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Post by Feargus McReddit on Apr 25, 2022 17:40:32 GMT -5
Not gonna copy and paste the whole thing in here since its incredibly long, but MLW is demanding the suit continue, claiming WWE still has a monopoly on the wrestling marketplace, and to "give MLW time to find a better reason to sue WWE": www.pwinsider.com/article/158217/mlw-responds-to-wwes-motion-to-dismiss-lawsuit.html?p=1Court Bauer just needs to let this go at this point. He's widely despised by pretty much everyone in the business, and won't see a single cent from this. That's not what this says. I'm the last person to ever defend Bauer's carny ass, but this isn't out of the ordinary for a case like this. The goal seems to be to drag WWE into discovery (so they'd have to open up a lot) or to get them to settle out for a solid chunk Yeah, reading through it myself, this seems more like them going “Erm, this doesn’t change what we said” and just hoping WWE settles (which, really, they’ll likely do because some of the stuff WWE brought up could be countered in court ala the AEW stuff).
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Post by mistery on Apr 25, 2022 17:44:49 GMT -5
Not gonna copy and paste the whole thing in here since its incredibly long, but MLW is demanding the suit continue, claiming WWE still has a monopoly on the wrestling marketplace, and to "give MLW time to find a better reason to sue WWE": www.pwinsider.com/article/158217/mlw-responds-to-wwes-motion-to-dismiss-lawsuit.html?p=1Court Bauer just needs to let this go at this point. He's widely despised by pretty much everyone in the business, and won't see a single cent from this. That's not what this says. I'm the last person to ever defend Bauer's carny ass, but this isn't out of the ordinary for a case like this. The goal seems to be to drag WWE into discovery (so they'd have to open up a lot) or to get them to settle out for a solid chunk They are pretty much demanding more time to find a way to sue WWE. Also for all the talk about wanting to drag WWE into the discovery phase, it isn't gonna happen. And I doubt they are going to settle with Court either. Jerry McDevitt is a lot of things (a terrible person, and as heartless and as ruthless as Vince McMahon), but he's one of the most competent corporate attorneys in the land. Also this part in particular is noteworthy, as it pretty much seals the deal that MLW that trying to stall for time. A judge is going to flat out ask them for all of the details of how WWE tampered with them, and if MLW can't provide all of them, the case is going to be dismissed. Likely with prejudice (which means MLW can't sue WWE for this again) for wasting the court's time. Asking to repair flaws is one thing, but refusing to reveal details/evidence of WWE's supposed tampering is another entirely. This is just Court trying to get an easy payday that none of his employees will ever see, since he pays well below what would be acceptable. Quite a few workers have come out and mentioned that MLW contracts aren't even remotely livable amounts (you would likely make more money working at a fast food joint), and while Court could afford to pay them, he opts to pocket the money instead. WWE is going to have no reason to settle as long as MLW is as cagey as it is.
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Post by TOK Is the Target Demo on Apr 25, 2022 17:51:20 GMT -5
That's not what this says. I'm the last person to ever defend Bauer's carny ass, but this isn't out of the ordinary for a case like this. The goal seems to be to drag WWE into discovery (so they'd have to open up a lot) or to get them to settle out for a solid chunk They are pretty much demanding more time to find a way to sue WWE. Also for all the talk about wanting to drag WWE into the discovery phase, it isn't gonna happen. And I doubt they are going to settle with Court either. Jerry McDevitt is a lot of things (a terrible person, and as heartless and as ruthless as Vince McMahon), but he's one of the most widely respected attorneys in the land. Also this part in particular is noteworthy, as it pretty much seals the deal that MLW that trying to stall for time. A judge is going to flat out ask them for all of the details, and if MLW can't provide all of them, the case is going to be dismissed. Likely with prejudice (which means MLW can't sue WWE for this again) for wasting the court's time. Asking to repair flaws is one thing, but refusing to reveal details/evidence of WWE's supposed tampering is another entirely. This is just Court trying to get an easy payday that none of his employees will ever see, since he pays well below what would be acceptable. Quite a few workers have come out and mentioned that MLW contracts aren't even remotely livable amounts (you would likely make more money working at a fast food joint), and while Court could afford to pay them, he opts to pocket the money instead. There isn't a need to show firm evidence from either the defendant or a third party before a case progresses. That's literally the entire point of discovery, and also a very high (damn near improbable) standard to meet. They just need to show that WWE is acting as an illegal monopoly (which is very unlikely unless they get the right judge) and establish the timeline of events. And McDevitt is great on the offense but his team doesn't exactly have a great track record when the WWE is on the defense. Either they get demolished in court (Charles Austin, Sable, Lesnar), get lucky that the people suing them are pro wrestlers who are both carny and not well educated so the case doesn't have standing, or they pay off the other side as much as possible. Court should be running a ferris wheel somewhere but he's not an idiot.
