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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on Apr 5, 2019 12:34:35 GMT -5
I mean, the storyline's been a skin color thing. It's been subtle granted, but stuff like Vince refusing to give a straight answer on his issue with Kofi and Bryan saying, "People like you work twice as hard for half as much," are pretty clear signs that that's what it's been about. That could easily refer to Kofi putting his body on the line night after night just to be awarded a midcard slot. Sorry but... people want race to not be an issue and yet some black people constantly bring it up and put themselves in a minority when literally nobody else brought it up. This story didn’t need or call for a “It’s because I’m black... isn’t it?” moment. I don’t usually say this but if you’re not black you don’t really get to use that line because you don’t understand As I talked about a few weeks ago and as Kofi said this story has a lot of different layers. Kofi knows the history I’m glad he realizes that the position he is in as a black man and the potential to be world champ could mean a lot. Just off that basis, little black kids who want to be world champ look up to him and you also have the racial element of doing your job as good as anyone in the company but never get that promotion because you have reached your proverbial ceiling. That can be felt by everyone but especially black people On the other side, the story can also be felt by everyone. As I said people get looked over and that shit hurt but you finally get your chance to showcase yourself and show why 85% of the people who were put ahead of you shouldn’t have been. Kofi is the every man that everyone can associate with but he is also a black man in which that shit just hits different for minorities |
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on Apr 5, 2019 12:38:59 GMT -5
I’m gonna be honest, watching this angle from the start, I never saw the racial element to the story. As people have said - it’s really subtle, which is why I probably haven’t seen that in the story, but as Kofi said - there’s something for everyone to identify with. For me it’s the underdog tale of an 11 year veteran who’s been quietly working his ass off, doesn’t cause trouble, finally getting his shot. And that’s perfectly fine to because you don’t have to see the racial element. The story is hitting in a lot of different ways people can identity with They aren’t out right throwing it in your face but it’s there which you know is a New Day influence because they always do stuff like that |
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Post by Hit Girl on Apr 5, 2019 12:44:11 GMT -5
People like Kofi don't get to win hemp and wood titles.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2019 13:14:59 GMT -5
I would recommend listening to Post Wrestling's Cafe Hangout they had last week with Nate Milton. It's up on their YouTube channel. They hit on a lot of things I feel about the angle including a lot of the subtle elements they've injected into it. It's a great listen.
As a black fan of pro wrestling, this angle has been one that I've become deeply invested in. There's a relatable element that few stories have for me nowadays. Yet the beauty of the story is that it's relatable on a multitude of levels. It's a rare example of WWE exercising some subtlety.
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Post by Bub (BLM) on Apr 5, 2019 13:50:57 GMT -5
Why bring race into this? Literally nobody minoritized Kofi and yet he’s trying to make it a skin color thing. I can’t be the only one that hopes Bryan wins, can I? Kofi's point is that it can be a skin color thing for people who can identify with that, but it doesn't have to be. New Day has never been about race, but they also embrace and take very seriously their role model status to young black kids. Nothing wrong with Kofi addressing it at all. |
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Post by sportatorium on Apr 5, 2019 14:26:00 GMT -5
Wrestling in general is usuallly terrible weaving nuance into stories. They really nailed it with this one. Daniel Bryan is great as the foil/antagonist here as well.
Kofi telling this story in just looking frustrated & genuinely upset by all of it, yet keeping his composure and just asking for the right thing to be done is about as good we’ve seen babyface booking in years.
A lot of people from a lot of demographics are relating to your babyface and are completely behind him. There isn’t a bigger win in pro wrestling.
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Post by Mister Pigwell on Apr 5, 2019 14:43:43 GMT -5
^Yeah Bryan needs props here as well. As well as Vince. Their roles are exactly what they need to be.
Kofi. Woods. Big E. Bryan. Vince. We know those five.
I'd love to know who else is involved backstage on this one. These five have hit every right button on screen and behind it. The story with the gauntlets maybe not the best, but it was fine enough. Everything else has been good especially considering the short notice they've had for this and how quickly they responded to the crowd's wishes.
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Post by BigAl on Apr 5, 2019 14:55:03 GMT -5
Why bring race into this? Literally nobody minoritized Kofi and yet he’s trying to make it a skin color thing. I can’t be the only one that hopes Bryan wins, can I? Me too but don't really discuss for fear of getting into an arguments |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2019 15:00:37 GMT -5
This Bryan/Kofi feud's already in the running for best feud of 2019 thus far. It's going to be hard to top this year. It has so many elements that you can latch onto.
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Post by Surfer Sandman on Apr 5, 2019 15:05:35 GMT -5
Why bring race into this? Literally nobody minoritized Kofi and yet he’s trying to make it a skin color thing. I can’t be the only one that hopes Bryan wins, can I? "Minoritized" is not a word. I like Daniel but all signs for me, point to a Kofi win. I'm for it. |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2019 15:17:44 GMT -5
I have said this before, but listen to the HHH promo from 2003 (the infamous one). What he said in that promo relates more to New Day than it did to Booker.
"Somebody like you doesn't get to be world champion".
