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Post by "Evil Brood" Jackson Vanik on Mar 2, 2022 0:08:33 GMT -5
It's possible to recognize someone did something wrong while also empathizing with their motivation. We can also punish people accordingly depending on the context of the crime.
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Post by Limity (BLM) on Mar 2, 2022 4:39:28 GMT -5
It's possible to recognize someone did something wrong while also empathizing with their motivation. We can also punish people accordingly depending on the context of the crime. The hell you say!
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Post by This Player Hating Mothman on Mar 2, 2022 5:25:12 GMT -5
Some of these comments appear to be endorsing vigiliantism, which is a slippery slope and honestly nauseating. The Cult of the Child is a real thing. It’s in or about my generation that decided the world should be geared to children. Okay I'm not saying I agree with what he did but given that he was trying to avenge the alleged abuse of his child, what are you blathering about? Nothing surrounding this case sounds like it has anything to do with making the world all about children. It was an angry father seemingly out for revenge after someone hurt his child, and all the sympathetic sentiments have been in light of that fact. That's not the cult of anything.
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Totorob101
Hank Scorpio
Glob Glob Glob
Posts: 5,587
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Post by Totorob101 on Mar 2, 2022 6:03:59 GMT -5
While it's hard not to be sympathetic with Cain he had to be punished to the fullest extent of the law,you can't do what he did and use an awful situation as an excuse. If he indeed did shoot the wrong person too then he has no excuses.
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Post by The Dark Order Inferno on Mar 2, 2022 6:29:34 GMT -5
The person Cain shot was not guilty of anything and the person he was after hadn't been proven and convicted of any crime as far as I'm aware. He was looking to execute someone for something that hadn't yet been proven beyond reasonable doubt in a court of law.
If the past few years have shown anything, someone accused of a crime being murdered by vigilantes doesn't necessarily mean they were guilty of anything, and there are a hell of a lot of people waiting to falsely point the finger at people accusing them of crimes against kids for attention, or just to ruin their lives. It's not up to random people with guns to decide someone's guilt or innocence, a lot of innocent people have died proving what a bad idea it is to let mob justice rule the day.
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Post by CeilingFan on Mar 2, 2022 6:50:05 GMT -5
The person Cain shot was not guilty of anything and the person he was after hadn't been proven and convicted of any crime as far as I'm aware. He was looking to execute someone for something that hadn't yet been proven in a court of law. If the past few years have shown anything, someone accused of a crime being murdered by vigilantes doesn't necessarily mean they were guilty of anything, and there are a hell of a lot of people waiting to falsely point the finger at people accusing them of crimes against kids for attention, or just to ruin their lives. It's not up to random people with guns to decide someone's guilt or innocence, a lot if innocent people have died proving what a bad idea it is to let mob justice rule the day. The Punisher disagrees with you!
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Mecca
Wade Wilson
Posts: 25,086
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Post by Mecca on Mar 2, 2022 8:37:46 GMT -5
Some of these comments appear to be endorsing vigiliantism, which is a slippery slope and honestly nauseating. The Cult of the Child is a real thing. It’s in or about my generation that decided the world should be geared to children. George Carlin gonna weigh in on that...
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Post by Magic knows Black Lives Matter on Mar 2, 2022 8:39:25 GMT -5
My first thought was what on earth could make a dude as big as Cain pull out the strap but good lord. I understand his anger and I’m not really gonna say much more than that.
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Post by The Summer of Muskrat XVII on Mar 2, 2022 9:01:10 GMT -5
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on Mar 2, 2022 11:15:00 GMT -5
It's possible to recognize someone did something wrong while also empathizing with their motivation. We can also punish people accordingly depending on the context of the crime. Agreed Like you did the crime and you do the time. But also for me shit isn’t black and white and sometimes you got to do what you gotta do and know the consequences coming on your head But end of day it is always best to go through ever channel before being reckless. He got the wrong person despite everything
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on Mar 2, 2022 11:18:23 GMT -5
At the very least he’s going to jail for a good little while. That’s a calculated move Javaris Crittenton, former NBA Player shot and killed someone else by mistake and plead to 23 years
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Mar 2, 2022 11:31:20 GMT -5
At the very least he’s going to jail for a good little while. That’s a calculated move Javaris Crittenton, former NBA Player shot and killed someone else by mistake and plead to 23 years Counterpoint: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gary_Plauch%C3%A9Also, Javaris Crittenton very much killed someone intentionally, he just killed the wrong person. And it was gang related. These kinds of situations are extremely nuanced. Lot of moving parts, including the attitude of the judge, the attitude of the prosecutor, whether California law allows for any kind of probation on a violent offense, whether this gets taken to trial and there's a sympathetic jury, etc... He could get anything from community service to 30 years in prison for something like this. It's really way too early to tell.