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Post by Feargus McReddit on Apr 25, 2022 17:59:28 GMT -5
They are pretty much demanding more time to find a way to sue WWE. Also for all the talk about wanting to drag WWE into the discovery phase, it isn't gonna happen. And I doubt they are going to settle with Court either. Jerry McDevitt is a lot of things (a terrible person, and as heartless and as ruthless as Vince McMahon), but he's one of the most widely respected attorneys in the land. Also this part in particular is noteworthy, as it pretty much seals the deal that MLW that trying to stall for time. A judge is going to flat out ask them for all of the details, and if MLW can't provide all of them, the case is going to be dismissed. Likely with prejudice (which means MLW can't sue WWE for this again) for wasting the court's time. Asking to repair flaws is one thing, but refusing to reveal details/evidence of WWE's supposed tampering is another entirely. This is just Court trying to get an easy payday that none of his employees will ever see, since he pays well below what would be acceptable. Quite a few workers have come out and mentioned that MLW contracts aren't even remotely livable amounts (you would likely make more money working at a fast food joint), and while Court could afford to pay them, he opts to pocket the money instead. There isn't a need to show firm evidence from either the defendant or a third party before a case progresses. That's literally the entire point of discovery, and also a very high (damn near improbable) standard to meet. They just need to show that WWE is acting as an illegal monopoly (which is very unlikely unless they get the right judge) and establish the timeline of events. And McDevitt is great on the offense but his team doesn't exactly have a great track record when the WWE is on the defense. Either they get demolished in court (Charles Austin, Sable, Lesnar), get lucky that the people suing them are pro wrestlers who are both carny and not well educated so the case doesn't have standing, or they pay off the other side as much as possible. Court should be running a ferris wheel somewhere but he's not an idiot. Like, I likely said this at the start, this whole case is designed for Court to get a settlement from WWE because of how much they can afford to do so (well, more than usual) and, unless they have a really good reason or the judge decides to dismiss it, there isn’t a reason why that isn’t the likely outcome here.
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Dub H
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Post by Dub H on Apr 25, 2022 20:49:59 GMT -5
That's not what this says. I'm the last person to ever defend Bauer's carny ass, but this isn't out of the ordinary for a case like this. The goal seems to be to drag WWE into discovery (so they'd have to open up a lot) or to get them to settle out for a solid chunk Yeah, reading through it myself, this seems more like them going “Erm, this doesn’t change what we said” and just hoping WWE settles (which, really, they’ll likely do because some of the stuff WWE brought up could be countered in court ala the AEW stuff). Because it definitely didn't change anything. As I said the existence of AEW doesn't. Mean WWE didn't pull all the tricks to try kill AEW.And surely other companies too,as they tried with the NJPW Madison Garden show they just tried to focus on MLW defects than the accusations itself
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Post by polarbearpete on Apr 26, 2022 0:06:27 GMT -5
That's not what this says. I'm the last person to ever defend Bauer's carny ass, but this isn't out of the ordinary for a case like this. The goal seems to be to drag WWE into discovery (so they'd have to open up a lot) or to get them to settle out for a solid chunk They are pretty much demanding more time to find a way to sue WWE. Also for all the talk about wanting to drag WWE into the discovery phase, it isn't gonna happen. And I doubt they are going to settle with Court either. Jerry McDevitt is a lot of things (a terrible person, and as heartless and as ruthless as Vince McMahon), but he's one of the most competent corporate attorneys in the land. Also this part in particular is noteworthy, as it pretty much seals the deal that MLW that trying to stall for time. A judge is going to flat out ask them for all of the details of how WWE tampered with them, and if MLW can't provide all of them, the case is going to be dismissed. Likely with prejudice (which means MLW can't sue WWE for this again) for wasting the court's time. Asking to repair flaws is one thing, but refusing to reveal details/evidence of WWE's supposed tampering is another entirely. This is just Court trying to get an easy payday that none of his employees will ever see, since he pays well below what would be acceptable. Quite a few workers have come out and mentioned that MLW contracts aren't even remotely livable amounts (you would likely make more money working at a fast food joint), and while Court could afford to pay them, he opts to pocket the money instead. WWE is going to have no reason to settle as long as MLW is as cagey as it is. You’re off the mark here. This is a pre-discovery motion to dismiss. The standard is extremely high to have that motion granted at this stage. It’s essentially saying there’s no case here and there’s no way even through discovery that there will be a case. Judges are hesitant to grant pre-discovery motions to dismiss with prejudice and if the pleadings (the Complaint here) are not sufficient, they will typically allow the Plaintiff the opportunity to amend their complaint in order to make the claim sufficient to get to discovery. Now that doesn’t mean WWE can’t win the motion and get the case thrown out, but the MLW response that they should have the opportunity to learn more facts through discovery (interrogatories, document requests, depositions, etc.) is extremely common.
