Chiral
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Post by Chiral on May 16, 2021 21:26:56 GMT -5
I'd be more confident about Big E being The One if he wasn't in his own "the heel wins a weird amount" feud right now in the 5 month (!!!) Apollo storyline
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Post by GuyOfOwnage on May 16, 2021 21:27:19 GMT -5
My take on this whole thing has been, and will continue to be, is that Roman himself has been killing it this entire time, but the booking is stale beyond stale, formulaic, repetitive, and just flat-out stinks. While I would've preferred he not beat Cesaro clean as a sheet tonight, I enjoyed the match and thought it had solid psychology. But again, the booking is just awful, awful, awful right now.
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Post by Friday Night SmackOwn on May 16, 2021 21:27:48 GMT -5
I kinda see Roman's endgame coming this summer, and I hope it's in an absolute war where his usual tricks completely backfire and the babyface who topples him looks like a f***ing badass doing so (think how Jon Moxley won the AEW Title versus Jericho or how Batista defeated Triple H).
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Post by EoE: Well There's Your Problem on May 16, 2021 21:29:23 GMT -5
I’ve always said the problem is lack of balance. Ironic in a company that loves the 50/50, but it’s true. It’s either dominant heels putting away challengers cleanly or cowardly heels escaping through the usual tropes (which, yeah, the point is to make you mad, but still), or babyfaces easily dropping the heels without breaking so much as a sweat, which also gets old fast.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 16, 2021 21:29:29 GMT -5
My take on this whole thing has been, and will continue to be, is that Roman himself has been killing it this entire time, but the booking is stale beyond stale, formulaic, repetitive, and just flat-out stinks. While I would've preferred he not beat Cesaro clean as a sheet tonight, I enjoyed the match and thought it had solid psychology. But again, the booking is just awful, awful, awful right now. Yeah, do feel like I should stress that part right now - my issues are with the way Roman's character is being written and how every one of his matches ends on the most limp, drawn out buzzkill note imaginable. In terms of his role he's killing it.
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Chiral
Salacious Crumb
Posts: 76,589
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Post by Chiral on May 16, 2021 21:31:58 GMT -5
I kinda see Roman's endgame coming this summer, and I hope it's in an absolute war where his usual tricks completely backfire and the babyface who topples him looks like a f***ing badass doing so (think how Jon Moxley won the AEW Title versus Jericho or how Batista defeated Triple H). My fantasy booking is Big E is Joseph Joestar and he goes full "NEXT YOU'LL SAY" to every single one of Roman's tricks, shattering his proud facade, then crushing him and taking his belt.
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Post by Friday Night SmackOwn on May 16, 2021 21:32:15 GMT -5
I’ve always said the problem is lack of balance. Ironic in a company that loves the 50/50, but it’s true. It’s either dominant heels putting away challengers cleanly or cowardly heels escaping through the usual tropes (which, yeah, the point is to make you mad, but still), or babyfaces easily dropping the heels without breaking so much as a sweat, which also gets old fast. How wins and losses are perceived in WWE (to the point where one of our running things is calling continual losers "bitches") kinda contributes to this, too.
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Post by jjohns828 on May 16, 2021 21:33:49 GMT -5
The issue with Romans whole character now is now really coming into light because the redundency is becoming obvious.....this was great when his reign was still in its early phase but the KO feud really exposed it and the longer this goes on the more damage it does. It is just a cycle of the samethings....he either wins with Uce interference or he just bowls through another babyface challenger cleanly and moves on rinse and repeat...and it is not only damaging to SD as a whole but all the effort they have put in to try and rehab Roman to get the fans to buy into this cool tribal chief and maybe finally set him up to be this beloved babyface they couldn't get the last time....but they are squandering that now. I know that it's already having that effect for me. I've gone from being interested in Reigns for the first time in years to having no interest in watching him at all. I only watched this match because Cesaro is one of my favorite current wrestlers but I doubt I'm going to sit through anymore Reigns title defenses and at this point I might be done with Smackdown all together.
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Post by Error on May 16, 2021 21:34:46 GMT -5
I kinda see Roman's endgame coming this summer, Pretty much. It'd be stupid to end a run like this until you have fans in the stands. SummerSlam, return to live touring and crowning of a new champ make more sense than this scenario. Plus that looked like awrite out for a Cesaro injury so it would make even less sense to put it on him off that is the case.
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Post by EoE: Well There's Your Problem on May 16, 2021 21:36:18 GMT -5
I’ve always said the problem is lack of balance. Ironic in a company that loves the 50/50, but it’s true. It’s either dominant heels putting away challengers cleanly or cowardly heels escaping through the usual tropes (which, yeah, the point is to make you mad, but still), or babyfaces easily dropping the heels without breaking so much as a sweat, which also gets old fast. How wins and losses are perceived in WWE (to the point where one of our running things is calling continual losers "bitches") kinda contributes to this, too. Before tonight, Cesaro was on the longest televised win streak of his entire WWE run, having not lost at all since the Elimination Chamber in February. Three months. And you probably wouldn’t have noticed that, because they just don’t talk about that kind of thing.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 16, 2021 21:38:31 GMT -5
In Kayfabe Big E has spent 5 months struggling to beat Apollo...dat boy aint beating Roman sorry lol.
