatorium on May 21, 2018 14:21:12 GMT -5
Vince is in for a true change in the game. Fox wants Rousey for sure and anyone else they consider top talent on their show, and won’t be shy about telling Vince. They also won’t be that interested in “we only do a shakeup once a year”, etc. What they offer beyond the rights $$ is an infrastructure where they can get WWE talent on their sports talk/analysis shows, have them make guest appearances on various TV shows etc.
The other thing Fox won’t fully understand is why their TV show is in place to get people to watch bigger events on the WWE network. They will make a play to televise Wrestlemania or Summerslam at some point sooner than later.
I also agree that if someone at Fox wants Kenny Omega or anyone in that crew, they will be telling Vince to go get them.
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