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Post by doinkmark on Apr 26, 2022 3:38:50 GMT -5
So it's okay for WWE to air its TV on two competing networks, and to air TV on one while streaming exclusively on the other, but God forbid FOX air one wrestling thing on TV and stream another on one of its three second-tier streaming services.
As for AEW, Pepsi existing doesn't mean Coca-Cola isn't forcing Faygo out of the store.
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Post by "Evil Brood" Jackson Vanik on Jan 10, 2023 14:22:17 GMT -5
So WWE filed a motion to halt the discovery requested by MLW. This is what MLW is requesting (made in October 2022). It's many things and I hope it all comes out because it will be very interesting. This is from PW Insider.
"All documents related to MLW, including, but not limited to, the following: (a) communications that refer to, discuss or constitute your efforts to recruit performers who are under cont act with MLW; (b) communications between you and Tubi, Vice and/or FITE that reference MLW or its programs; (c) internal communications that reference MLW or its programs; (d) communications that refer to, discuss or constitute your efforts to discourage businesses or performers from working with MLW; (e) documents that refer to or discuss MLW contracts, or proposed or prospective contracts, with cable, broadcast, streaming or other media outlets, including Tubi, Vice and FITE; and (f) documents related to Court Bauer. "
"All documents related to AEW, including, but not limited to, the following: (a) communications that refer to, discuss or constitute your efforts to recruit performers who are under contract with AEW; (b) communications between you and third parties that reference AEW or its programs; (c) internal communications that reference AEW or its programs; (d) communications that refer to, discuss or constitute your efforts to discourage businesses or performers from working with AEW; (e) documents that refer to or discuss AEW contracts, or proposed or prospective contracts, with cable, broadcast, streaming or other media outlets; (f) documents concerning AEW’s, booking of, or attempt to book, Heritage Bank Center (formerly known as U.S. Bank Arena) for events, including communications with Heritage Bank Center concerning third-party bookings of Heritage Bank Center."
"From January 1, 2018 until December 31, 2018, all documents related to New Japan ProWrestling, including, but not limited to, documents relating to New Japan Pro-Wrestling’s booking of, or attempt to book, Madison Square Garden for events, including communications with MSG concerning third-party bookings of MSG venues."
"From January 1, 2018 until December 31, 2018, all documents related to Ring of Honor, including, but not limited to, documents relating to Ring of Honor’s booking of, or attempt to book, Madison Square Garden for events, including communications with MSG concerning thirdparty bookings of MSG venues."
"All documents related to Impact, including, but not limited to, the following: (a) communications that refer to, discuss or constitute your efforts to recruit performers who are under contract with Impact; (b) communications between you and third parties that reference Impact or its programs; (c) internal communications that reference Impact or its programs; (d) communications that refer to, discuss or constitute your efforts to discourage businesses or performers from working with Impact; (e) documents that refer to or discuss Impact contracts, or proposed or prospective contracts, with cable, broadcast, streaming or other media outlets."
"All documents related to MLW’s negotiations or relationship with VICE, including, but not limited to, communications between you and VICE that reference MLW or its programs."
"All documents related to WWE’s involvement with VICE’s “Dark Side of the Ring Program,” including documents related to Jerry McDevitt’s appearance on the show."
"All documents related to Tubi, including, but not limited to, communications between you and VICE that reference MLW or its programs."
"All documents related to FITE, including, but not limited to, communications between you and FITE that reference MLW or its programs."
"All documents and communications with Fox regarding (a) Tubi and/or (b) MLW"
"Documents sufficient to identify each person who has knowledge of communications between WWE and VICE that occurred during the time period January 1, 2021 through December 31, 2021 concerning MLW or MLW’s negotiations with VICE."
