|
Post by Viking Hall on Nov 22, 2018 5:12:28 GMT -5
Very strange reactions to this, quite saddening too to be honest. This could be everything modern wrestling needs potentially and should get nothing but support at this point. Every name mentioned so far (whether you're a fan or not) has proven track records, a passion for what they do and a ready made mass appeal. I've seen nothing yet that suggests it could be even close to disastrous.
But no, let's speculate about people getting ripped off, people having delusions and set it up to fail before it's even begun. That makes way more sense.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Nov 22, 2018 6:04:20 GMT -5
It will be interesting to see how this plays out. Seems like they plan to have a television show, given the "Tuesday Night Dynamite" registration. While it was cool that All In featured talent from a variety of promotions that have television shows, if suddenly they have another direct television competitor, I don't see those companies being so lenient with allowing "their guys" to work on this show. We could see ROH, Impact, MLW, and AEW all trying to have four separate rosters. While there's a lot of talent out there, four full rosters worth of guys "ready for TV" may be a stretch. Plus WWE will sign more guys to developmental "just in case."
|
|
|
Post by Viking Hall on Nov 22, 2018 6:25:01 GMT -5
I honestly think we'll see less indie stars signing with WWE if I'm honest, especially if there's other options. A few years back it was pretty much a foregone conclusion that if WWE came in for someone it was a done deal. This year alone just off of the top of my head they've had Walter, the Lucha Bros, the Elite and Naito all turn them down and obviously PAC and Aries walk out recently. I think most are seeing that even for special talent there's no real room left there for anyone and that the grass might be greener elsewhere.
|
|
|
Post by The Dark Order Inferno on Nov 22, 2018 6:27:10 GMT -5
Very strange reactions to this, quite saddening too to be honest. This could be everything modern wrestling needs potentially and should get nothing but support at this point. Every name mentioned so far (whether you're a fan or not) has proven track records, a passion for what they do and a ready made mass appeal. I've seen nothing yet that suggests it could be even close to disastrous. But no, let's speculate about people getting ripped off, people having delusions and set it up to fail before it's even begun. That makes way more sense. The problem is we've seen it all before at this point, wrestling is a graveyard of superindies, some with big money backers too. You can't blame people for questioning how wise this is given how hard it is for these projects to gain any sort of traction, successful feds like ROH were absolute moneypits, even with 'good management' and the less said about the WWA, XWF and TNA the better. Then there's wrestling's long history of conmen, people whose contributions seem to bee to drain money while giving crap advice to the backers, if not outright stealing from them... We want wrestling to do well, but the omens aren't good.
|
|
|
Post by Viking Hall on Nov 22, 2018 6:34:39 GMT -5
Very strange reactions to this, quite saddening too to be honest. This could be everything modern wrestling needs potentially and should get nothing but support at this point. Every name mentioned so far (whether you're a fan or not) has proven track records, a passion for what they do and a ready made mass appeal. I've seen nothing yet that suggests it could be even close to disastrous. But no, let's speculate about people getting ripped off, people having delusions and set it up to fail before it's even begun. That makes way more sense. The problem is we've seen it all before at this point, wrestling is a graveyard of superindies, some with big money backers too. You can't blame people for questioning how wise this is given how hard it is for these projects to gain any sort of traction, successful feds like ROH were absolute moneypits, even with 'good management' and the less said about the WWA, XWF and TNA the better. Then there's wrestling's long history of conmen, people whose contributions seem to bee to drain money while giving crap advice to the backers, if not outright stealing from them... We want wrestling to do well, but the omens aren't good. I prefer to take each case on merit to be honest. Wrestling is a small industry in reality and all those that you listed are about the only 'big' attempts at starting anything and all happened in a vastly different landscape which had been scorched by the collapse of WCW and ECW. We're nearly two decades on from that now, there's a lot of promotions doing well, it's easier to access content than it's ever been and it looks as though it's being fronted by a pretty solid bunch of people. Could it go up in ball flames? Quite easily. But if I had to back anyone to be successful then it would this lot.
|
|
|
Post by kingoftheindies on Nov 22, 2018 9:35:38 GMT -5
I wouldn't say the Khans are money marks. They bought both the Jags and Fulham at bad times and have have done their best to rebuild both brands. May not be showing in results but their businesses have improved.
