Paige: "It was never WWE holding women back..."

[kidkamikaze10]

Very company (wo)man.

Wrong, but hey, they made a biopic for her and helped her a ton of times, I get why she's covering for them.

[OVO 40 hunched over like he 80]

Feb 22, 2019 16:11:06 GMT -5 CMPunkyBrewster said:

Alright, I'm about to hand out some Hard to Swallow pills...

She's absolutely right. The WWE never held women back.

Now, did they treat women's wrestling SERIOUSLY? No.

But until a few years ago, their women's wrestling wasn't meant to be taken seriously. They never, ever cared about match quality as it pertained to the women. The women were there for T&A. Hence, they didn't hire female wrestlers, they hired models, actresses, and just plain pretty ladies. They weren't there to be great wrestlers, they were there to entertain and titilate the predominantly male audience. Over the time that spanned from Wrestlemania 1 until 2005 or later, they only hired a handful of women who were anything more than passable in the ring. It's not like they were hiring all these amazing female wrestlers and making them do jello matches. They were largely hiring women who were suitable for jello matches and nothing else.

And on that platform, the women were never, ever held back. Sable, Torrie Wilson, Chyna, Stacy Keibler, Kelly Kelly, Sunny, Terri Runnels, the Kat, and many others became huge stars and focal points of the shows at various times. Were they good wrestlers or taken seriously in the ring? Absolutely not. Were they meant to be? Absolutely not. Held back? Not even kinda. They did exactly what they were paid to do, and again, became huge stars in the process, many of whom have managed to transcend the wrestling business and become stars outside of it.

Plus, as someone else pointed out, during the times when they DID take women's wrestling seriously, it was promoted and pushed the same way as the men. Most people forget that Wendi Richter was one of their most heavily pushed and promoted stars in the early-to-mid 80s, and presented her matches as every bit as important as any others, and more so than most, actually.

It's also important to note that it's really only been in the last decade that women's wrestling has started to become a major thing in America. The pool of female talent who could really go was very, very shallow for a long, long time, especially in America.

Focal points of the show?

Was Trish barking like a dog a focal part of the show? The Kat and Jacqueline flashing their boobs, was that also a focal part of the show?

[sportatorium]

Yeesh...I mean...No.

[Deleted]

[A Platypus Rave]

so it was the fans doing things like denying some of the women's requests to get more training.

The WWE has NEVER treated the Women like they were worth anything until recently that's not the fans doing.

If you treat people like they matter the crowd will start acting like they matter and if you treat them like an after thought the crowd will pick up on that and wait for the "important" stuff.

That goes for men and women.

[2coldMack is even more baffled]

Feb 22, 2019 18:44:20 GMT -5 A Platypus Rave said:

so it was the fans doing things like denying some of the women's requests to get more training...

Or the fans demanding women from Johnny Ace's spank bank getting signed.

[Deleted]

Feb 22, 2019 16:35:28 GMT -5 OVO 40 hunched over like he 80 said:

Feb 22, 2019 16:11:06 GMT -5 CMPunkyBrewster said:

Alright, I'm about to hand out some Hard to Swallow pills...

She's absolutely right. The WWE never held women back.

Now, did they treat women's wrestling SERIOUSLY? No.

But until a few years ago, their women's wrestling wasn't meant to be taken seriously. They never, ever cared about match quality as it pertained to the women. The women were there for T&A. Hence, they didn't hire female wrestlers, they hired models, actresses, and just plain pretty ladies. They weren't there to be great wrestlers, they were there to entertain and titilate the predominantly male audience. Over the time that spanned from Wrestlemania 1 until 2005 or later, they only hired a handful of women who were anything more than passable in the ring. It's not like they were hiring all these amazing female wrestlers and making them do jello matches. They were largely hiring women who were suitable for jello matches and nothing else.