"Documents sufficient to identify each person who has knowledge of communications between WWE and Tubi that occurred during the time period May 1, 2021 through December 31, 2021 concerning MLW or MLW’s negotiations or agreement with Tubi."
"Documents sufficient to identify each person who has knowledge of communications between WWE and FITE that occurred during the time period January 1, 2021 through December 31, 2021 concerning MLW or MLW’s negotiations with FITE."
"All documents concerning WWE’s contracts with A&E, as well as documents concerning WWE partnerships or programs that A&E participates in or airs."
"All documents related to WWE’s efforts to source, locate or hire professional wrestlers, including, but not limited to, WWE’s efforts to source, locate or hire professional wrestlers from competitors."
"All documents related to WWE’s outreach, solicitation or hiring of former MLW professional wrestler Stephon Strickland (“Strickland”), who performs under the ring names Swerve Strickland or Isaiah Swerve Scott, including internal communications concerning WWE’s decision to hire Strickland; Strickland’s potential role in the dispute between the parties or litigation between MLW and WWE; and communications with Strickland"
"All documents related to WWE’s outreach, solicitation or hiring of former MLW professional wrestler Luis Alberto Medina (“Medina”), who performs under the ring name Gino Medina, including internal communications concerning WWE’s solicitation of Medina, any WWE events, programs or promotions that Medina appeared in, and any communications with Medina."
"All documents related to WWE’s outreach, solicitation or hiring of former MLW professional wrestler Harry Smith (“Smith”), who performs under the ring name Davey Boy Smith Jr., including internal communications concerning WWE’s solicitation of Smith, any WWE events, programs or promotions that Smith appeared in, and any communications with Smith."
"All documents related to WWE’s outreach, solicitation or hiring of former MLW professional wrestler Jacob Fuavaifatu (“Fuavaifatu”), who performs under the ring name Jacob Fatu, including internal communications concerning WWE’s solicitation of Fuavaifatu, any WWE events, programs or promotions that Fuavaifatu appeared in, and any communications with Fuavaifatu."
"All documents related to WWE’s outreach, solicitation or hiring of former MLW professional wrestler Lance Anoa’i (“Anoa’i”), including internal communications concerning WWE’s solicitation of Anoa’i, any WWE events, programs or promotions that Anoa’i appeared in, and any communications with Anoa’i."
"The contracts or employment agreements of all WWE professional wrestlers whose contracts contain non-compete clauses or other clauses that limit or restrict the performer’s alternative employment options."
"All documents related to the performance of WWE or any of its employees or contractors in connection with professional wrestling events, including documents containing analyses, reviews, evaluations, appraisals or other internal assessments related to the quality, value or completeness of, or defects in, each such person’s work; their knowledge, skills and qualifications; and warnings, criticisms, reprimands, demotions, reassignments, terminations or other disciplinary actions related to those individuals, as well as documents sufficient to show which WWE professional wrestlers participated in WWE’s events."
"All documents concerning the termination of the employment, or the resignation, of any professional wrestler during the time period January 1, 2020 through present."
"All documents, including organizational and staffing charts, related to the organization, areas of responsibility and reporting relationships of WWE, including, but not limited to, organizational charts reflecting the name, position and hierarchy of employees with any responsibilities relating to the production of professional wrestling content."
"From January 1, 2012 through the present, all lawsuits, claims, or complaints, threatened or actual, made by any third party relating to allegations that WWE wrongfully poached or solicited employees or contractors, or tortiously or unfairly interfered with a competitor’s business, including a copy of any transcript of testimony given in connection with such lawsuits, claims, or complaints."
"All lawsuits, claims, or complaints, threatened or actual, made by WWE’s employees in connection with WWE’s employment or contractor agreements, including claims or complaints related to the hiring or retention of WWE’s employees, contractors or agents, including a copy of any transcript of testimony given in connection with such lawsuits, claims, or complaints."
"All documents relating to WWE’s efforts to prevent competitors from booking arenas or venues for the production of professional wrestling content, including, but not limited to, WWE’s efforts to book arenas or venues during times when competitors sought to book such arenas or venues and communications with event venues, stadiums or arenas concerning third parties’ booking of, or attempt to book, such event venues, stadiums or arenas for events."
"All documents concerning the internal decision making related to when WWE programming is broadcast or streamed, which networks or platforms stream such programming, and whether to air programming in timeslots that compete with competitors, including, but not limited to, internal analyses, forecasts or projections."
