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Post by A Platypus Rave on Jan 16, 2019 20:22:22 GMT -5
Absolute greatest is always a tough call to make on things.
I'd probably say no to the tip-top section but he is definitely up there with few people ahead of him.
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Post by Error on Jan 16, 2019 20:32:51 GMT -5
For the post-MNW era, absolutely. I don't think anyone can come close to what he's done on and off camera.
Overall, there really isn't an easy way to judge given how varied wrestling and WWE are.
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Post by Cela on Jan 16, 2019 20:46:40 GMT -5
No, being the force pushed figurehead of one of the least popular eras is not even close to GOAT status.
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Post by Cranjis McBasketball on Jan 16, 2019 21:08:53 GMT -5
No. Not even top ten.
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Post by BatPunk on Jan 16, 2019 21:46:35 GMT -5
You got past that line you bolder and read the rest of the post, yeah? I did. However, I should also add the idea that other GOATs never put people over just silly. Please, and I’m not trying to be funny, who did Hogan, Austin and Rock put over on the same level Cena does?
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Post by Loser troll. Please ban me on Jan 16, 2019 23:23:26 GMT -5
I did. However, I should also add the idea that other GOATs never put people over just silly. Please, and I’m not trying to be funny, who did Hogan, Austin and Rock put over on the same level Cena does? The Rock is hard to say since all of his major feuds were with guys already very over, But I'd say he definitely extended Foley's shelf life. Austin; Pillman to a general audience, A young Kurt Angle (Tapped to him) Hogan; Same deal as Rock but if I had to pick someone, I'd go with Kamala as a dangerous heel (Before his comedy run) Interestingly, except hogan, You with a group of guys that basically got each other over (Foley/Austin/Rock/Undertaker). It's a fair argument you're making and I get it....BUT... I can't think, save Hogan, of guys who had the steam taken out of their pushes after facing them. If we look at Cena's feuds, nearly every guy he "overcame" never really recovered; The Entirety of Nexus, Bray Wyatt, Kevin Owens, Rusev, (Pretty much everyone he faced during his U.S Run, Rollins(To his credit seems to have escaped) If you can give me someone other than Balor recently that came out looking good after Cena, I'm all for it.
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Post by BatPunk on Jan 17, 2019 0:59:41 GMT -5
Please, and I’m not trying to be funny, who did Hogan, Austin and Rock put over on the same level Cena does? The Rock is hard to say since all of his major feuds were with guys already very over, But I'd say he definitely extended Foley's shelf life. Austin; Pillman to a general audience, A young Kurt Angle (Tapped to him) Hogan; Same deal as Rock but if I had to pick someone, I'd go with Kamala as a dangerous heel (Before his comedy run) Interestingly, except hogan, You with a group of guys that basically got each other over (Foley/Austin/Rock/Undertaker). It's a fair argument you're making and I get it....BUT... I can't think, save Hogan, of guys who had the steam taken out of their pushes after facing them. If we look at Cena's feuds, nearly every guy he "overcame" never really recovered; The Entirety of Nexus, Bray Wyatt, Kevin Owens, Rusev, (Pretty much everyone he faced during his U.S Run, Rollins(To his credit seems to have escaped) If you can give me someone other than Balor recently that came out looking good after Cena, I'm all for it. This is a good point. There were a lot of guys who looked worse after Cena. I would say Punk came out of the Cena feud looking like a beast and their matches were awesome. I feel, And I could be wrong, but that feud ‘made’ Punk a legit main eventer in a lot of people’s eyes. I thought Edge came out looking much better than coming in and cemented Edge as a Main . I actually liked when Owens came in and beat him initially in the US Open and thought it was awesome Cena was big enough to put over such a young talent on his debut (kinda like his own) I get your point that Rock and Austin came up in an era where there were a group of talent getting ‘the group’ over. I just see Cena more as a guy who wants the company to grow and is willing to work with the young talent and help them get a rub. Something I don’t recall from the others.
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Post by Magic knows Black Lives Matter on Jan 17, 2019 3:22:25 GMT -5
Yeah. 16 world titles. 5 mania main events. MITB winner. Two time Royal Rumble Winner. Stacks more bread than the Pillsbury Doughboy. Nobody has stood the test of time like Cena. There’s a reason why he’s STILL Tha God of this wrestling shit. He’s the GOAT imo (kayfabe wise) Totally understand if you disagree but that’s my GOAT right there.
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Post by eJm on Jan 17, 2019 6:27:21 GMT -5
I did. However, I should also add the idea that other GOATs never put people over just silly. Please, and I’m not trying to be funny, who did Hogan, Austin and Rock put over on the same level Cena does? The Rock lost A LOT to people to a ridiculous extent. Like, even if most weren’t clean wins, The Rock was probably the only main eventer in history to take a lot of pins and still be one of the most over people ever.
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Post by BatPunk on Jan 17, 2019 8:48:19 GMT -5
Please, and I’m not trying to be funny, who did Hogan, Austin and Rock put over on the same level Cena does? The Rock lost A LOT to people to a ridiculous extent. Like, even if most weren’t clean wins, The Rock was probably the only main eventer in history to take a lot of pins and still be one of the most over people ever. I understand what you’re getting at, however taking a lot of pins and getting another performer are two very different things. Taker normally takes a lot of pins early when ‘the big new threat’ comes his way, but he rarely got anyone over. Foley doesn’t count. He got himself over.
