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Post by holyshida on Aug 7, 2020 12:42:26 GMT -5
There's plenty of evidence that this was the case. Foe example around 16:30 in this interview she says she wanted to go to AEW. www.youtube.com/watch?v=ffN7iZwRvfg She says this in multiple other interviews as well, she clearly wanted to go to AEW and the "she wanted to rebuild herself" is simply her trying to save face that AEW weren't intersted at that time. Also right after it was announced that she was with Impact, Kenny got lots of criticism on twitter and answered some fans that were criticising them on passing on her by saying "we're already happy with the women's division" which pretty much confirmed it. That wasn't evidence of anything besides "I have friends in AEW and there are matches I'd like to have there." She said she'd like to go to Impact, or back to Japan and other international wrestling, too. Literally none of us know if AEW "passed" on her. I mean, seriously, we've had people saying Women of Honor was booked better...I'm sorry, I was at Madison Square Garden when the WOH title got defended on one of the hottest shows of the year, and ROH failed to even get the crowd invested in Mayu freaking Iwatani, who is incredible, holding the title. It's a ridiculous comparison. Its pretty clear she wanted to go to AEW. Every interview AEW is the first company she mentioned where she wanted to go, and Kenny saying he's happy with the women's division would suggest he wasn't very interested in getting her. Let's face it if AEW really wanted her she'd be in AEW now. Yeah I wasn't comparing it to ROH, AEW has a lot of good things going about the division. Signing Tay, Christi Jaynes, Diamante and Ivelisse would be a huge shot in the arm it needs.
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Post by eJm on Aug 7, 2020 13:10:48 GMT -5
Its pretty clear she wanted to go to AEW. Every interview AEW is the first company she mentioned where she wanted to go, and Kenny saying he's happy with the women's division would suggest he wasn't very interested in getting her. Let's face it if AEW really wanted her she'd be in AEW now. Again, you’re reading into stuff that plainly isn’t there just to suit a narrative. Especially when she doesn’t say anything like that in interviews. And what else was Kenny expected to say? “F***, you know what, you’re right, we f***ed up and we made a big mistake. Goddamn, what are we doing?”? Because most people in business wouldn’t do that.
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Post by polarbearpete on Aug 7, 2020 13:23:30 GMT -5
Its pretty clear she wanted to go to AEW. Every interview AEW is the first company she mentioned where she wanted to go, and Kenny saying he's happy with the women's division would suggest he wasn't very interested in getting her. Let's face it if AEW really wanted her she'd be in AEW now. Again, you’re reading into stuff that plainly isn’t there just to suit a narrative. Especially when she doesn’t say anything like that in interviews. And what else was Kenny expected to say? “F***, you know what, you’re right, we f***ed up and we made a big mistake. Goddamn, what are we doing?”? Because most people in business wouldn’t do that. Prior to her saying she can rebuild in Impact, her interview does kind of read like AEW didn’t really go hard after her: “I mean like, some people had reached out, but it was all kind of like fleeting. There was no like, “You’re gonna have a meeting” or, “We’re gonna sit down and do this”. Luckily, I had been to IMPACT before, I know the people there and it was right away like, “We’d like to have you, let’s talk about it when we can”. It was just more of a secure thing..”
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Post by eJm on Aug 7, 2020 13:32:07 GMT -5
Again, you’re reading into stuff that plainly isn’t there just to suit a narrative. Especially when she doesn’t say anything like that in interviews. And what else was Kenny expected to say? “F***, you know what, you’re right, we f***ed up and we made a big mistake. Goddamn, what are we doing?”? Because most people in business wouldn’t do that. Prior to her saying she can rebuild in Impact, her interview does kind of read like AEW didn’t really go hard after her: “I mean like, some people had reached out, but it was all kind of like fleeting. There was no like, “You’re gonna have a meeting” or, “We’re gonna sit down and do this”. Luckily, I had been to IMPACT before, I know the people there and it was right away like, “We’d like to have you, let’s talk about it when we can”. It was just more of a secure thing..” Hey, I’m a fair guy, I can admit that I’m wrong to an extent. That doesn’t mean they reject her at the very least but that they’re more...disorganized? Picky? Neither of those are great looks, I’ll agree.
