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Post by "Gizzark" Mike Wronglevenay on May 17, 2022 11:36:04 GMT -5
The Nazi photo was outrageously bad taste but the apology is actively worse.
I made racist jokes all the time in my teens and 20s. Rape jokes too. All the worst shit. Loads of them. I thought they were harmless because I wasn't actually throwing slurs at anyone. It was f***ed up, but I wasn't even notable amongst my friendship group, or my school.
I learned later in life that, yeah, this shit is still tremendously damaging, so I stopped a while ago and never had to be held accountable for that shit, we didn't all have camera phones in those days.
But good GOD I hope that if I had been called out my response would be better than 'Hitler who? What's a Nazi? I've never even BEEN to Poland'
Make a bad taste joke? Sure. I should have known better, sorry everyone, it wasn't a joke I should have been making. It's so, so, so easy.
Just be f***ing accountable for something
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Post by Celexa Bliss on May 17, 2022 11:43:13 GMT -5
I deleted my previous post after realizing I contradicted myself in said post.
What I will say is that, while he never should have taken that photo to begin with, I believe him when he says he didn't understand the reality behind what he did. There's a difference between knowing something and understanding something. I do stand by my comment about "I didn't intend for that photo be made public" is not an excuse, however. But I won't condemn him for not understanding the horrors of the Holocaust, since many people do not and are not as willing as he seems to be to educate themselves. As I said in my deleted post, I made jokes about rape without really understanding, at the time, how those comments could affect someone who went through it or is close to someone who went through it. I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt. As I said before, he didn't throw out slurs or anything like that, he took a stupid picture to amuse himself and his friends.
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Post by Celexa Bliss on May 17, 2022 12:23:45 GMT -5
I deleted my previous post after realizing I contradicted myself in said post. What I will say is that, while he never should have taken that photo to begin with, I believe him when he says he didn't understand the reality behind what he did. There's a difference between knowing something and understanding something. I do stand by my comment about "I didn't intend for that photo be made public" is not an excuse, however. But I won't condemn him for not understanding the horrors of the Holocaust, since many people do not and are not as willing as he seems to be to educate themselves. As I said in my deleted post, I made jokes about rape without really understanding, at the time, how those comments could affect someone who went through it or is close to someone who went through it. I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt. As I said before, he didn't throw out slurs or anything like that, he took a stupid picture to amuse himself and his friends. Let me amend this a bit. It's not so much not understanding the Holocaust, but not understanding how what he believed was a stupid picture could negatively affect others. Basically, what I said regarding my own moment of shame. Like, I understood that rape was horrible, but I didn't really take into account or really get how my joke could trigger someone else. He can know that Hitler was an abomination of a person and that the Holocaust was an atrocity, but at the same time, not realize that what he and his buddies thought was harmless fun could trigger someone else. It's about understanding how our actions impact the people around us. And the fact that he seems to have realized and grown from that makes me feel comfortable in giving him a second chance in the court of public opinion.
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Post by noobeast on May 17, 2022 13:23:45 GMT -5
This dude is never going to win in this situation.
People here always say they believe that people can grow and change, but the second someone says they made a mistake and are trying, you motherf*** them anyway.
He never said he didn't know what nazis or any of that were. He said he didn't realize how hurtful what he did was. But y'all just read it how you want to read it, with absolutely no regard for what it actually says.
This poor dude took a joke photo years ago and now his career is over for it. Absolute bullshit.
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Post by The Heartbreak TWERK on May 17, 2022 13:29:51 GMT -5
This dude is never going to win in this situation. People here always say they believe that people can grow and change, but the second someone says they made a mistake and are trying, you motherf*** them anyway. He never said he didn't know what nazis or any of that were. He said he didn't realize how hurtful what he did was. But y'all just read it how you want to read it, with absolutely no regard for what it actually says. This poor dude took a joke photo years ago and now his career is over for it. Absolute bullshit. Yeeeeah, defending the whole Nazi cosplay thing isn't the benevolent take you think it is.
