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Post by Hit Girl on Dec 29, 2021 3:27:30 GMT -5
"Koko B Ware doesn't deserve a HOF place!"
Nope.
He does.
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Mozenrath
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Post by Mozenrath on Dec 29, 2021 4:12:21 GMT -5
The idea that the red rooster killed Terry Taylor's career and made him a joke. Personally, I think it's the fact that he's a giant tool and stooge and most people in the business can't stand him is why his career wasn't what it could have been. If Taylor were that hated he wouldn't have had those powerful booking positions to begin with. He definitely has people who cannot stand him, but he's had some vocal supporters, like Lance Storm, who have had plenty of positive things to say. Kinda get the impression he's one of those guys who, like a lot of people in places of prominence, especially during the Monday Night Wars, he was put in positions that were going to make enemies. Like, there are plenty of people who like Johnny Ace and Jim Ross, and also people who have major grudges against them since they were in positions where they had to be the bad guy.
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Post by sungod2020 on Dec 29, 2021 8:13:13 GMT -5
"Koko B Ware doesn't deserve a HOF place!" Nope. He does. Well deserving of who should or shouldn't go in the Hall of Fame is all a matter of opinion. While I do agree that not everybody in there should be a former world champion, it should on some level have a high profile nature, as long as the inductee in questions legacy isn't tainted. Koko B, Ware may not belong in there in a kayfabe sense(was a JTTS at best), but he was a dependable worker, was over, and we're still talking about him 30 years later, so strictly in a business sense, why not throw him a bone(or a bird seed). I'd put him in there before, say Drew Carey who was parading around in the Royal Rumble match for five minutes just to promote an upcoming PPV or Chris Von Erich who's only in there because the rest of his family is in there and it would look too awkward to only have certain members in there based on their accomplishments and morale. If you ask me though, I feel the Von Erich name is tainted in itself with their back-to-back deaths and Fritz being a POS who profited off of it, so Fritz alone is questionable of deserving recognition even if he and his family made a big splash in the Dallas area. Its a double edge sword really.
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Post by The Barber on Dec 29, 2021 8:55:16 GMT -5
There are a few: Dixie Carter was the worst promoter to work for due to late payments and angering network executives. As opposed to Paul Heyman (one that the IWC idolizes) who would CONSTANTLY miss payments (most never even getting payed at all) and his show pissing off TNN/Spike more than Dixie ever could. Hulk Hogan could never wrestle.
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Post by "Gizzark" Mike Wronglevenay on Dec 29, 2021 9:45:53 GMT -5
There are a few: Dixie Carter was the worst promoter to work for due to late payments and angering network executives. As opposed to Paul Heyman (one that the IWC idolizes) who would CONSTANTLY miss payments (most never even getting payed at all) and his show pissing off TNN/Spike more than Dixie ever could. Hulk Hogan could never wrestle. First of all I agree totally about Hulk. His Japanese work is way more varied and interesting even as late as 93. It is fascinating seeing him work in an environment that he isn't the biggest dog and has to try. Second of all, the criticism about Hogan not being able to wrestle was always BS because he had the crowd in the palm of his hand while doing almost no moves. That same talent is why Flair is so respected as a worker, when even some of his best work features as few actual wrestling moves as a Hogan match.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 29, 2021 23:14:09 GMT -5
I was convinced as a kid that Reckless Youth was going to be the next HBK based on the write ups in PWI and early newsgroups
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Post by WoodStoner1 on Dec 30, 2021 10:32:00 GMT -5
"Koko B Ware doesn't deserve a HOF place!" Nope. He does. Well deserving of who should or shouldn't go in the Hall of Fame is all a matter of opinion. While I do agree that not everybody in there should be a former world champion, it should on some level have a high profile nature, as long as the inductee in questions legacy isn't tainted. Koko B, Ware may not belong in there in a kayfabe sense(was a JTTS at best), but he was a dependable worker, was over, and we're still talking about him 30 years later, so strictly in a business sense, why not throw him a bone(or a bird seed). I'd put him in there before, say Drew Carey who was parading around in the Royal Rumble match for five minutes just to promote an upcoming PPV or Chris Von Erich who's only in there because the rest of his family is in there and it would look too awkward to only have certain members in there based on their accomplishments and morale. If you ask me though, I feel the Von Erich name is tainted in itself with their back-to-back deaths and Fritz being a POS who profited off of it, so Fritz alone is questionable of deserving recognition even if he and his family made a big splash in the Dallas area. Its a double edge sword really. You're suggesting total saints belong in the HOF? LOL, that's a good one. Seriously, WWE does turn a blind eye to that unless it was a major media story like Benoit.