And on that platform, the women were never, ever held back. Sable, Torrie Wilson, Chyna, Stacy Keibler, Kelly Kelly, Sunny, Terri Runnels, the Kat, and many others became huge stars and focal points of the shows at various times. Were they good wrestlers or taken seriously in the ring? Absolutely not. Were they meant to be? Absolutely not. Held back? Not even kinda. They did exactly what they were paid to do, and again, became huge stars in the process, many of whom have managed to transcend the wrestling business and become stars outside of it.

Plus, as someone else pointed out, during the times when they DID take women's wrestling seriously, it was promoted and pushed the same way as the men. Most people forget that Wendi Richter was one of their most heavily pushed and promoted stars in the early-to-mid 80s, and presented her matches as every bit as important as any others, and more so than most, actually.

It's also important to note that it's really only been in the last decade that women's wrestling has started to become a major thing in America. The pool of female talent who could really go was very, very shallow for a long, long time, especially in America.

Focal points of the show?

Was Trish barking like a dog a focal part of the show? The Kat and Jacqueline flashing their boobs, was that also a focal part of the show?

No, those were gimmicks. Trish barking like a dog was meant to push "Vince as a total asshole" because Trish was pushed as Vince's love object in an angle where his wife was rendered in a catatonic state for most of it, and at most, she was the fourth or fifth banana. The Kat's dream to be the biggest slut in the WWF was an angle in the midcard because the company needed filler and was catering to the blue ball clientele that the was the early 2000s who were just a few years away from having easy access to internet porn. They weren't the focus of the program, and never were. It wasn't until 2004 when women got the main event RAW when Lita and Trish, who finally got access to proper training, were allowed to wrestle.

It also didn't help that, in North America, the philosophy of most trash bag promotions was "Monkey See, Monkey Do" with what WWF did, as opposed to looking at what Japan, or Mexico, or even Europe was doing differently. So, as long as WWE's main philosophy was "show off the tiddy", these promotions would decide "let's show off more tiddy", particularly during the 2000s, where the only female promotion was Women's Extreme Wrestling. Less said about that promotion, the better.

And, WWE was a Johnny Come-Lately when it came to women's wrestling in North America. TNA introduced the Knockouts Division before they screwed that up with Gail Hogan and the 560 times they brought back the Beautiful People. Promotions like SHIMMER offered a more legitimate outlet for fans. Only reason WWE went along with it was because NXT was building it up and fans were enjoying that while rejecting the division they had on the main roster, and obviously those gals couldn't stay in NXT forever.

[Deleted]

So it’s not only the fans who have Stockholm Syndrome when it comes to Vince.

Now waiting on the black wrestler, probably Woods, who will say Vince was never racist, it was the fans who interpreted it that way, which exposed their own racist tendencies. Or something.

[Shark]

She's not right, but she's not wrong either. I recall about a month after #GiveDivasAChance was trending, an arena full of fans, many I'm sure participated in that hashtag, chanted "You suck Cena/Bryan/Punk/Uso" at the women during a match the night after Wrestlemania. Months later in Brooklyn during a women's match, fans chanted for Lana because she wasn't out there during the women's match crapping all over it. People like to say WWE conditioned fans to act this way, but we can break that conditioning easily. Especially if we're already screaming for change. WWE isn't innocent, but neither are fans.

[benstudd]

Full shill mode. The other day in an interview a guy asked her "as someone who is friend with Becky don't you think the money fight at Mania is Becky vs Ronda for the title?". She went on about including Charlotte is better and so forth. Pretty disappointing.

[adamclark52]

Feb 22, 2019 13:57:56 GMT -5 realist said:

To be fair, Paige is a moron.

/thread

[Deleted]

"It was never WWE holding the women back. It was the fans" - Paige

[Deleted]

Yeah... I love Paige but she’s way off here.

For a short time period in 2002-2005, women’s wrestling WAS taken seriously. We had Lita, Trish, Jazz, Molly, Victoria, Gail Kim, Mickie, etc. It wasn’t as big as it is NOW but it was still respected for a while.