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Post by noobeast on May 17, 2022 13:36:22 GMT -5
This dude is never going to win in this situation. People here always say they believe that people can grow and change, but the second someone says they made a mistake and are trying, you motherf*** them anyway. He never said he didn't know what nazis or any of that were. He said he didn't realize how hurtful what he did was. But y'all just read it how you want to read it, with absolutely no regard for what it actually says. This poor dude took a joke photo years ago and now his career is over for it. Absolute bullshit. Yeeeeah, defending the whole Nazi cosplay thing isn't the benevolent take you think it is. And there goes even more exagerrated nonsense. Can anyone read something and not turn it into some kind of ridiculous extreme? Nobody defended "nazi cosplay." I said the dude took a dumb, joke picture. I'm absolutely POSITIVE that everyone here, yourself included, is proud of every single thing they've done, and never did anything that could offend someone though, right? There is an embarrassingly large segment of people here who get off on seeing people's lives ruined for dumb mistakes. It's a really easy position to take when you aren't the one under a microscope. But hey, everyone should keep preaching how they believe people can change and get better, but keep practicing the opposite. No reason to mean what you say, right?
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Post by The Heartbreak TWERK on May 17, 2022 13:47:51 GMT -5
Yeeeeah, defending the whole Nazi cosplay thing isn't the benevolent take you think it is. And there goes even more exagerrated nonsense. Can anyone read something and not turn it into some kind of ridiculous extreme? Nobody defended "nazi cosplay." I said the dude took a dumb, joke picture. I'm absolutely POSITIVE that everyone here, yourself included, is proud of every single thing they've done, and never did anything that could offend someone though, right? There is an embarrassingly large segment of people here who get off on seeing people's lives ruined for dumb mistakes. It's a really easy position to take when you aren't the one under a microscope. But hey, everyone should keep preaching how they believe people can change and get better, but keep practicing the opposite. No reason to mean what you say, right? Nah, at 21 years old if you don't understand that dressing like a Nazi is bad, you're fundamentally a bad person who doesn't deserve the opportunity to make millions of dollars off being a semi-celebrity. Sorry, there's no defense for this. And you seem really worked up about the Nazi cosplayer getting what he deserves.
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Post by Celexa Bliss on May 17, 2022 13:51:11 GMT -5
This dude is never going to win in this situation. People here always say they believe that people can grow and change, but the second someone says they made a mistake and are trying, you motherf*** them anyway. He never said he didn't know what nazis or any of that were. He said he didn't realize how hurtful what he did was. But y'all just read it how you want to read it, with absolutely no regard for what it actually says. This poor dude took a joke photo years ago and now his career is over for it. Absolute bullshit. Yeeeeah, defending the whole Nazi cosplay thing isn't the benevolent take you think it is. Yeeeeah, but they weren't defending the Nazi cosplay, dude. They were lamenting the fact that, because the guy took an ill-advised photograph seven years ago, they are now eternally damned by the court of public opinion, despite the apology and attempt at change and personal growth. Maybe jumping on someone's case for showing empathy isn't the heroic take you think it is.
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Post by hashtagdaley/JudasDay on May 17, 2022 13:53:44 GMT -5
And there goes even more exagerrated nonsense. Can anyone read something and not turn it into some kind of ridiculous extreme? Nobody defended "nazi cosplay." I said the dude took a dumb, joke picture. I'm absolutely POSITIVE that everyone here, yourself included, is proud of every single thing they've done, and never did anything that could offend someone though, right? There is an embarrassingly large segment of people here who get off on seeing people's lives ruined for dumb mistakes. It's a really easy position to take when you aren't the one under a microscope. But hey, everyone should keep preaching how they believe people can change and get better, but keep practicing the opposite. No reason to mean what you say, right? Nah, at 21 years old if you don't understand that dressing like a Nazi is bad, you're fundamentally a bad person who doesn't deserve the opportunity to make millions of dollars off being a semi-celebrity. Sorry, there's no defense for this. And you seem really worked up about the Nazi cosplayer getting what he deserves. What’s your thoughts on Asuka having a long, prominent, and amazingly successful career?