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Post by kingoftheindies on Dec 30, 2021 11:02:32 GMT -5
There are a few: Dixie Carter was the worst promoter to work for due to late payments and angering network executives. As opposed to Paul Heyman (one that the IWC idolizes) who would CONSTANTLY miss payments (most never even getting payed at all) and his show pissing off TNN/Spike more than Dixie ever could. Hulk Hogan could never wrestle. There's an ECW book our (I believe Hardcore History) where they interview who worked in the offices for ECW or were vendors/promoters (booking venues) and I don't think people realize how bad Paul E was. Basically these people would line up business deals or book venues and Heyman would not follow through... and a lot of these deals were things that, while maybe not stopping ECW going out of business, would have really helped the bottom line and would have covered a lot of the debt. By the end sponsors, venues, ect wanted nothing to do with ECW because Paul burned all of the bridges
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Post by jason1980s on Dec 30, 2021 11:04:33 GMT -5
It has amazed me for almost 20 years that Paul Heyman has made a second career and probably millions being able to convince a guy who trusts no one, to trust him.
If he hadn't gone into wrestling, I imagine he'd be a famous religious cult leader.
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Post by sungod2020 on Dec 30, 2021 11:05:57 GMT -5
Well deserving of who should or shouldn't go in the Hall of Fame is all a matter of opinion. While I do agree that not everybody in there should be a former world champion, it should on some level have a high profile nature, as long as the inductee in questions legacy isn't tainted. Koko B, Ware may not belong in there in a kayfabe sense(was a JTTS at best), but he was a dependable worker, was over, and we're still talking about him 30 years later, so strictly in a business sense, why not throw him a bone(or a bird seed). I'd put him in there before, say Drew Carey who was parading around in the Royal Rumble match for five minutes just to promote an upcoming PPV or Chris Von Erich who's only in there because the rest of his family is in there and it would look too awkward to only have certain members in there based on their accomplishments and morale. If you ask me though, I feel the Von Erich name is tainted in itself with their back-to-back deaths and Fritz being a POS who profited off of it, so Fritz alone is questionable of deserving recognition even if he and his family made a big splash in the Dallas area. Its a double edge sword really. You're suggesting total saints belong in the HOF? LOL, that's a good one. Seriously, WWE does turn a blind eye to that unless it was a major media story like Benoit. I think we can all agree that virtually nobody in that business is a saint, but some are worse than others, to the point where it becomes PART of their legacy. I'm even starting to question Jimmy Snuka and Fabulous Moolah's inductions for that very reason. You can only hid behind nostalgia for so long. But yes, it can be difficult to gauge who's more shitty than others in this shady business.
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tafkaga
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Post by tafkaga on Dec 30, 2021 16:33:28 GMT -5
Gorilla Monsoon said Hulk didn't know the difference between a wristlock and a wrist watch on an A&E documentary, so that goes beyond an IWC narrative.
Hulk had a hand full of impressive looking wrestling moves he could pull out when he needed to. He never looked very smooth when he did them, but it was fun to see him pull them out on rare occasion.
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Dub H
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Post by Dub H on Dec 30, 2021 16:39:02 GMT -5
Gorilla Monsoon said Hulk didn't know the difference between a wristlock and a wrist watch on an A&E documentary, so that goes beyond an IWC narrative. Hulk had a hand full of impressive looking wrestling moves he could pull out when he needed to. He never looked very smooth when he did them, but it was fun to see him pull them out on rare occasion. Impressive is a strong word, it is...averagemg,god,not like it is bad but onee hardly could say it is impressive. Not that it matters,in his time in WWF he played his role as well as one could.In the end it was all that mattered,he didnt need fancy or amazing looking moves.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 30, 2021 16:46:17 GMT -5
I was convinced as a kid that Reckless Youth was going to be the next HBK based on the write ups in PWI and early newsgroups I honestly think he could have been if he was coming up now, rather than in the late 90s. It was way harder for a guy with his size and style to make it in the WWF or WCW at the time, and I don't think it was worth it to him to put in the leg work it would have taken to work his way up in that environment, since the other side of the narrative with him was always that he had a really good "day job" that paid more than "paying his dues" in the indies or WWE developmental ever could. A narrative that's actually corroborated by the fact that he's the Director of the Tax Department at Nine West/The Jones Group (https://www.linkedin.com/in/thomas-carter-cmi-07792651/).