Also Tony Khan is pretty forward thinking and even if it's his Dad's money having him involved in a project is encouraging
|
|
|
Post by Can you afford to pay me, Gah on Nov 22, 2018 10:49:11 GMT -5
Honestly this can work because the WWE while still a Billion dollar company the fans have been pissed off and are wanting that true Alternative. The issue over the years is neither nothing ever had the financial backing to get it off the ground with good business sense to run it. TNA had the money but the wrong people where driving the ship from having Russo booking and lack of advertising. With the Bullet club involved and there success with All IN. They clearly have the business sense, and with how All in Sold out faster than any wrestling event has in a long time that wasn't WWE produced and drew more than any TNA event as ever. This can work.
Now, the key is NOT trying to go head to head with the WWE but focus on just building a successful brand that makes money. Now of course the WWE will try to take you out as they do anyone else that threatens them, but the trick would be to fight back if they try but be smart about it. Hell have a lighter schedule would attract talent to think ok now we have options but still make money in wrestling and that the WWE isn't the only show in town to do it. Now it won't be over night but if you can build it let say 10 years from the start where it is that brand. The key is marketing and having a good product. The roster can be great and if you build around more fulling the roster with top indies guys and not so many EX WWE guys unless some elite talent wants to make that jump in a few years wants it going. While I am fine with lets say PAC coming in, just don't be like TNA that anybody and everyone that worked there gets signed. Unless they are top level talent, that decides if you should make that move.
This could change what Impact wrestling is now or what MLW goes from here good or bad since if the Khans money is in, that means the money will talk for some of these wrestlers. I know must talent IMO that needs to stay away from the WWE would be guys like the Lucha Bros Both these guys are a hot hand in the singles or a team. Pentagon has been one of the hottest talent from Lucha to take over the US wrestling since since the days of when ECW and WCW started bring them up in the mid 90s. I see him as that next Rey Mysterio not in in ring style but beginning that long term top cross over talent from Lucha to world wide like Rey did. The WWE want looking for that next guy think Alberto or Sin Cara would be that. Honestly Pentagon is that guy but the WWE would mess it up. Rey Fenix if in the WWE I would feel like he wouldn't get the chance to shine. For now they would need to have that same agreement MLW and IMmpact have with Lucha Undergound to use them.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Nov 22, 2018 10:50:35 GMT -5
Who exactly will be the talent on these shows though? NJPW, ROH, and CMLL all have a relationship and it's tough to see these guys getting any talent from those groups. I think it would be wise to keep one foot in those waters and do some dates for NJPW at least, just to keep that relationship going. I guess AAA can send some talent. Doesn’t AAA has some sort of exclusivity deal with tna and lu? There are two pools of talent the bucks would certainly have to choose between AAA , TNA , LU CMLL , ROH , NJPW NJPW does not want their guys working with AAA talent because of their long standing relationship with CMLL this was the reason that during WM weekend the Lucha Bros against the Golden Lovers was nixed by NJPW pulling Omega and Ibushi out of it. The AAA , TNA , LU seems like the more easy going relationship since all of those guys that are contracted to LU and or Impact can work anywhere they want where with NJPW seems more restrictive because of NJPWs loyalty to CMLL. So if this company gets off the ground hell of a choice on which pool of talent choose the other for
|
|
|
Post by OVO 40 hunched over like he 80 on Nov 22, 2018 11:06:38 GMT -5
Very strange reactions to this, quite saddening too to be honest. This could be everything modern wrestling needs potentially and should get nothing but support at this point. Every name mentioned so far (whether you're a fan or not) has proven track records, a passion for what they do and a ready made mass appeal. I've seen nothing yet that suggests it could be even close to disastrous. But no, let's speculate about people getting ripped off, people having delusions and set it up to fail before it's even begun. That makes way more sense. The problem is we've seen it all before at this point, wrestling is a graveyard of superindies, some with big money backers too. You can't blame people for questioning how wise this is given how hard it is for these projects to gain any sort of traction, successful feds like ROH were absolute moneypits, even with 'good management' and the less said about the WWA, XWF and TNA the better. Then there's wrestling's long history of conmen, people whose contributions seem to bee to drain money while giving crap advice to the backers, if not outright stealing from them... We want wrestling to do well, but the omens aren't good. I’m remembering the xwf now, how it was supposed to be the next thing but it folded like a year later. I think Jimmy Hart ran it.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Nov 22, 2018 11:10:04 GMT -5