Then 2007-2014 happened. There were some bright points... McCool, Beth, Melina and Natalya. But that’s really about it. None of the others had any business being in a wrestling ring. AJ and Paige started the change... and then the 4 Horsewomen came along and now we have a roster full of brilliant wrestlers.

There’s no bikini models anymore, no “2 minute matches”... that had nothing to do with fans. That was all WWE.

[Doctor No]

A unsurprising “Flat Earther” style take from a easily manipulated/duped mind.

[Deleted]

Yeah, it was the fans who decided to throw the entire women's division into a single match at WrestleMania, give it under seven minutes, have it directly follow the end of the Streak so no one on earth could possibly care about it, and then have the champion lose the belt the next night on Raw in one move.

[hassanchop]

Are they gonna blame the fans for the failures of the Invasion and the rebranding of ECW?

[ben:friendship frog]

Feb 22, 2019 14:07:51 GMT -5 eJm said:

I feel it's really unfair to put anything on Paige for this, to be honest. Yes, it's a really dumb thing to say but considering everyone else's interviews lately, it's more towing the company line but really badly.

She's not a robot. There's literally dozens of women in the company who haven't said this shit.




But yes Paige, it was the fans that made Kid Rock do a 10 minute concert during the women's entrances for the only match(a crap battle Royal won by a man) at Wrestlemania.
I hold my hands up. That was all my fault.

[cjh]

She's not only wrong, but I think one aspect of the division has actually gotten worse as I believe WWE actually did a better job back then of quietly acknowledging that some of the girls were there for their wrestling talent and some were eye candy.  Today, they seem to all be treated pretty much equally to each other, and someone who isn't very good will be booked to KO or submit her opponents.

[This Player Hating Mothman]

Feb 22, 2019 14:41:54 GMT -5 warriorthug4edge said:

That said, yeah, she's wrong. I don't blame her for not bashing her employer, but no.

Know what? I kinda do. Paige right now is in a really bulletproof place of not being an active roster member who can have her push f***ed with and being the subject of a Rock-produced movie WWE is deep in the media cycle of shilling for. f*** it, take a stand. Be honest and critical of what happened. Hell, sugarcoat it even; they never knew there was this much demand for womens' wrestling to be so much more but they came around to it and it's been successful. Be honest about it instead of accepting the insane line that it's all the fans' fault and WWE never does anything wrong. You don't need to bash your employer to take them to task and be honest about this shit, and taking a massive dump all over the fans whose outrage is the entire reason anything changed in the first place is absolutely a cowardly move. Anyone toeing the PR line this bad is complicit in that bullshit, I'll blame her plenty for that. WWE can't be allowed to rewrite the history books on thiso ne.

[2coldMack is even more baffled]

Feb 22, 2019 22:02:46 GMT -5 This Player Hating Mothman said:

Feb 22, 2019 14:41:54 GMT -5 warriorthug4edge said:

That said, yeah, she's wrong. I don't blame her for not bashing her employer, but no.

Know what? I kinda do. Paige right now is in a really bulletproof place of not being an active roster member who can have her push f***ed with and being the subject of a Rock-produced movie WWE is deep in the media cycle of shilling for. f*** it, take a stand. Be honest and critical of what happened. Hell, sugarcoat it even; they never knew there was this much demand for womens' wrestling to be so much more but they came around to it and it's been successful. Be honest about it instead of accepting the insane line that it's all the fans' fault and WWE never does anything wrong. You don't need to bash your employer to take them to task and be honest about this shit, and taking a massive dump all over the fans whose outrage is the entire reason anything changed in the first place is absolutely a cowardly move. Anyone toeing the PR line this bad is complicit in that bullshit, I'll blame her plenty for that. WWE can't be allowed to rewrite the history books on thiso ne.

Holy shit, I wish I could like this post twenty times.