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Post by A Platypus Rave is Correct on Aug 9, 2021 22:36:50 GMT -5
Re: this being her idea...correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't Stardust originally Cody Rhodes' idea? At minimum, it was his choice at one point to continue the gimmick. That didn't make it less valid that at a certain point, he wanted out because of what WWE creative had made of the gimmick. You're 100% right. Yeah, I don't remember if it was his idea... but he didn't want to drop it until after a certain feud... and then after the feud they just kept doing it and he wanted it dropped and they wouldn't. I still give props to Cody for that though regardless of not wanting to do it even in his last appearance as Stardust he still gave it his all.
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mistery
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Post by mistery on Aug 9, 2021 22:38:36 GMT -5
And honestly I say put her against Alexa asap because a gimmick like this only works best against another wacky gimmick like Alexas. If you put it against the Charlottes or the Rheas or any realistic wrestlers then it falls straight on it's face. Hard. We know they'll feud soon so the quicker the better. It's like Ambrose when he went against Wyatt. Those 2 gimmicks worked best against each other because they weren't the standard "hey guys I wanna wrestle, ok cool gimme my gear and lemme go" type of characters. Honestly that probably wouldn't be the best idea either. Even Alexa got fairly mixed reactions tonight. I think the problem just basically boils down to that its somewhat likely Nikki retains at Summerslam, but I can see her dropping it at the next PPV after that (which seems to be Extreme Rules). Hopefully not to Charlotte. I would bring back Asuka after Summerslam and just have her turn heel (although it wouldn't work because Nikki is just that uninteresting) and win the title. Especially since Survivor Series is the next PPV the women are allowed to be a part of after that (there is a Saudi show between Extreme Rules and Survivor Series), and I think its safe to say the interest in a Bianca/Nikki match would be zero.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 9, 2021 22:45:19 GMT -5
And honestly I say put her against Alexa asap because a gimmick like this only works best against another wacky gimmick like Alexas. If you put it against the Charlottes or the Rheas or any realistic wrestlers then it falls straight on it's face. Hard. We know they'll feud soon so the quicker the better. It's like Ambrose when he went against Wyatt. Those 2 gimmicks worked best against each other because they weren't the standard "hey guys I wanna wrestle, ok cool gimme my gear and lemme go" type of characters. Honestly that probably wouldn't be the best idea either. Even Alexa got fairly mixed reactions tonight. I think the problem just basically boils down to that its somewhat likely Nikki retains at Summerslam, but I can see her dropping it at the next PPV after that (which seems to be Extreme Rules). Hopefully not to Charlotte. I would bring back Asuka after Summerslam and just have her turn heel (although it wouldn't work because Nikki is just that uninteresting) and win the title. Especially since Survivor Series is the next PPV the women are allowed to be a part of after that (there is a Saudi show between Extreme Rules and Survivor Series), and I think its safe to say the interest in a Bianca/Nikki match would be zero. Wow the crowd's already turned on Alexa huh, that was mad quick. Not surprised though.
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mistery
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Post by mistery on Aug 9, 2021 22:46:40 GMT -5
Honestly that probably wouldn't be the best idea either. Even Alexa got fairly mixed reactions tonight. I think the problem just basically boils down to that its somewhat likely Nikki retains at Summerslam, but I can see her dropping it at the next PPV after that (which seems to be Extreme Rules). Hopefully not to Charlotte. I would bring back Asuka after Summerslam and just have her turn heel (although it wouldn't work because Nikki is just that uninteresting) and win the title. Especially since Survivor Series is the next PPV the women are allowed to be a part of after that (there is a Saudi show between Extreme Rules and Survivor Series), and I think its safe to say the interest in a Bianca/Nikki match would be zero. Wow the crowd's already turned on Alexa huh, that was mad quick. Not surprised though. Yup. Got some groans from the Lilly stuff tonight, when they weren't busy chanting WE WANT WYATT.
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Post by A Platypus Rave is Correct on Aug 9, 2021 22:47:47 GMT -5
Honestly that probably wouldn't be the best idea either. Even Alexa got fairly mixed reactions tonight. I think the problem just basically boils down to that its somewhat likely Nikki retains at Summerslam, but I can see her dropping it at the next PPV after that (which seems to be Extreme Rules). Hopefully not to Charlotte. I would bring back Asuka after Summerslam and just have her turn heel (although it wouldn't work because Nikki is just that uninteresting) and win the title. Especially since Survivor Series is the next PPV the women are allowed to be a part of after that (there is a Saudi show between Extreme Rules and Survivor Series), and I think its safe to say the interest in a Bianca/Nikki match would be zero. Wow the crowd's already turned on Alexa huh, that was mad quick. Not surprised though. Well if they didn't fire Wyatt she'd still probably be as over as normal... but they did... and since her gimmick was tied to Wyatt... We want wyatt chants.