Very strange reactions to this, quite saddening too to be honest. This could be everything modern wrestling needs potentially and should get nothing but support at this point. Every name mentioned so far (whether you're a fan or not) has proven track records, a passion for what they do and a ready made mass appeal. I've seen nothing yet that suggests it could be even close to disastrous. But no, let's speculate about people getting ripped off, people having delusions and set it up to fail before it's even begun. That makes way more sense. The problem is we've seen it all before at this point, wrestling is a graveyard of superindies, some with big money backers too. You can't blame people for questioning how wise this is given how hard it is for these projects to gain any sort of traction, successful feds like ROH were absolute moneypits, even with 'good management' and the less said about the WWA, XWF and TNA the better. Then there's wrestling's long history of conmen, people whose contributions seem to bee to drain money while giving crap advice to the backers, if not outright stealing from them... We want wrestling to do well, but the omens aren't good. What good does it do to bury them before they even make a sales pitch? WCW had money behind it and it took WWF to the limit, TNA eventually got money behind it and for all its faults it outlived WCW. MLW has money and they're not overextending themselves, ROH too. Right now the story is that the guys behind one of the biggest booking success stories have found someone to offer them money to play with and see what they can do, in my eyes this is a pretty natural escalation. We can't possibly know enough to call this a good or bad idea yet so why not be a little hopeful until more facts reveal themselves? Fear of being wrong? If you can't look forward to at least seeing what this all about then what can you look forward to?
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Nov 22, 2018 11:46:31 GMT -5
Doesn’t AAA has some sort of exclusivity deal with tna and lu? There are two pools of talent the bucks would certainly have to choose between AAA , TNA , LU CMLL , ROH , NJPW NJPW does not want their guys working with AAA talent because of their long standing relationship with CMLL this was the reason that during WM weekend the Lucha Bros against the Golden Lovers was nixed by NJPW pulling Omega and Ibushi out of it. The AAA , TNA , LU seems like the more easy going relationship since all of those guys that are contracted to LU and or Impact can work anywhere they want where with NJPW seems more restrictive because of NJPWs loyalty to CMLL. So if this company gets off the ground hell of a choice on which pool of talent choose the other for The big question is.... if AEW launches a weekly television show, will those companies permit their talent to work on said television show while also working on their respective television shows? My guess is probably not. There's a difference between that and giving guys the OK to work a one off show like All In as a favor to Cody and the Bucks. In this situation, they become a new direct competitor in the weekly wrestling television game. I don't think they'll be willing to "share talent" if this thing has serious TV behind it that could potentially threaten the future of the other promotion's shows.
|
|
Convoy
El Dandy
Rusev admits to being a sex addict to large applause.
Posts: 7,609
Member is Online
|
Post by Convoy on Nov 22, 2018 12:12:16 GMT -5
There are two pools of talent the bucks would certainly have to choose between AAA , TNA , LU CMLL , ROH , NJPW NJPW does not want their guys working with AAA talent because of their long standing relationship with CMLL this was the reason that during WM weekend the Lucha Bros against the Golden Lovers was nixed by NJPW pulling Omega and Ibushi out of it. The AAA , TNA , LU seems like the more easy going relationship since all of those guys that are contracted to LU and or Impact can work anywhere they want where with NJPW seems more restrictive because of NJPWs loyalty to CMLL. So if this company gets off the ground hell of a choice on which pool of talent choose the other for The big question is.... if AEW launches a weekly television show, will those companies permit their talent to work on said television show while also working on their respective television shows? My guess is probably not. There's a difference between that and giving guys the OK to work a one off show like All In as a favor to Cody and the Bucks. In this situation, they become a new direct competitor in the weekly wrestling television game. I don't think they'll be willing to "share talent" if this thing has serious TV behind it that could potentially threaten the future of the other promotion's shows. Both good points. I would think the line is drawn as more wrestlers say they are not resigning with ROH or NJPW, so the first group is more likely to make up their roster. Unless they also allow a free-flowing relationship, I would also think MLW's roster would have to choose. I'm leaning towards something like Jericho's Cruise being somewhat of a foundation roster for this promotion.
|
|
Ultimo Gallos
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Dreams SUCK!Nightmares live FOREVER!