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BlackoutCreature
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Post by BlackoutCreature on Dec 30, 2021 17:16:26 GMT -5
Gorilla Monsoon said Hulk didn't know the difference between a wristlock and a wrist watch on an A&E documentary, so that goes beyond an IWC narrative. Well Gorilla Monsoon is always right. And since Hulk Hogan actually could pull out a wide variety of wrestling maneuvers when he needed to, that can only lead to one conclusion - Hulk Hogan can't tell time.
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Post by BayleyTiffyCodyCenaJudyHopps on Dec 30, 2021 17:21:37 GMT -5
Gorilla Monsoon said Hulk didn't know the difference between a wristlock and a wrist watch on an A&E documentary, so that goes beyond an IWC narrative. Well Gorilla Monsoon is always right. And since Hulk Hogan actually could pull out a wide variety of wrestling maneuvers when he needed to, that can only lead to one conclusion - Hulk Hogan can't tell time. The guy who says he wrestled 400 days in one year can't tell time? For reals?
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Post by A Platypus Rave is Correct on Dec 30, 2021 17:32:37 GMT -5
Mike Bucci said the same thing about his time as Simon Dean. If I'd get paid doing comedy skits instead of ECW-style matches, give me the clown nose now! Yeah. Like, modern example: Heath Slater. Apart from that one tag title run, after the Nexus flamed out he basically got paid decent money to stare at the lights for 10 years while occasionally clowning around with a celebrity or a legend. Hell Scotty Too Hotty was basically employed for like 20 years... just on the fact that he was a comedy guy that could pop the crowd... Not sure how much of an IWC narrative this is but i always got the impression that Tony Schiavone was always an awful commentator based on the "butts in seats" comment and how the WWE painted him because of it as well what was written about him online. I never got to watch WCW so my first real viewings came from the Best of Nitro and other WCW dvd collections and i realised Tony was very good. Of course during the dieing years of WCW i'm sure he lost a lot of motivation but i was under the impression that he was always awful. Yeah, it was the final years of WCW where the Tony was bad narrative came from. And if you're going by only those years, it wasn't a false narrative. A toxic backstage environment, the same shit every week, and Tony just going through the motions at best because of it. Same could be said for Heenan. They were still good in the middle of 1998, but everything really went to shit in 1999. Yeah, Late WCW Schiavone was so checked out and he was saying all sorts of stock phrases including things like "It's the greatest night in the history of our sport" for some just truly awful television,
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mcmahonfan85
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Post by mcmahonfan85 on Dec 30, 2021 17:36:56 GMT -5
Dixie Carter was the worst promoter to work for due to late payments and angering network executives. As opposed to Paul Heyman (one that the IWC idolizes) who would CONSTANTLY miss payments (most never even getting payed at all) and his show pissing off TNN/Spike more than Dixie ever could. no one, not even Paul Heyman himself, ever praised Paul Heyman of being a good businessman. he's idolized for his creative talents, not his money handling skills. also, there is a world of difference between a small promotion that has always struggled financially having trouble paying its talent and the #2 promotion which is owned by a billion dollar corporation having trouble paying. then there was Dixie's other smart idea as a promoter, such as when fans (who got into the show for free) liked the product so much they began chanting "Fire Russo", and her response was to threaten to fire any other writer but Russo if it happened again. say what you will about Heyman's abilities as a promoter, but I don't ever recall hearing him threaten to randomly fire someone because someone else sucked at their job
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Post by Bob Schlapowitz on Dec 30, 2021 17:41:23 GMT -5
Well Gorilla Monsoon is always right. And since Hulk Hogan actually could pull out a wide variety of wrestling maneuvers when he needed to, that can only lead to one conclusion - Hulk Hogan can't tell time. The guy who says he wrestled 400 days in one year can't tell time? For reals? I thought he said he wrestled 400 matches in one year, which is entirely feasible.
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Post by The Legend of Groose on Dec 30, 2021 17:50:02 GMT -5
"Ryback was never over". The dude was the hottest thing in WWE during his win streak.
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Post by BayleyTiffyCodyCenaJudyHopps on Dec 30, 2021 18:35:30 GMT -5
The guy who says he wrestled 400 days in one year can't tell time? For reals? I thought he said he wrestled 400 matches in one year, which is entirely feasible. I'm certain he actually said 400 matches, just that "400 days" was funnier and seems like something he'd blurt out in the heat of a moment.
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