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Post by DrBackflipsHoffman on Aug 9, 2021 22:48:50 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Aug 9, 2021 23:02:37 GMT -5
Wow the crowd's already turned on Alexa huh, that was mad quick. Not surprised though. Yup. Got some groans from the Lilly stuff tonight, when they weren't busy chanting WE WANT WYATT. Wow the crowd's already turned on Alexa huh, that was mad quick. Not surprised though. Well if they didn't fire Wyatt she'd still probably be as over as normal... but they did... and since her gimmick was tied to Wyatt... We want wyatt chants. Wow, that's sad. Damn. Today was Alexa's birthday too.
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markymark
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Post by markymark on Aug 9, 2021 23:15:17 GMT -5
The fact that she's supposed to be a totally different person is so so dumb. Like she looks exactly the same you can't Joseph Park me. So Nikki is now Abyssmania but with better in ring skills?
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Post by Lizuka #BLM on Aug 9, 2021 23:19:06 GMT -5
Yeah, I don't remember if it was his idea... but he didn't want to drop it until after a certain feud... and then after the feud they just kept doing it and he wanted it dropped and they wouldn't. I still give props to Cody for that though regardless of not wanting to do it even in his last appearance as Stardust he still gave it his all. Granted he did for awhile there hit a point of clearly not giving a shit when he was having really bad matches with Sami Zayn.
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Post by Final Countdown Jones on Aug 9, 2021 23:25:15 GMT -5
Re: this being her idea...correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't Stardust originally Cody Rhodes' idea? At minimum, it was his choice at one point to continue the gimmick. That didn't make it less valid that at a certain point, he wanted out because of what WWE creative had made of the gimmick. Yeah, there's also the possibility this isn't even Nikki's idea anymore but in spite of Vince's obsession with infantilizing women who aren't his type, she has no leverage and this malformed push is at least getting her a title run, so she's taking it. Someone's making these bad decisions and they're making it onto the show in spite of how embarrassing it's becoming. That's a problem.
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Post by Big DSR Energy on Aug 9, 2021 23:29:50 GMT -5
I think back to the Raw where Nikki debuted the costume, and the Raw Talk afterwards, where she basically said "I know I'm not really a superhero, like I can't fly or dodge bullets, but wearing this costume I feel like I can take on anybody!" The idea was still kinda corny, but to me at least it felt more...respectable? Or maybe because I think Nikki seems like a nice person in real life I wanted to buy into this gimmick, but it's not really working out? I dunno.
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Post by Feargus McReddit on Aug 10, 2021 3:01:22 GMT -5
OK, so let me understand this;
Nikki Cross gets two (screwy) wins over the Raw Women’s Champion and the Number One contender (that being the most decorated in her generation), she uses this to think she needs more courage for some reason, wears a costume where she doesn’t really get any more wins than she did before, wins MITB and subsequently the championship but as a result, grows to see she is actually out of anyone’s league as she loses to both the former champion and the number one contender because….
Am I getting this right?
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Post by HMARK Center on Aug 10, 2021 6:38:12 GMT -5
OK, so let me understand this; Nikki Cross gets two (screwy) wins over the Raw Women’s Champion and the Number One contender (that being the most decorated in her generation), she uses this to think she needs more courage for some reason, wears a costume where she doesn’t really get any more wins than she did before, wins MITB and subsequently the championship but as a result, grows to see she is actually out of anyone’s league as she loses to both the former champion and the number one contender because…. Am I getting this right? And most importantly, for some reason they expect you to root her on as she keeps either losing, getting beaten down, or doubting herself. I’m genuinely trying to imagine how modern Vince would have handled 1984 Hulk Hogan and it’s terrifying to ponder.
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Push R Truth
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Post by Push R Truth on Aug 10, 2021 6:45:48 GMT -5
I’m genuinely trying to imagine how modern Vince would have handled 1984 Hulk Hogan and it’s terrifying to ponder. Today's Vince would totally have made Hogan tap to Sheik's Camel Clutch at WrestleMania. Then he'd spend the next year or so trying to get Hogan over and wondering why it's not working. Then Hogan gets over with the live crowd again organically but at Wrestlemania 3 he'd have Andre squash Hogan (because Andre is the part timer star) and start the process all over again.