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Post by Oh Cry Me a Screwball on Aug 7, 2020 13:42:22 GMT -5
I mean, seriously, we've had people saying Women of Honor was booked better...I'm sorry, I was at Madison Square Garden when the WOH title got defended on one of the hottest shows of the year, and ROH failed to even get the crowd invested in Mayu freaking Iwatani, who is incredible, holding the title. It's a ridiculous comparison. I was at Ring of Honor 16th Anniversary, where that title was in its infancy stages. There were two tournament matches on that show, featuring Hana Kimura vs. Sumie Sakai and Tenille Dashwood vs. Brandi Rhodes. For some reason I will never understand, both of those matches were on the YouTube exclusive pre-show, with no women's content on the main card at all. That's when I knew that division was already doomed. Now, AEW definitely had a better first impression of their Women's division, but unfortunately, in it's current form where the women are perennially in a token one match per Dynamite show, and a couple jobber matches on the DARK show, I'm getting the exact same feelings from AEW's women's division that I got watching Hana, Sumie, Tenille, and Brandi jerk the curtain in succession before an RoH PPV.
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Post by HMARK Center on Aug 7, 2020 13:54:52 GMT -5
I mean, seriously, we've had people saying Women of Honor was booked better...I'm sorry, I was at Madison Square Garden when the WOH title got defended on one of the hottest shows of the year, and ROH failed to even get the crowd invested in Mayu freaking Iwatani, who is incredible, holding the title. It's a ridiculous comparison. I was at Ring of Honor 16th Anniversary, where that title was in its infancy stages. There were two tournament matches on that show, featuring Hana Kimura vs. Sumie Sakai and Tenille Dashwood vs. Brandi Rhodes. For some reason I will never understand, both of those matches were on the YouTube exclusive pre-show, with no women's content on the main card at all. That's when I knew that division was already doomed. Now, AEW definitely had a better first impression of their Women's division, but unfortunately, in it's current form where the women are perennially in a token one match per Dynamite show, and a couple jobber matches on the DARK show, I'm getting the exact same feelings from AEW's women's division that I got watching Hana, Sumie, Tenille, and Brandi jerk the curtain in succession before an RoH PPV. I genuinely don't see it; the women in AEW have gotten far more prominent spots on PPVs and major cards, and again, the key is that their full-time women are over, which is something ROH never really committed to for their division. And it's not a "token match" if the women involved have angles and stories, which the full time women do. Whether those stories are good enough? Different argument, and a reasonable one to have, sure. But when Women of Honor was going, it might as well have not even existed in the wider ROH world; it's why there was a glimmer of hope when they announced a new title before the pandemic, they might actually take it seriously this time and get something going, which would be great. As for the Purrazzo quote, again, that goes back to what I said before: part of Impact's current strategy with signing people, male or female, is that they're moving quick on them and not allowing negotiations to go on too long, since they know WWE and AEW can outbid them. Again, for all we know AEW was just doing usual procedure by reaching out for a feeler on where she was, while Impact was much more aggressive. Or maybe they did pass on her! The point is, we don't know.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 7, 2020 14:01:18 GMT -5
Now, AEW definitely had a better first impression of their Women's division, but unfortunately, in it's current form where the women are perennially in a token one match per Dynamite show, and a couple jobber matches on the DARK show, I'm getting the exact same feelings from AEW's women's division that I got watching Hana, Sumie, Tenille, and Brandi jerk the curtain in succession before an RoH PPV. Yeah, it's all in the presentation. Hikaru Shida is your Women's champion and for weeks she's been sitting in the crowd watching the show. Can anyone honestly tell me they'd do this to their male champions? Picture Moxley/Cody/Omega/Page just sitting there, their names never being mentioned, not involved in any angles, just clapping and cheering like a faceless member of the roster. It's never going to happen.