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Post by The Heartbreak TWERK on May 17, 2022 13:54:18 GMT -5
Yeeeeah, defending the whole Nazi cosplay thing isn't the benevolent take you think it is. Yeeeeah, but they weren't defending the Nazi cosplay, dude. They were lamenting the fact that, because the guy took an ill-advised photograph seven years ago, they are now eternally damned by the court of public opinion, despite the apology and attempt at change and personal growth. Maybe jumping on someone's case for showing empathy isn't the heroic take you think it is. Once again, the person in question was 21 years old when he took that photo. If you don't understand the basic concept of how bad Nazis are by that age, you should not be afforded to opportunity to become wealthy as a television star. Going, "Oh the poor little baby didn't know better" is gross.
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Post by The Heartbreak TWERK on May 17, 2022 13:55:20 GMT -5
Nah, at 21 years old if you don't understand that dressing like a Nazi is bad, you're fundamentally a bad person who doesn't deserve the opportunity to make millions of dollars off being a semi-celebrity. Sorry, there's no defense for this. And you seem really worked up about the Nazi cosplayer getting what he deserves. What’s your thoughts on Asuka having a long, prominent, and amazingly successful career? The same as anyone else who lives in the "Nazi = Okay" realm. Was that supposed to be a "gotcha"?
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Post by hashtagdaley/JudasDay on May 17, 2022 13:58:14 GMT -5
What’s your thoughts on Asuka having a long, prominent, and amazingly successful career? The same as anyone else who lives in the "Nazi = Okay" realm. Was that supposed to be a "gotcha"? Not especially. I just don’t recall ever seeing any of your OTT takes whenever someone talks about her and was legitimately curious if using a nazi cosplay for in-ring stuff carried the same weight.
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Post by The Heartbreak TWERK on May 17, 2022 13:59:33 GMT -5
It's genuinely sad that people are going "poor wittle baby" for people doing Nazi cosplay.
This board has been way better than that for years.
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Post by Deleted on May 17, 2022 14:00:30 GMT -5
The Nazi photo was outrageously bad taste but the apology is actively worse. I made racist jokes all the time in my teens and 20s. Rape jokes too. All the worst shit. Loads of them. I thought they were harmless because I wasn't actually throwing slurs at anyone. It was f***ed up, but I wasn't even notable amongst my friendship group, or my school. I learned later in life that, yeah, this shit is still tremendously damaging, so I stopped a while ago and never had to be held accountable for that shit, we didn't all have camera phones in those days. But good GOD I hope that if I had been called out my response would be better than 'Hitler who? What's a Nazi? I've never even BEEN to Poland' Make a bad taste joke? Sure. I should have known better, sorry everyone, it wasn't a joke I should have been making. It's so, so, so easy. Just be f***ing accountable for something I'm not even a PR person, but let me help him out here: "Part of growing as a human being is looking back upon some of the acts you once did and regretting them, and hopefully learning from them. Some photos that I obviously wanted no one to see because I'm ashamed of them have recently come to light. While I cannot undo the fact that it is me in those photos, I can make my promise to everyone involved that I do not condone or engage in any behavior like that any longer, and haven't in many years. What I can do is ask for forgiveness out of those who feel let down by this, and be a better person today than I was yesterday."