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Post by MrElijah on Aug 10, 2021 7:14:45 GMT -5
OK, so let me understand this; Nikki Cross gets two (screwy) wins over the Raw Women’s Champion and the Number One contender (that being the most decorated in her generation), she uses this to think she needs more courage for some reason, wears a costume where she doesn’t really get any more wins than she did before, wins MITB and subsequently the championship but as a result, grows to see she is actually out of anyone’s league as she loses to both the former champion and the number one contender because…. Am I getting this right? And most importantly, for some reason they expect you to root her on as she keeps either losing, getting beaten down, or doubting herself. I’m genuinely trying to imagine how modern Vince would have handled 1984 Hulk Hogan and it’s terrifying to ponder. "Don't interact with the people so much and stop the facial expressions! Also get into position for Dunn's cuts, pal!" I'm genuinely curious of Modern Vince dealing with Hogan at the height of his political powers, The Kliq, Savage, Ventura and Piper
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Post by Lizuka #BLM on Aug 10, 2021 7:22:04 GMT -5
I’m genuinely trying to imagine how modern Vince would have handled 1984 Hulk Hogan and it’s terrifying to ponder. Today's Vince would totally have made Hogan tap to Sheik's Camel Clutch at WrestleMania. Then he'd spend the next year or so trying to get Hogan over and wondering why it's not working. Then Hogan gets over with the live crowd again organically but at Wrestlemania 3 he'd have Andre squash Hogan (because Andre is the part timer star) and start the process all over again. Andre beats Hogan at WrestleMania 3, Hogan cuts a promo complaining that no one smartened him up, Hogan loses to him again at Saturday Night's Main Event, then he finally beats Andre at Survivor Series in four minutes after Andre gets distracted with King Kong Bundy trying to cash in Money in the Bank.
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Post by kingoftheindies on Aug 10, 2021 10:38:05 GMT -5
In an alternative world. You continue the Nikki doubting herself story they did from Smackdown but have either Shane Helms or Molly Holly come in and introduce them to the Hurricane/Mighty Molly character as a way for them to have confidence. Have her start winning, even fluky, with the ASH costume. Have her be champ and be inspirational and have her win showing confidence. You then see a heel like Charlotte destroy her and the mask. Nikki has little confidence Hurricane/Molly give Pep talk taking Nikki doesn't need to play superhero to win. Nikki wins title sans mask.
You have an inspirational story for kids... hell I legit modified a 10 minute episode of Rugrats from when Chucky became a super hero... it'd probably work too
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Post by HMARK Center on Aug 10, 2021 13:26:40 GMT -5
In an alternative world. You continue the Nikki doubting herself story they did from Smackdown but have either Shane Helms or Molly Holly come in and introduce them to the Hurricane/Mighty Molly character as a way for them to have confidence. Have her start winning, even fluky, with the ASH costume. Have her be champ and be inspirational and have her win showing confidence. You then see a heel like Charlotte destroy her and the mask. Nikki has little confidence Hurricane/Molly give Pep talk taking Nikki doesn't need to play superhero to win. Nikki wins title sans mask. You have an inspirational story for kids... hell I legit modified a 10 minute episode of Rugrats from when Chucky became a super hero... it'd probably work too Oh, you're right, the story essentially writes itself: Nikki is sad that she lost her best friend once Alexa went all Fiend-y, and you can show it impacting her confidence via promos and how she conducts herself in her next few matches. Then you have her get the inspiration to become an "almost hero": like you say, maybe Helms or Molly could be the catalyst, or Nikki can decide to do it herself or whatever, and you show it gradually rebuilding her as she starts wrestling in a way that's more sure of herself. Then get to the spot where she loses that momentum, where Charlotte or another heel rags on her for "playing dress up" and destroys her mask or something, have Nikki feel sad and alone again, then have Helms/Molly/whatever other mentor figure give the whole "the bravery was in you all along" talk, then Nikki reemerges with a new, slicker outfit and stronger demeanor, leading up to her finally having the confidence not only to take on the best of her division, but also to finally confront her former friend and try to get her back. Basically, if they took "Nikki is dressing as a superhero now and it's helping her wrestle better" and made it the core of Act I of this story, I think the fans would've taken to it and gone along for the ride. Instead it's "Nikki was a badass before, but now she's acting like she's totally unsure of herself for no good reason, and even in this weird new outfit she's being booked like she doesn't belong near the title." How can the audience even begin to figure out the way to react to that?
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Post by Mozenrath on Aug 13, 2021 0:23:16 GMT -5
OK, so let me understand this; Nikki Cross gets two (screwy) wins over the Raw Women’s Champion and the Number One contender (that being the most decorated in her generation), she uses this to think she needs more courage for some reason, wears a costume where she doesn’t really get any more wins than she did before, wins MITB and subsequently the championship but as a result, grows to see she is actually out of anyone’s league as she loses to both the former champion and the number one contender because…. Am I getting this right? And most importantly, for some reason they expect you to root her on as she keeps either losing, getting beaten down, or doubting herself. I’m genuinely trying to imagine how modern Vince would have handled 1984 Hulk Hogan and it’s terrifying to ponder. He would have had him for a couple of months, then Hogan gets pissed and goes either back to AWA or to Japan again, or elsewhere. No way he'd tolerate getting squandered.
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Post by Xxcjb01xX [PIECE OF: SH-] on Aug 16, 2021 19:53:16 GMT -5
Lost to Rhea Ripley clean as a sheet this week. Five days before Summerslam.
Has not lost to both of her opponents before her first title defense.
And she just keeps cutting the same f***ing promo about why she wears her outfit to believe in herself and that she's ALMOST a superhero.
This is getting very f***ing dire...
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