Posts: 15,269
|
Post by Ultimo Gallos on Nov 22, 2018 12:14:02 GMT -5
AAA and LU have no issues with their talent working TNA&MLW.
|
|
|
Post by Feargus McReddit on Nov 22, 2018 12:15:24 GMT -5
AAA and LU have no issues with their talent working TNA&MLW. I mean, I kind of don’t see how they could in some ways. LU in particular from what’s seen is the same as a regular TV contract so it’d be like if an actor did a movie in between TV tapings for a hit show or something like that.
|
|
Ultimo Gallos
Bill S. Preston, Esq.
Dreams SUCK!Nightmares live FOREVER!
Posts: 15,269
|
Post by Ultimo Gallos on Nov 22, 2018 12:20:02 GMT -5
AAA and LU have no issues with their talent working TNA&MLW. I mean, I kind of don’t see how they could in some ways. LU in particular from what’s seen is the same as a regular TV contract so it’d be like if an actor did a movie in between TV tapings for a hit show or something like that. Remember the Hernandez stuff in TNA a few years back? He couldn't work TNA cause he was under contract to LU.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Nov 22, 2018 12:27:26 GMT -5
LU has no problems with their talent working anywhere because they learned there was no reason to be so territorial as they do not work year round and by being so overly protective they were costing their guys and gals money so prior to the most recent season they hugely loosened the contracts and established talent exchanges so they could still benefit when they tape a season....hence guys like Desmond Xavier and Tommy Dreamer showing up in LU for guest stints.
All the LU talent in Impact Thunder Rosa works ROH and PJ Black just worked global wars I think it was
What throws the wrench into works is that NJPW and CMLL loyalty because that automatically keeps any AAA talent(fenix and penta specifically) from this company
|
|
Convoy
El Dandy
Rusev admits to being a sex addict to large applause.
Posts: 7,609
Member is Online
|
Post by Convoy on Nov 22, 2018 12:39:45 GMT -5
A lot changed after the blowback LU received following Ricochet's comments at the New Japan shows last year. Ricochet himself was always going to leave for WWE, but I'm sure that made his decision easier.
|
|
|
Post by Viking Hall on Nov 22, 2018 12:56:39 GMT -5
I mean, all of this is assuming that the old rules apply here. I would personally imagine that although we've only just heard about this in the past month or so the seeds will have been planted before All In was even announced. With this in mind I can't think that they've been sat around all that time waiting to see what happens, they'll know exactly who they want and in turn I think deals will have been made to get those names. The Elite as free agents in control of their own careers have a unique position on the wrestling landscape in that they are the biggest stars outside of WWE and they can turn up (or rather, from a negotiation stand point not turn up) wherever they like. I don't think that kind of leverage should be underestimated. Cody in particular has spoken about the need for freedom in wrestling, both in terms of employment and creatively so I can honestly see the AEW becoming a sort of umbrella for independent talent to come and go as needed and one that will work together with other promotions to continue to nurture the talent pool that the likes of The Bucks etc have made their name in. It's not something we've really seen before, but it's something I see as a real possibility especially when you consider how much of a commodity they are as a group.
|
|
|
Post by OVO 40 hunched over like he 80 on Nov 22, 2018 13:11:21 GMT -5
Was All In a once in a lifetime event or can it be done on a consistent basis that would work in the arenas that AEW wants to run?
|
|
|
Post by Viking Hall on Nov 22, 2018 13:22:15 GMT -5
Was All In a once in a lifetime event or can it be done on a consistent basis that would work in the arenas that AEW wants to run? If they can get the caliber of talent that All In had, then there's absolutely no reason why not as far as I'm concerned. All In was certainly sold as a moment in time, but moment or no moment, it sold out instantly with basically no card info or advertising. The real question is can they put together compelling storylines and angles regularly and the only way to find that out is for the product to become a reality.
|
|