"People like you don't deserve it".
"You're not here to be a competitor, you're here to be an entertainer".
"Entertain me, that's your job".
"You're here to make people like me laugh"
"Dance for me".
Where HHH was slapping the viewers in the face with racism, this storyline has been more subtle, but the points are basically the same. I've said previously, I kinda wish Vince was more like HHH 2003 on TV, but I know why they went this direction. They have just enough leeway to say "it has nothing to do with race" if anyone complains about it, while also being able to tell the story with race as a backdrop without explicitly saying it.
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Post by Mozenrath on Apr 5, 2019 15:20:51 GMT -5
^Yeah Bryan needs props here as well. As well as Vince. Their roles are exactly what they need to be. Kofi. Woods. Big E. Bryan. Vince. We know those five. I'd love to know who else is involved backstage on this one. These five have hit every right button on screen and behind it. The story with the gauntlets maybe not the best, but it was fine enough. Everything else has been good especially considering the short notice they've had for this and how quickly they responded to the crowd's wishes. It almost feels like they took several past angles, like the Booker one, and said, "what worked and what didn't? How do we swing this in a way that doesn't permanently scar characters?" |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2019 15:25:48 GMT -5
To everyone who was disgusted by the Booker incident, depending on how this angle goes will you feel relieved? Sure, nothing can take away from what happened with Booker but I at least will think that they've learned their lesson from before if Kofi wins which is honestly something I never felt they learned. Yeah Booker got the title later on but that whole thing never left me as a fan.
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Post by Mister Pigwell on Apr 5, 2019 15:36:23 GMT -5
To everyone who was disgusted by the Booker incident, depending on how this angle goes will you feel relieved? Sure, nothing can take away from what happened with Booker but I at least will think that they've learned their lesson from before if Kofi wins which is honestly something I never felt they learned. Yeah Booker got the title later on but that whole thing never left me as a fan. No. Doing this one right doesn't "make up" for the f*** up before, but it's a damn good sign that the company can prove that they really can handle these kinds of subjects. It's a W for this one, but that prior L will always be there. |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2019 15:39:15 GMT -5
To everyone who was disgusted by the Booker incident, depending on how this angle goes will you feel relieved? Sure, nothing can take away from what happened with Booker but I at least will think that they've learned their lesson from before if Kofi wins which is honestly something I never felt they learned. Yeah Booker got the title later on but that whole thing never left me as a fan. No. Doing this one right doesn't "make up" for the f*** up before, but it's a damn good sign that the company can prove that they really can handle these kinds of subjects. It's a W for this one, but that prior L will always be there. Yeah that's where I'll be regarding it. That Booker thing is something that I don't think I'll ever feel good about due to what it was. |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2019 15:39:45 GMT -5
There have been a couple warts (Kofi becoming Goldberg in the gauntlet), but overall it's been the most engaging story I've seen since I started watching again in 2016, for reasons that have been covered by others in this thread.
Please, for the love of Christ, don't have E or Woods turn heel. It'd be a colossal misstep that'd murder my interest. I just want to enjoy a storyline from start to finish. For once.
It's not paranoia, it's Vince Mcmahon.
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on Apr 5, 2019 15:39:54 GMT -5
Nah, one don't make up for the other
They learned and have some very smart people working this one as opposed to being tone deaf like they were previously
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2019 15:46:42 GMT -5
To everyone who was disgusted by the Booker incident, depending on how this angle goes will you feel relieved? Sure, nothing can take away from what happened with Booker but I at least will think that they've learned their lesson from before if Kofi wins which is honestly something I never felt they learned. Yeah Booker got the title later on but that whole thing never left me as a fan. Yeah I'm in agreement with the others that it wouldn't make up for it. The Booker T angle was one of the most tone deaf storylines I have ever seen. The premise was fine, but if that was always going to be their ending, then it was some of the worst story telling in the company's history. HHH literally threw a dollar at Booker and told him to get him a towel. I mean, you can't have it end the way it did if you're willing to go there. But definitely a step in the right direction. If they have Kofi win the title then it's at least giving a prominent black talent his time to shine without any foolish stereotypical nonsense behind it. It's a story that everyone can relate to (largely because race hasn't been brought up) and as long as it has a good ending, it will be remembered as a damn good story arc. If Kofi loses, though..... |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2019 15:53:39 GMT -5
To everyone who was disgusted by the Booker incident, depending on how this angle goes will you feel relieved? Sure, nothing can take away from what happened with Booker but I at least will think that they've learned their lesson from before if Kofi wins which is honestly something I never felt they learned. Yeah Booker got the title later on but that whole thing never left me as a fan. Nah. I think that most can agree that if there is a racial element in play here it's pretty understated. Triple H basically said "I'm better than you because I'm white". Then he won (in a way that made Booker look like total garbage), and that was that. I know a lot has changed in 20 years, but 2002 wasn't the the dark ages. That shit shouldn't be forgiven any time soon. |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2019 16:05:53 GMT -5
More than anything what bugs me about Triple H / Booker is the commentary. The entire match is just Lawler being incredibly racist for 20 minutes and then going, "See, I was right!"
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