"All documents concerning the internal decision making related to WWE’s decision to air Clash at The Castle on Saturday, September 3, 2022 and NXT Worlds Collide on September 4, 2022." [Note from Mike: These events would have run the same day as AEW PPV events]
"All documents related to WWE’s agreements for the distribution, licensing fees, rights fees, advertising revenue, or subscription revenue of WWE professional wrestling content, including, but not limited to agreements for the licensing or distribution of Smackdown, RAW or NXT programming, including documents and communications concerning negotiations with counter-parties."
"All documents relating to the pricing of WWE events, including but not limited to: (a) analyses concerning the initial pricing for the sale or licensing of WWE events to cable, broadcast or streaming platforms; (b) actual or potential price increases or decreases, including any such changes in response to competition from another product; (c) rebates, discounts, or markdowns, including the negotiation thereof; or (d) negotiations with cable, broadcast or streaming platform."
"All documents relating to: (a) competition to WWE, including but not limited to competition from MLW, AEW or Impact; or (b) analyses, forecasts or other projections reflecting sales of WWE programming, MLW programming, AEW programming or Impact programming, or any other competition to WWE programming."
"All documents concerning WWE’s decision to shut down or discontinue its streaming service, WWE Network."
"All documents, including market studies or analyses, concerning WWE’s target audience or viewership for professional wrestling content."
"On a monthly basis, all viewership or ratings data for professional wrestling content."
"All minutes or notes relating to meetings of Your Board of Directors, or any committee or subcommittee of the Board of Directors, from January 1, 2018 to the present."
"All insurance policies, insuring agreements, declarations, binders, endorsements, and certificates of insurance concerning insurance coverage maintained by you concerning the damages sought in this Action."
"All claims made or forms submitted by you to insurance carriers in connection with any claims made the basis of this Action."
"All documents related to any notification, claim or reservation of rights, made under any insurance policy, in connection with the Complaint."
"All documents concerning any settlement agreement, indemnity agreement, hold-harmless agreement, guaranty agreement, judgment sharing agreement, non-disclosure agreement, covenant not to sue, joint defense agreement, cooperation agreement, cost sharing agreement and common interest agreement between WWE and any other person in connection with this litigation."
"One copy of each of WWE’s quarterly and annual financial statements and reports."
"One copy of each U.S. tax return (federal and state) filed by WWE."
"All documents evidencing your ability to satisfy a judgment in this Action, including all documents concerning any financial reserve or amount to cover estimated or potential liabilities, settlements or other expenses which may result from this Action."
"All documents concerning this Action, including press releases."
"All documents concerning written statements between you and third parties or your parent, subsidiary or affiliate corporations, partners, stockholders and/or shareholders concerning this Action."
"All documents, regardless of date, concerning any policies and/or procedures concerning compliance with federal and state antitrust laws."
"All documents concerning each of the allegations in the Complaint and/or any denial or other contention or response you have with respect to each such allegation."
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Post by mistery on Feb 14, 2023 7:24:14 GMT -5
The thing is that MLW doesn't have much of a legal leg to stand on right now. Because there are alternative major promotions out there, they are just not as good at getting their names out there. That's not a monopoly on the part of WWE. And of course TV Networks are going to listen to WWE offers first over any other promotion, because WWE is a household name, where I am pretty sure the average person knows little to nothing about companies like AEW or NJPW.
Court is going to have to submit an amended complaint like mentioned, but his legal team doesn't have much recourse here. The judge is basically claiming that they need to provide an actual reason for their suit. And I have a feeling if Court's amended complaint isn't sufficient, a judge will immediately dismiss the suit.
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Post by polarbearpete on Feb 14, 2023 10:14:31 GMT -5
The thing is that MLW doesn't have much of a legal leg to stand on right now. Because there are alternative major promotions out there, they are just not as good at getting their names out there. That's not a monopoly on the part of WWE. And of course TV Networks are going to listen to WWE offers first over any other promotion, because WWE is a household name, where I am pretty sure the average person knows little to nothing about companies like AEW or NJPW. Court is going to have to submit an amended complaint like mentioned, but his legal team doesn't have much recourse here. The judge is basically claiming that they need to provide an actual reason for their suit. And I have a feeling if Court's amended complaint isn't sufficient, a judge will immediately dismiss the suit. I mean your last sentence is just what the ruling indeed is, if they don’t amend it to state a claim then it’ll be dismissed.
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