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Post by Celexa Bliss on May 17, 2022 14:01:11 GMT -5
And there goes even more exagerrated nonsense. Can anyone read something and not turn it into some kind of ridiculous extreme? Nobody defended "nazi cosplay." I said the dude took a dumb, joke picture. I'm absolutely POSITIVE that everyone here, yourself included, is proud of every single thing they've done, and never did anything that could offend someone though, right? There is an embarrassingly large segment of people here who get off on seeing people's lives ruined for dumb mistakes. It's a really easy position to take when you aren't the one under a microscope. But hey, everyone should keep preaching how they believe people can change and get better, but keep practicing the opposite. No reason to mean what you say, right? Nah, at 21 years old if you don't understand that dressing like a Nazi is bad, you're fundamentally a bad person who doesn't deserve the opportunity to make millions of dollars off being a semi-celebrity. Sorry, there's no defense for this. And you seem really worked up about the Nazi cosplayer getting what he deserves. I'm glad you see the world so cut-and-dry. Someone does something stupid when they're young - and yes, 21, while legally an adult, is still young - without considering the long-reaching ramifications is an evil bastard that can never be salvaged. Honestly, I'm so damn sick of "woke" culture and "social justice warriors" who analyze every single thing a person has ever done in their life, just to find ways to bring them down.
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Post by noobeast on May 17, 2022 14:03:07 GMT -5
And there goes even more exagerrated nonsense. Can anyone read something and not turn it into some kind of ridiculous extreme? Nobody defended "nazi cosplay." I said the dude took a dumb, joke picture. I'm absolutely POSITIVE that everyone here, yourself included, is proud of every single thing they've done, and never did anything that could offend someone though, right? There is an embarrassingly large segment of people here who get off on seeing people's lives ruined for dumb mistakes. It's a really easy position to take when you aren't the one under a microscope. But hey, everyone should keep preaching how they believe people can change and get better, but keep practicing the opposite. No reason to mean what you say, right? Nah, at 21 years old if you don't understand that dressing like a Nazi is bad, you're fundamentally a bad person who doesn't deserve the opportunity to make millions of dollars off being a semi-celebrity. Sorry, there's no defense for this. And you seem really worked up about the Nazi cosplayer getting what he deserves. Yeah, because no one makes questionable jokes and decisions at 21. We're all SUPER mature right as we reach drinking age... I'm sorry, but you're coming off like an absolute clown. If taking 1 stupid photo is enough to get you to write off someone, you must be REALLY f***ing lonely.
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Post by The Heartbreak TWERK on May 17, 2022 14:05:57 GMT -5
Nah, at 21 years old if you don't understand that dressing like a Nazi is bad, you're fundamentally a bad person who doesn't deserve the opportunity to make millions of dollars off being a semi-celebrity. Sorry, there's no defense for this. And you seem really worked up about the Nazi cosplayer getting what he deserves. Yeah, because no one makes questionable jokes and decisions at 21. We're all SUPER mature right as we reach drinking age... I'm sorry, but you're coming off like an absolute clown. If taking 1 stupid photo is enough to get you to write off someone, you must be REALLY f***ing lonely. Yes, me not having tolerance for Nazi cosplay is clownlike behavior. Read that one back.
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Post by DrBackflipsHoffman on May 17, 2022 14:07:13 GMT -5
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Post by Celexa Bliss on May 17, 2022 14:07:57 GMT -5
It's genuinely sad that people are going "poor wittle baby" for people doing Nazi cosplay. This board has been way better than that for years. Nobody is going "poor wittle baby", so please stop that. As I have said a few times, yes, Nash Carter should have never taken that photo, even as a joke with his friends. Nazis are not funny. Nobody here is disputing that. And yes, he should have, and I believe he did, know that and knew why. However, I do believe, as I've said, SEVERAL TIMES, that he didn't understand how his actions were harmful. To him, it was a dumb photo that a couple of people would see and get the joke. I'm sure he never expected it to go public and be used as a way to discredit him when he was being accused of domestic abuse. And I'm sure, as many people at that age, because yes, 21 is still young, he probably didn't consider that someone else might see the photo and suffer distress from it. Nobody is excusing the photo. But you're the one condemning him for life over ONE DUMB MISTAKE.
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Post by The Heartbreak TWERK on May 17, 2022 14:08:08 GMT -5
Oh, he's got jokes, that's awesome. Yeah, he's definitely really sorry.
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