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Post by Loser troll. Please ban me on Jan 17, 2019 12:26:55 GMT -5
The Rock is hard to say since all of his major feuds were with guys already very over, But I'd say he definitely extended Foley's shelf life. Austin; Pillman to a general audience, A young Kurt Angle (Tapped to him) Hogan; Same deal as Rock but if I had to pick someone, I'd go with Kamala as a dangerous heel (Before his comedy run) Interestingly, except hogan, You with a group of guys that basically got each other over (Foley/Austin/Rock/Undertaker). It's a fair argument you're making and I get it....BUT... I can't think, save Hogan, of guys who had the steam taken out of their pushes after facing them. If we look at Cena's feuds, nearly every guy he "overcame" never really recovered; The Entirety of Nexus, Bray Wyatt, Kevin Owens, Rusev, (Pretty much everyone he faced during his U.S Run, Rollins(To his credit seems to have escaped) If you can give me someone other than Balor recently that came out looking good after Cena, I'm all for it. This is a good point. There were a lot of guys who looked worse after Cena. I would say Punk came out of the Cena feud looking like a beast and their matches were awesome. I feel, And I could be wrong, but that feud ‘made’ Punk a legit main eventer in a lot of people’s eyes. I thought Edge came out looking much better than coming in and cemented Edge as a Main . I actually liked when Owens came in and beat him initially in the US Open and thought it was awesome Cena was big enough to put over such a young talent on his debut (kinda like his own) I get your point that Rock and Austin came up in an era where there were a group of talent getting ‘the group’ over. I just see Cena more as a guy who wants the company to grow and is willing to work with the young talent and help them get a rub. Something I don’t recall from the others. Very good points. Cena also is somewhat a victim of the one above all booking Vince does. Does anyone remember who that guy was that claimed Cena stopped his push? (I don't think he did, It just sprung to mind.
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Post by Old Jack Burton on Jan 17, 2019 12:32:23 GMT -5
His career isn't over yet, so it's still too soon to say. Additionally, going to need several years of breathing room to properly judge it after the fact.
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Post by BatPunk on Jan 17, 2019 14:46:52 GMT -5
This is a good point. There were a lot of guys who looked worse after Cena. I would say Punk came out of the Cena feud looking like a beast and their matches were awesome. I feel, And I could be wrong, but that feud ‘made’ Punk a legit main eventer in a lot of people’s eyes. I thought Edge came out looking much better than coming in and cemented Edge as a Main . I actually liked when Owens came in and beat him initially in the US Open and thought it was awesome Cena was big enough to put over such a young talent on his debut (kinda like his own) I get your point that Rock and Austin came up in an era where there were a group of talent getting ‘the group’ over. I just see Cena more as a guy who wants the company to grow and is willing to work with the young talent and help them get a rub. Something I don’t recall from the others. Very good points. Cena also is somewhat a victim of the one above all booking Vince does. Does anyone remember who that guy was that claimed Cena stopped his push? (I don't think he did, It just sprung to mind. I think it was Alex Riley. Which could have happened in all fairness. However if he really wanted to succeed we would be seeing him on the indies or Lucha Underground etc.... So I don’t know how much Cena has to do with his success.
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Post by sportatorium on Jan 17, 2019 15:02:43 GMT -5
Everything is always subjective, but Cena is below a bunch of people IMO.
Hogan- Wrestled the same match & worked almost the same program every time, wasn’t on TV every week in the syndicated shows, but could get everyone over the top for whatever he was doing in one promo.
Flair- My GOAT. Had to work all the NWA territories, show up, make someone look like they were going to beat him & helped launch storylines well after he was gone. The Dibiase Mid South Face turn & Jimmy Hart’s guy’s trying to collect the bounty Flair put on Jerry Lawler come to mind.
Austin- Had you convinced he meant every word he was saying, took completely over the top, ridiculous storylines & made them weeks of compelling television. Somehow elevated Vince as a physical threat despite beating him half to death every week.
Cena is a great wrestler, but he isn’t even close to these three.
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Post by lionheart21 on Jan 17, 2019 15:14:01 GMT -5
Yeah. 16 world titles. 5 mania main events. MITB winner. Two time Royal Rumble Winner. Stacks more bread than the Pillsbury Doughboy. Nobody has stood the test of time like Cena. There’s a reason why he’s STILL Tha God of this wrestling shit. He’s the GOAT imo (kayfabe wise) Totally understand if you disagree but that’s my GOAT right there. At some point, I don't care how they do it, book a match between him and Tanahashi. The biggest modern-day stars of their respective companies.
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Post by fw91 on Jan 17, 2019 15:16:42 GMT -5
I mean his peak and time as the top guy in the WWE was/is longer than anybody else’s.
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Post by fw91 on Jan 17, 2019 15:18:47 GMT -5
But it seems a lot of us, including myself are realizing we never appreciated Cena when we should have. A lot of the positive thoughts are all in hindsight.
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Post by sunnytaker on Jan 17, 2019 15:21:28 GMT -5
cena in no way has enough of a beard to be called the GOAT- i'm mean it's Daniel bryan's gimmick after all right maggle?
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Post by eJm on Jan 17, 2019 16:51:32 GMT -5
Yeah. 16 world titles. 5 mania main events. MITB winner. Two time Royal Rumble Winner. Stacks more bread than the Pillsbury Doughboy. Nobody has stood the test of time like Cena. There’s a reason why he’s STILL Tha God of this wrestling shit. He’s the GOAT imo (kayfabe wise) Totally understand if you disagree but that’s my GOAT right there. At some point, I don't care how they do it, book a match between him and Tanahashi. The biggest modern-day stars of their respective companies. Especially after Tana/Kenny, dude might not be as agile and quick as he once was but he still has it[/]. A match between those two would be killer.
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Post by government mule on Jan 17, 2019 16:59:55 GMT -5
As others have said - top tier consideration but hard to definitively say yes for certain.
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