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Celgress
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Post by Celgress on Aug 7, 2020 14:25:24 GMT -5
Did they pass on Deonna? In her Van Vliet interview, it sure sounded like she specifically went to Impact because going right from WWE to AEW would put her under a microscope, and considering NXT didn't use her for shit, she wanted to rebuild herself first. I appreciate this thread so much. Women’s division has easily been AEW’s major weakness. The reality is that we are nearly a year into this division and what memorable angles have they’ve had that don’t involve Britt? With 2 hours each week??? It’s embarrassing and they need to be taken to task for it, especially if they are gonna insist on transparent as day virtue signaling. I get what you are saying, but holy shit, "virtue signaling" is maybe my least favorite expression in the world. The well isn't poisoned so much as it's crawling with demons.I couldn't possibly agree with you more. VS is such a loaded term I avoid using it altogether.
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Celgress
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Post by Celgress on Aug 7, 2020 14:34:24 GMT -5
One of my issues is them not even featuring Shida on the show every week(having her sitting next to the Gunn Club doesn't count). She doesn't have to have a match every week, but a pre-taped promo, like the ones they do for Mox, would do wonders. This is exactly why I've been disappointed in her open challenge. She issues the challenge then literally nothing happens, no matches, no promos, no hype, not a damn thing. The situation is disgraceful especially when another open challenge is simultaneously running just fine.
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Celgress
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Post by Celgress on Aug 7, 2020 14:52:22 GMT -5
I think a combination of heavy commercials and the OC Jericho ending played a part on it And like, let's be real: how many people quickly determined that it would be a short segment where nothing especially exciting happened when they did the math on how much time the main event would get? Because as soon as the segment started and I figured in how long the main event was, I knew it was going to be a two minute squash match even before the reveal/punchline. Everyone knows Mox/Darby isn't going to be five minutes. I agree with you. My loved ones (family and friends) thought Britt was a moron for not having Swole face either Nyla or Abandon (sp?). Once they revealed Reba as Swole's opponent we quickly lost interest because we know in kayfabe Reba is a jobber and thus not on Swole's level.
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Post by Cyno on Aug 7, 2020 14:59:39 GMT -5
Did they pass on Deonna? In her Van Vliet interview, it sure sounded like she specifically went to Impact because going right from WWE to AEW would put her under a microscope, and considering NXT didn't use her for shit, she wanted to rebuild herself first. I get what you are saying, but holy shit, "virtue signaling" is maybe my least favorite expression in the world. The well isn't poisoned so much as it's crawling with demons.I couldn't possibly agree with you more. VS is such a loaded term I avoid using it altogether. The well's been so poisoned for that term that anytime I see it used, I think the person is either an SQW or a troll and dismiss it out of hand. Or both.
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Post by Andee9001 on Aug 7, 2020 15:09:52 GMT -5
In my opinion it isn't a great division but i don't think it's as bad as some people do. They've built a division up from scratch that didn't have a recognizeable name behind it. They didn't have a Cody or the Bucks or a Jericho of the division. Like it or not building stars takes time. Could they be doing more? Yes. I think Shida is my favourite in the promotion right now. She just comes accross as such a star. It really is a waste to not do more with her. But i do think they are trying and are heading in the right direction. The tag tournament is a great idea. Also it didn't help losing Britt, Statlander and access to some of the international wrestlers which was a pretty big blow. In saying that they just need to start building up more wrestlers. More tv time and more angles. In a perfect world bring in Dutch Mantel since he had so much success with the Knockouts division.
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markymark
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Post by markymark on Aug 8, 2020 16:03:32 GMT -5
Shouldve put this on Dynamite, but its a start.....