IMO If he is ready to go I say send Keith to SD immediately here soon and build him to beat Roman at summerslam because really what else is there left.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 16, 2021 21:38:45 GMT -5
Hell in a Cell's now in June so the question is...what will the Reigns match will be?
Money in the Bank is in July and Summerslam is in August. Apparently fans will be at MITB too.
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Post by Deleted on May 16, 2021 21:40:25 GMT -5
Really not a fan of the Cesaro/Rollins feud continuing, even though the HIAC match was a banger.
Seriously, Raw and SD need to come up with some new f***ing ideas.
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Post by El Cokehead del Knife Fight on May 16, 2021 21:41:16 GMT -5
So who now? Cesaro got beat clean as a whistle and didn't look like he was on Roman's level. The last credible face is Big E and it's crickets otherwise
And Big E isn't even that credible since he's been feuding with Apollo for five months and been struggling against him as of late.
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Chiral
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Posts: 76,589
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Post by Chiral on May 16, 2021 21:43:49 GMT -5
So who now? Cesaro got beat clean as a whistle and didn't look like he was on Roman's level. The last credible face is Big E and it's crickets otherwise Remember that gauntlet match where it looked like they were finally gonna use Shinsuke in a prominent position again? That's right, it's finally time they do what that match set up.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 16, 2021 21:43:56 GMT -5
I think the big reason people like Joe, Braun, and to an extent Owens caught reputations for being gigantic losers is because WWE generally acts like title matches are the only things that actually matter so they're what people actually remember. Like Braun's only lost two singles matches since August but it's hard to really see him as some huge threat because guy failed to win the Universal title 800 times previously, had it for a couple of months during which time he spent the whole thing being a total afterthought, has since losing it lost five or six more title matches on top of that, and was transparently only in the triple threat to take the pin because they value him less than they do Drew and Lashley.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on May 16, 2021 21:44:04 GMT -5
Hell in a Cell's now in June so the question is...what the Reigns match will be. Money in the Bank is in July and Summerslam is in August. Apparently fans will be at MITB too. I would say Nakamura but do people really wanna see Nakamura killed especially as he is now he seems to be recovering from his years of just treated like trash idk because it will do nothing to change the perception that SD is just the land of misery where Roman just bowls through all the babyfaces.
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Post by Friday Night SmackOwn on May 16, 2021 21:45:02 GMT -5
Might be time for Drew Mac to switch brands? Being the dude to end two big bad heel title runs within a span of two years would be a big credibility booster.
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Post by Final Countdown Jones on May 16, 2021 21:45:25 GMT -5
Great match tonight but the commentators talking up Cesaro's fighting spirit while he lays there completely useless as Roman slowly finishes him off and then post-match acts like it took no effort at all really shows the problem with this title reign. But the whole character is him being untouchable and no selling stuff like this. See I think that's the problem though; that's the least interesting possible character to be running with. Roman is not some cold, numb powerbeast who only craves violence. He's an unstable, vain egomaniac whose cool control is all a massive front he's putting on. Just earlier in the show, he sent his goon to the back for implying there was a chance Cesaro might have him and that he'd need to interfere. That should have been foreshadowing for Roman almost getting caught and him being pissed over it. The comeuppance people wanted was pretty expressly for an opponent to take give him such a fight that the cracks showed more blatantly, and when he immediately goes into 'Yeah I'm such a badass and don't feel anything' mode right after the match, it represents the failure on Cesaro's part to give him that kind of challenge. In a way it's not about the match result at that point; Cesaro losing but undermining Roman in the process is still a kind of victory. This is true in just about any form of media ever unless you're trying to make an artistic statement with it, but "Guy who doesn't let anything effect him emotionally" is a trash character.
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Post by Friday Night SmackOwn on May 16, 2021 21:47:17 GMT -5
But the whole character is him being untouchable and no selling stuff like this. See I think that's the problem though; that's the least interesting possible character to be running with. Roman is not some cold, numb powerbeast who only craves violence. He's an unstable, vain egomaniac whose cool control is all a massive front he's putting on. Just earlier in the show, he sent his goon to the back for implying there was a chance Cesaro might have him and that he'd need to interfere. That should have been foreshadowing for Roman almost getting caught and him being pissed over it. The comeuppance people wanted was pretty expressly for an opponent to take give him such a fight that the cracks showed more blatantly, and when he immediately goes into 'Yeah I'm such a badass and don't feel anything' mode right after the match, it represents the failure on Cesaro's part to give him that kind of challenge. In a way it's not about the match result at that point; Cesaro losing but undermining Roman in the process is still a kind of victory. This is true in just about any form of media ever unless you're trying to make an artistic statement with it, but "Guy who doesn't let anything effect him emotionally" is a trash character. IMO, they should've gone with the angle of the Swing being the most potent weapon in Cesaro's arsenal and Roman desperately trying to avoid getting caught in it. Which leads to him getting Swung around and therefore bruising his ego.
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