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Post by Lizuka #BLM on Mar 2, 2022 11:37:21 GMT -5
I think a loooot of this will depend on how the judge approaches it, in particular whether or not the reason for the shooting is admissible given the victim had nothing to do with it as far as we know.
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Post by Captain Stud Muffin (BLM) on Mar 2, 2022 11:48:45 GMT -5
At the very least he’s going to jail for a good little while. That’s a calculated move Javaris Crittenton, former NBA Player shot and killed someone else by mistake and plead to 23 years Counterpoint: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gary_Plauch%C3%A9Also, Javaris Crittenton very much killed someone intentionally, he just killed the wrong person. And it was gang related. These kinds of situations are extremely nuanced. Lot of moving parts, including the attitude of the judge, the attitude of the prosecutor, whether California law allows for any kind of probation on a violent offense, whether this gets taken to trial and there's a sympathetic jury, etc... He could get anything from community service to 30 years in prison for something like this. It's really way too early to tell. Yeah that’s why I said “by mistake” for Javaris. It’s going be a take of two halves. His lawyers will present that he isn’t a violent man and has never been convicted of anything like this BUT it was still a calculated move which the defense will present We really won’t know until further details come out and how much was done. Did the cops know about the abuse? Was there proof? Etc…
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Post by Limity (BLM) on Mar 2, 2022 12:54:33 GMT -5
Counterpoint: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gary_Plauch%C3%A9Also, Javaris Crittenton very much killed someone intentionally, he just killed the wrong person. And it was gang related. These kinds of situations are extremely nuanced. Lot of moving parts, including the attitude of the judge, the attitude of the prosecutor, whether California law allows for any kind of probation on a violent offense, whether this gets taken to trial and there's a sympathetic jury, etc... He could get anything from community service to 30 years in prison for something like this. It's really way too early to tell. Yeah that’s why I said “by mistake” for Javaris. It’s going be a take of two halves. His lawyers will present that he isn’t a violent man and has never been convicted of anything like this BUT it was still a calculated move which the defense will present We really won’t know until further details come out and how much was done. Did the cops know about the abuse? Was there proof? Etc… Well the man was charged and arraigned and a judge gave him supervised release, so yes the cops did know.
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J. Hova
Don Corleone
Emotionally exhausted and morally bankrupt
Posts: 1,999
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Post by J. Hova on Mar 2, 2022 15:39:27 GMT -5
Listen, I'm not a huge fan of vigilantism, but I definitely understand this. It's unfortunate that someone not the perpetrator got hurt, but I doubt Cain was caring too much at the time and had one goal in mind. I highly doubt he does much time, if any, for this.
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Post by The Summer of Muskrat XVII on Mar 2, 2022 15:50:02 GMT -5
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Mar 2, 2022 15:53:18 GMT -5
Yeah...in my opinion he'd have a pretty strong defense if he just shot at/beat the guy actually charged with the sex offense. But, shooting into a vehicle with two other passengers and hitting the wrong person is a tougher sell. It's still incredibly early in the process and impossible to predict what will happen, but on the facts alone it's more difficult to defend than I initially thought it might be.
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Post by Mayonnaise on Mar 2, 2022 17:56:59 GMT -5
But that sympathy can't be translated into anything useful in court. It will be argued by his attorneys as a consideration or mitigating factor during sentencing, but he will be found guilty of murder, because he in fact committed murder. Which sucks, because my heart is with him 100% if the situation is true. I mean it can A lawyer can argue "crime of passion". If you can showcase pics and proof of the abuse and make it visual for the jurors then you play on that emotion. That is best he can hope for tho. Like I said on the flip side you can call it premeditated and he should have let the authorities handle it. It is going to be logic vs emotion and he has an uphill mountain to climb to dig out this hole Never rule out jury nullification either, unless he has to have a judge decide the case, I'm not sure.
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Post by Terry McConkey on Mar 2, 2022 18:03:21 GMT -5
I hope he goes to jail for a lonnnnngggg time. No sympathy. If it were an ordinary person, I'd say the same. Vigilantism can and does go wrong. Let the criminal justice system handle it.
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