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Post by Ronny Rayguns Is All Elite on Aug 8, 2020 19:24:51 GMT -5
Shouldve put this on Dynamite, but its a start..... This just reminds me how much I loved that Nyla/Shida match where she won the title
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Post by Xxcjb01xX [PIECE OF: SH-] on Aug 8, 2020 20:27:40 GMT -5
Here's hoping we get a big surprise like a Sienna or a Thunder Rosa. Honestly I wouldn't mind a shakeup where Shida lost the belt in this Open Challenge either but either way it's good for the girls to get consistent matches
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Post by Dr. Bolty, Disaster Enby on Aug 8, 2020 21:55:31 GMT -5
My personal fantasy book for the open challenge would be Leyla Hirsch. Her combination of unassuming/unintimidating look with lightning fast technical wrestling would be a perfect story for a surprise appearance.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 8, 2020 22:46:24 GMT -5
If nothing else I think it's incredibly telling that all of the other belts have main-evented Dynamite yet despite all of their belts supposedly being equal the Women's one never has.
Then again the same complaint can be leveraged at the tag division to a lesser extent - despite supposedly being a company where tag teams can main event the only time the tag division's ever closed a PPV was when there was nothing else on the show that conceivably could have.
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Post by Oh Cry Me a Screwball on Aug 8, 2020 22:50:30 GMT -5
And like, let's be real: how many people quickly determined that it would be a short segment where nothing especially exciting happened when they did the math on how much time the main event would get? Because as soon as the segment started and I figured in how long the main event was, I knew it was going to be a two minute squash match even before the reveal/punchline. Everyone knows Mox/Darby isn't going to be five minutes. I agree with you. My loved ones (family and friends) thought Britt was a moron for not having Swole face either Nyla or Abandon (sp?). Once they revealed Reba as Swole's opponent we quickly lost interest because we know in kayfabe Reba is a jobber and thus not on Swole's level. I don't mind that, because the implication is that Britt is so unlikable and overbearing, she can't find anyone willing to align with her except for her stooge. However, if you run a match that's really just an angle, there needs to be another women's match on the show. In fact, they could stand to have two women's matches on every show, but doubly so in this instance.
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Shark
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Post by Shark on Aug 8, 2020 23:35:20 GMT -5
If nothing else I think it's incredibly telling that all of the other belts have main-evented Dynamite yet despite all of their belts supposedly being equal the Women's one never has. Then again the same complaint can be leveraged at the tag division to a lesser extent - despite supposedly being a company where tag teams can main event the only time the tag division's ever closed a PPV was when there was nothing else on the show that conceivably could have. I thought the women's title had main evented Dynamite? Didn't they make a big deal about that at some point? Was the match between Riho and Nyla to crown the first champion the main event? Or a match soon after?
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Post by holyshida on Aug 8, 2020 23:38:51 GMT -5
Here's hoping we get a big surprise like a Sienna or a Thunder Rosa. Honestly I wouldn't mind a shakeup where Shida lost the belt in this Open Challenge either but either way it's good for the girls to get consistent matches I think Shida should should get a long and dominant title run until next year, taking the title off her right now wouldn't make much sense since in ring she's been pretty much carrying the division the last few months. The best thing they can do is keep it on her while they build the rest of the division. Basically the challengers you can have for Shida are. All Out - Nyla - Steel cage match. Then between All Out and full gear she can have a filler feud with Abadon, similar to her feud with Ford. Full gear - you can put Shida with either Swole or Tay if she's signed. Both are PPV worthy matches. Then between Full gear and revolution you can have her in matches with Allie, Ivelisse etc Revolution - If Statlander is back by then you can have her turn heel on her friend which sets this match up, if not then hopefully Rhio or Bea are allowed back, all are PPV worthy matches. Double or nothing - Britt - This is where I'd have Shida lose the title, one year after winning it.
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